parking brake options.

[K5dreamer]

Ok, so ive started looking at what all parts i need to do the disk brake swap on my D70HD. And ive noticed, most sites list the 1975 3/4 ton front brake calipers and rotors as the ones to use, because they fit, and they are cheap. My question is, with 4 front brake calipers and rotors.... how does the parking brake work?

Ive read a few things about "caddilac" brake calipers, but no mention of application or where to get them, but it does seem that they are much more expensive. There has to be some other application that would work. What about the newer trucks with 14bff rears, wouldnt the disk brake setups from those be a relitively easy swap? and still retain the ebrake setup?

Its not a huge issue for now because i still have the TH400. But i do plan on doing the NV4500 swap at some point and will need some sort of emergency brake. Pinion brake maybe?

Im doing more reading as you read this, sitting on my bum at work, but figured if someone here already knew, it would save me some time.

 

[K5dreamer]

Rear disk brake swap - parking brake options.

1. Stock setup from newer 14 bolt or D70 axle... .with drum in disk Parking brake. may require some machining to fit everything together.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=483369&page=4

2. No ebrake - not really an option for a truck that see's street use.

3. Line lock - only works with an automatic? and bleeds down over time.

4. Calipers from the 1976-78 el dorado - combination hydrolic and mechanical calipers. expensive little farkers. $320 is nearly twice what i paid for my entire D70HD axle.

http://www.tsmmfg.com/2830.htm

http://www.off-road.com/trucks4x4/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=200819

https://www.4wdfactory.com/store/products/Cadillac-%28%2776-%252d%2778%29-Eldorado-E%252dbrake-Calipers.html

5. T-case brake - possibility, but without driveshafts wont work, which is really only an issue if im working on the truck, but still an issue.

6. Second set of manual calipers, with the cheap tried and true 3/4 ton front brake and rotors. Problem seems to be finding large enough manual calipers to fit the 1.3" thick rotors.

7. Anyone know if D60 rear brake calipers have a mechanical parking brake? or are they DID as well?

Unrelated random brake upgrade information.

http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/4runner/brakes/

3/4 ton brake rotor specs.

http://www.napaonline.com/MasterPag...escription=Brake+Rotor+Only+-+Front+-+Premium

 

[Hogback Fabrication]

Everyone that I know personally that has tried the Cadillac calipers has been disappointed in them. They simply don't hold very well (i.e. not much holding/clamping force). I've seen mixed results from people on this and other forums.

I have a line lock on my buggy, it works great (my truck is a 4 speed manual, BTW). You push down the brakes, flip the switch and the line lock will hold the pressure in the brakes (front or rear, depending on where you mount the line lock) until you flip it back off.

A line lock will hold MUCH more brake pressure than any OEM mechanical setup. They draw relatively little power and take a LONG time to bleed off IMO; I know I've accidentally left mine on for a week or two at a time and it was still holding strong and didn't kill the battery (or seem to affect it at all, for that matter).

Line locks are a great and cheap way to add a parking brake IMO, but they aren't a true emergency brake because they still rely on the hydraulics in the brake system to work.




Driveline e-brakes work well, their only real downfall is price. You point out that if your driveshafts fail they won't work; there's always something that can fail that can cause some other system to stop working. The cable could break with the stock e-brake setup.



Anyway, the bottom line is that you really can't trust any parking/emergency brake if the truck might roll into people. On the trail, always park on flat ground or keep the truck/wheels pointed away from people.

 

[K5dreamer]

well thats the second thing ive heard about the caddy calipers having less than thrilling clamping power. so i guess those are out.

as for the line lock, to me, the whole point of an ebrake is to be there when the hydraulics fail, or so you can work on the hydraulics, so thats out for my needs.

I realize the cable can break but that is such a rare occurance im not that worried. I guess after all that reading, Im down to one of three options.

1. T-case brake
2. find some sort of replacement for the caddy calipers that may clamp better.
3. install some form of second set of mechanical calipers, so i have two calipers per rotor. one hydraulic, one mechanical.

for the price of two sets of calipers, or some rare hard to find dual mode caliper with hydraulic and mechanical operation, i guess im leaning more towards a mechanical t-case brake. Time to start shopping i guess.

 

[cdoggwsu]

Is the caddy e-brake really that poor? I'm currently running a stock 10 bolt rear with an SM465 tranny and the e-brake is fine when the front of the truck is pointed downhill. When pointed with the rear end downhill the brakes don't hold nearly as well but from what I can tell the e-brake is adjusted almost all the way out at the equalizer so the pads are probably pretty worn (automatic adjuster in the drums froze up?) I can't imagine the caddy caliper clamping force can be worse than worn drums and I've managed alright, I just never turn my back to the truck when it's out of gear and the e-brake is on. I'll be staying with the drums at first when I swap in the 14 bolt but once those pads wear out I'll probably switch over to discs so I'm curious to hear what people have to say as well.

Really, for all intents and purposes the only time you'll really need the e-brake on a manual is when it's running and out of gear...how often does that happen? For me it's only when I get out to check something while the engine is running or to close the garage door, and I always keep a piece of 2x4 to chock a tire for extra insurance.

Assuming that whatever e-brake solution decided on is still less than stellar, how big of a deal is it to just put the truck in gear and turn it off while you're not sitting in it? No incline is going to be enough to overcome the compression of the engine.

