RrCoX22
Registered Member
What route would be the recommended type of transmission for rocky trails and some occasionaly mud? On an '87+ are all K5's the 4L60 or did some come in manual? Wondering if a conversion would ever be needed.
CK5
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Manual Or Auto For Trails and Crawling?
- Thread starter RrCoX22
- Start date
Citizen Rider
1/2 ton status
IMO its preference. I think rocks would be a tricky place for manuals, but it is possible. Deffinatly a test of skill. Im still thinking about swapping in a sm465, we shall see how long my th350 lasts...
zero cool
1/2 ton status
The auto vs manual discussion has reached the level of holy war in some places. There's benefits and drawbacks to both. A lot of it depends on your style of wheeling. Assuming you're geared right and have a hand throttle of some kind, wheeling on rocks with a manual can be done all day. Personally, I like having the automatic and not having to mess with a clutch.
I actually prefer them to auto's in rocks. I was at 40:1 with an auto and 40's and I was not a fan at all. I'm currently at 100:1 with a manual and 40's and it's a little too high for my taste. My next rig will be 227:1 and 49's (manual) and I think it'll be just about perfect.
Autos are for girls, kids, and persons of lesser ability. IMO
MTMike
1/2 ton status
I absolutely loathe and detest having an auto in my trucks. I am in the process of swapping my 400 for a 465 right now
It is really all about preference though.
It is really all about preference though.
Citizen Rider
1/2 ton status
I will say i do not have experience offroad with a manual. But i drive a manual as a DD and i would think the clutch would be the tricky part. Now if you have a crazy low crawl ratio i know just letting the clutch out would be a peice of cake(much like my DD diesel). Maybe i over thought it?
Also, one of my biggest worries when i decided to rebuild my th350 and not go sm465 was how well does a clutch hold up in these situations?
Sorry to hijack.
m-4x4-chevy
Registered Member
I have had both a manual and an auto trans in my current chevy truck. The auto performs much better off road. The manual trans could not climb the waterfalls and steep obstacles nearly as well as the 700R4 auto. Others I wheel with have manual tranny's and their performance off-road is sad. You would have to get into a low granny NV4500 and t-case doubler to get the crawling and climbing ability and the overdrive (very important now) of the 700R4. I also hate the way a manual drives on the trail. Get a built 700R4, 4L60, or a 4L60E. Use those old junk SM-465's for boat anchores. Hey, why would anybody put in a trans without overdrive?
I run a 6.2 diesel, NV4500, 203, 205 and 4.56's with 40's. Previous to swapping that combo in I ran a 465/205 behind the 6.2 and took it to Blazer Bash in '03. You guys are overthinking the whole manual thing. In low range there is no need to feather the clutch out to get moving. Put it in gear, and let the clutch go...and that includes the really rough stuff.
Having the diesel makes a big difference though...I don't think it's possible to stall while in low range. If it ever did stall I'd just hit the key while in gear to restart. BFD.
I personally love the engine braking on the steep downhill stuff, and I never have to worry about tranny temps, coolers, lines blowing, etc etc.
If there is a disadvantage to the manual it would be in the mud. If you're not in the right gear you won't be able to shift fast enough up or down without losing momentum.
Rene
Having the diesel makes a big difference though...I don't think it's possible to stall while in low range. If it ever did stall I'd just hit the key while in gear to restart. BFD.
I personally love the engine braking on the steep downhill stuff, and I never have to worry about tranny temps, coolers, lines blowing, etc etc.
If there is a disadvantage to the manual it would be in the mud. If you're not in the right gear you won't be able to shift fast enough up or down without losing momentum.
Rene
Like Rene said, you guys are overthinking it. Yes, stock setup to stock setup an auto is probably going to be easier in the rocks. BUT, once you driven a manual with the right gears, I doubt one would go back.
I couldn't ever see wheeling a manual, even as much as I disliked the feeling of my K5. The second rig I built was a 4Runner with a manual, dual cases, 4.56's, and 40's. I did it because I needed a wheeling fix and putting an auto in one would have been a huge pain. It's still a little high for my liking but it's WORLDS better than the auto in the K5. Yes, I know it's apples to oranges.
When in the rocks, you let out the clutch, and just let it ride. If it starts to bog a little, you keep the RPM's just high enough to keep it from stalling out. If it's something really big and dumb, slip the clutch a little. I have to buy a very expensive clutch to bolt my current motor to my current trans, which is why I'm going to be in the 220:1 to 230:1 range, so I don't have to slip the clutch at all.
The thing that makes the biggest difference is that when you come up against a big rock with an auto, the TC slips, the tires stop. You give it enough gas to bring it up to stall speed and all of the sudden you're shooting up a rock and down the other side. With the manual, you pull up, and the tires just keep churning slowly, it turns into a very controlled process.
I really like the simplicity of it vs. an auto. Oh yeah, and I just plain like banging my own gears.
In moab I found it allowed me to "wheel elegantly" as opposed to some of the auto equipped rigs running ahead of me.
Rene
Rene
1967k10
1/2 ton status
I'll second this, my driving style changed DRAMATICALLY, just because I didn't need to be as hard on my rig as I used to to do the same stuff.
IIRC diesels also are regulated to idle at a certain RPM, no matter the fuel consumption requirements, that would help big time. If I can push around 40" Boggers on a 4,000-5,000 pound rig with a measly 22RE, a tired 305 or 6.2 certainly can.
It's funny, my clutch actually took the most abuse running to and from trails. In hi-hi first gear I would have to slip the clutch for 10-20 seconds to get all that rotating mass up to speed.
IIRC diesels also are regulated to idle at a certain RPM, no matter the fuel consumption requirements, that would help big time. If I can push around 40" Boggers on a 4,000-5,000 pound rig with a measly 22RE, a tired 305 or 6.2 certainly can.
It's funny, my clutch actually took the most abuse running to and from trails. In hi-hi first gear I would have to slip the clutch for 10-20 seconds to get all that rotating mass up to speed.
blowedupmotor87
1/2 ton status
I've got an 87 Jimmy, it was originally 350tbi/465/208/10 bolts. But, I never wheeled it like that. It's fixin to be 350tbi(new stock crate)/465(ORD short 32 shaft)/ORD 203 205 doubler/D60/14BFF (it's about 1/3-1/2 done right now), I've never wheeled a manual 
, we'll see what happens!
, we'll see what happens! 
Thunder
3/4 ton status
The main thing i like about autos is.. You never have to hand your beer to someone and say........." Hold this while I ....................."
With an Auto you can always have a beer safely clenched in one hand. Never having to rely on someone...who may be untrustworthy and drink your beer while you are not paying attention.
With an Auto you can always have a beer safely clenched in one hand. Never having to rely on someone...who may be untrustworthy and drink your beer while you are not paying attention.
George_Pimpdaddy
1/2 ton status
lol so true!
cdoggwsu
1/2 ton status
I couldn't imagine an auto on a trail rig...not enough control, especially for jake brakin' it.
