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Please help me troubleshoot

Madbomber88

Madbomber88

1/2 ton status
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When I got my 91 K5 earlier this year, it came with a 4" shackle flip with stock springs in the rear, ORD 4" spring lift in front, and both front and rears also had a 1" block, for a total of 5" of lift. It has 315-70/17 tires on it that are due to be replaced. It had a worn steering stabilizer and a front swaybar (with disconnect). The previous owner removed the quad shocks and was only running the long one. Shocks look to be very old. The steering was all over the place and downright dangerous...

When I got it up on my lift, it had the notorious frame crack behind the steering box, so I spend the next several weekends replacing the entire steering system, as follows with new:
  • PSC Steering gear
  • ORD weld on and bolt on frame brace, after welding up the cracks
  • ORD crossover steering kit
  • Heavy duty ORD ball joints
  • ORD Tie Rod and heavy duty tie rod ends
  • All wheel and spindle bearings
  • Rotors and pads
  • Borgeson U-joint at the steering box and steering column, with new steering shaft
  • Steering column lower bearing
  • Removed the blocks to drop the overall lift 1"
  • All new shocks and either replace the current shock position, which is apparently not the one it is supposed to be in if you are using only one, or replace the full quad shocks
I just had it in for an alignment and although they were not able to get the steering wheel aligned straight (separate issue), the truck tracks straight. With all that, the truck is still all over the place.

Trying to figure out where to start since everything I have read about people who have done the crossover kit, say that it was a huge difference, on and offroad, compared to the old design. The truck is so loose that I would not even consider taking it on the highway.

Here's what I am contemplating and am wondering what you all think I should do first:
  • Drop the lift down to 2-1/2 and reduce the tires to 33" just to get it lower to the ground? ORD custom springs front and rear.
  • Get the kit to reinstall the steering stabilizer (the ORD crossover kit said that it's not necessary, but I'm wondering if putting one back on would make a difference
  • Same as above with the sway bar
  • Get new tires (what is on there now are very worn and uneven), but I don't want to buy the same size if the overall lift is greatly contributing to the problem
I don't see any slop in the steering components when someone steers left and right when I am underneath looking at everything
There is a lot of body roll when you are parked and steer left and right, if that means anything. It looks like the front spring shackles are twisting quite a bit.

Anyway, I know this is a long post, but I don't want the throw good money at bad, or buy the same size tires if the answer is to bring the overall height down. I know several people that have had K5s with 35s and had nice tight steering, so I know something is off.

This is my third 88-91 K5, so I'm not new to the trucks, but the last two I had on 32s with no lift, so hard to compare.
Thanks in advance

IMG_4898.jpeg
 
Start with the basics.
What is the toe in set at?
Are the axle U-bolts tight?
Is there slop in the spring hangers? This can be hard to spot sitting on the ground not moving. Have someone drive it slowly on pavement, rotating the steering wheel, as you watch the springs at the hangers.
 
Ok one thing at a time
Lots of new parts, check that all of them are tight and properly fastened

Tighten the leaf spring bolts on both ends, and check the bushings in the springs


Stock location shocks are ok. Dual shocks are a fallacy, a good single shock will do

There are a few checks for the amount of preload on the ball joints on the axles knuckles. If those are loose, than it will wander
 
Check that the wheel base is the same length on both sides. Sometimes the axle pins shear and the axle moves. Usually there are marks on the springs if that’s the case
 
As far as tire size, I’ve used all the above stuff you have, with longer front and rear leafs and 37s without issues

I think we will find something loose or out of spec. Just be methodical
 
Bent77 said:
Ok one thing at a time
Lots of new parts, check that all of them are tight and properly fastened

Tighten the leaf spring bolts on both ends, and check the bushings in the springs


Stock location shocks are ok. Dual shocks are a fallacy, a good single shock will do

There are a few checks for the amount of preload on the ball joints on the axles knuckles. If those are loose, than it will wander
Click to expand...
This is a factory front quad shock blazer. The previous owner was just running one on each side.
 