 

[ryoken]

I'm definitely running Jesse's driveline brake... but yeah, pricey....

f*ck having those cables waiting to get ripped off down low... even "good working" caddy setups I've seen, seem "cheesy" to me.....

 

[kicker30]

Ive got a rear D60 with discs and ebrake sitting in front of my shed right now. Its out of a 2000 E350 and it is mechanical ebrake.

 

[jonathon]

I know on a lot of newer rigs the inside of the rotor hat is setup like a mini drum and the parking brake pushes the shoes into the drum.

FWIW.. I really don't see the stock parking brake being worth much in an emergency with big tires and a heavy as fock burb

When I do discs on my burb I'm thinking along the lines of a line lock as Chris suggested.

 

[bp71k5]

Just putting the trans in gear will keep the truck from moving on relatively flat ground. But on any kind of incline, mine will slowly move and turn the motor over and allow it to move. I have to keep it in reverse if I'm pointed uphill or 1st if I'm pointed downhill.

Anyone of those systems is better than nothing.

 

[K5dreamer]

Ive got a rear D60 with discs and ebrake sitting in front of my shed right now. Its out of a 2000 E350 and it is mechanical ebrake.

awesome, can you hook us up with some pics???? and maybe measure the rotor thickness on that rear end? wonder how hard those D60 calipers are to find at the junkyard. those ford workvans get run ragged.

 

[chulisohombre]

I'm definitely running Jesse's driveline brake... but yeah, pricey....

f*ck having those cables waiting to get ripped off down low... even "good working" caddy setups I've seen, seem "cheesy" to me.....

i turned my calipers upside down to keep the ebrake cable on the upper side.i also have 6 inch long softlines for to bleed the caliper i just spin it and put it on the rotor right side up til its bled good.then put back on the upside down way again.e brake is alright with caddy calipers.not the best but it hold enough to pass for being there and working ebrake for inspection.
if i had to do it over again though,i would do had shaft with his driveflange ebrake setup and 3/4 ton front calipers at all corners.it cost way more for the caddy calipers and ebrake brackets than it would for the driveshaft ebrake.i still need to redo my driveshaft for 1350 joint to the 14 bolt.the conversion joints dont seem to hold up very long.

 

[K5dreamer]

im definately leaning towards a driveline brake.

but am very curious about these rear D60 calipers with the mechanical e-brake. if they arent that expensive, and will fit the brackets for the 3/4 ton calipers, they sound like they'd be worth a try.

 

[ryoken]

i turned my calipers upside down to keep the ebrake cable on the upper side.i also have 6 inch long softlines for to bleed the caliper i just spin it and put it on the rotor right side up til its bled good.then put back on the upside down way again.e brake is alright with caddy calipers.not the best but it hold enough to pass for being there and working ebrake for inspection.
if i had to do it over again though,i would do had shaft with his driveflange ebrake setup and 3/4 ton front calipers at all corners.it cost way more for the caddy calipers and ebrake brackets than it would for the driveshaft ebrake.i still need to redo my driveshaft for 1350 joint to the 14 bolt.the conversion joints dont seem to hold up very long.

yeah, I'm going for killer shafts right now... needed the 1410 flanges anyway, perfect time to do it....

also with the interior custom stuff and cage, I'm going to a hand lever... so again, perfect time... I expect my cable to be no more than 2' or 3'.....

 

[chulisohombre]

hand lever for cutting brakes,or for a longer lever for to pul the brake tighter.i need to do something like a toyota under dash hand lever.the stock push pedal on the floor doesnt have a long enough throw to completely engage the cadillac calipers.i heard that the el dorado had a ratcheting style footbrake.which would make it easier to tighten the ebrake lines enough to work.im still trying to figure out what to do with it though.

 

[ryoken]

I'll probably just run the Lokar....

but I seem to remember seeing a pretty trick one from another company not too long ago... hafta look around..

 

[Desert Rat]

I have the TSM calipers and while they work well for general braking, they suck as a parking brake. I agree that the foot lever with the older style cable setup just doesn't put enough pressure on the pads to hold a heavy rig. My cables in the back are too long and I need to shorten them to be straighter but I don't think it is going to make that much difference. One of these days I will pony up for the driveline brake as long as it doesn't change the length of my rear driveshaft.

 

[kicker30]

awesome, can you hook us up with some pics???? and maybe measure the rotor thickness on that rear end? wonder how hard those D60 calipers are to find at the junkyard. those ford workvans get run ragged.

Ill get some pics tomorrow.

 

[chulisohombre]

lokar ones look nice.really clean upthe dash and billet aluminum looks tough.i may see if they have the throw that i need for mine.the 4 or 5 inches the stock one has isnt enough.

 

[K5dreamer]

Ill get some pics tomorrow.

i did a quick look online, and saw a ford D60 rear with disk brakes, but the mechanical linkage wasnt part of the caliper, it was a Drum in hat e-brake setup.

although, maybe that is the setup i need to run.

if thats the case though, i might just try to install factory D70 disk brakes, or 14bff disks from a newer truck. but that will probably cost more than a TC brake.

 

[chevyridinhigh79]

are the parking brakes on a new 14 bolt a drum in hat type or is the parking brake incorporated into the caliper like the el dorado calipers? also does anybody know if the axle flanges are the same on a newer 14 bolt as opposed to an older 14 bolt so you can just swap over the brackets, rotors, calipers, and e brake setup?