Sounds like you have everything done right. 4" lift shouldn't compromise that caster that much, to be scary at highway speeds.
Yes what is the toe set at ? should be on alignment sheet. I have mine set almost straight ATM. How much air pressure in your front tires? over inflation can help it follow flaws in the road.
The steering stabilizer is not for squirrely steering correction. It is to soften the bump steer felt by the driver.
The front spring rear shackles are how long ?
Do check the wheel base for pin shear, also retorque the u bolts if you find the pins are good. Front and rear.
When the ball joints were done was the knuckle turning force measured. Not having the proper preload on the ball joints can have a great effect on the steering
 
Last edited:
Bent77 said:
That’s ok. The newer shocks are better than 1990s technology
Click to expand...
Yes this. Plus multi shocks were a fad back then I am sure this was a marketing thing for GM. The quad shocks should be non gas charged oil shocks. Multi shocks do have use, for huge heavy tires.
In theory if you could a glass smooth road you wouldn't need shocks at all, so your steering issue is not shock related. The shocks are to control tire bounce and have some effect on braking performance.
 
The lift height shouldn't be the issue. Something is still out of spec. My K5 is on a 37" tire with the ORD crossover steering, no sway bar and no steering stabilizer. One finger on the steering wheel driving at 75 mph. Toe set with a tape measure. You must still have some worn bushings or an issue with the front axle that you haven't found yet.
What's the caster like on the alignment sheet?
Pic looks like D60 hubs, have you been into the knuckles/king pins?
I had some brutal death wobble once that was simply caused by used 38" bias swampers. New Toyos ran nice and smooth without changing anything else.
 
Picture shows 6 lug wheels, so I would assume stock 10 bolt front axle.
OP listed new HD ball joints, but we all know how new parts can be nowadays.
 
6872xtc said:
Picture shows 6 lug wheels, so I would assume stock 10 bolt front axle.
OP listed new HD ball joints, but we all know how new parts can be nowadays.
Click to expand...
Yep, didn't look close enough. Those 10 bolt hubs look just like the stock 60 hubs.
 
Wes Harden said:
Sounds like you have everything done right. 4" lift shouldn't compromise that caster that much, to be scary at highway speeds.
Yes what is the toe set at ? should be on alignment sheet. I have mine set almost straight ATM. How much air pressure in your front tires? over inflation can help it follow flaws in the road.
The steering stabilizer is not for squirrely steering correction. It is to soften the bump steer felt by the driver.
The front spring rear shackles are how long ?
Do check the wheel base for pin shear, also retorque the u bolts if you find the pins are good. Front and rear.
When the ball joints were done was the knuckle turning force measured. Not having the proper preload on the ball joints can have a great effect on the steering
Click to expand...
I will have to check the shackle lengths. They look to be stock length, but I don't think they are original as they have zerks for greasing. I will check and measure. I did not measure the knuckle turning force when I did the ball joints. Is there a procedure for that. I set everything to the specs in the manual, but this was not mentioned (that I saw). The passenger side is a new Reid Racing knuckle with the studs for the crossover. The driver side is stock.
 
Wes Harden said:
Yes this. Plus multi shocks were a fad back then I am sure this was a marketing thing for GM. The quad shocks should be non gas charged oil shocks. Multi shocks do have use, for huge heavy tires.
In theory if you could a glass smooth road you wouldn't need shocks at all, so your steering issue is not shock related. The shocks are to control tire bounce and have some effect on braking performance.
Click to expand...
I thought the shocks might be part of the issue as there is a huge body roll when you steer, but it dampens after you bring it back to straight (if that makes sense). Do you all agree that if only one shock is used on the front, that it should be in the rear position? I found that topic on a thread search and that seemed to be the answer. If so, what's on their now is wrong. Not saying that's a huge contributing factor.
 
HankScorpio said:
The lift height shouldn't be the issue. Something is still out of spec. My K5 is on a 37" tire with the ORD crossover steering, no sway bar and no steering stabilizer. One finger on the steering wheel driving at 75 mph. Toe set with a tape measure. You must still have some worn bushings or an issue with the front axle that you haven't found yet.
What's the caster like on the alignment sheet?
Pic looks like D60 hubs, have you been into the knuckles/king pins?
I had some brutal death wobble once that was simply caused by used 38" bias swampers. New Toyos ran nice and smooth without changing anything else.
Click to expand...
It's the stock 10 bolt, thought a D60 would be very nice. I did not replace anything in the hubs, just packed the grease. I will throw it up on my lift this week to check U-bolts and pin sheer.
 
6872xtc said:
Picture shows 6 lug wheels, so I would assume stock 10 bolt front axle.
OP listed new HD ball joints, but we all know how new parts can be nowadays.
Click to expand...
Very true, but these are ORD, and I've never had a problem with them before. I may reach out to them for ideas too.
 
I believe the body roll may be from the tire changing chamber though the radius of steering input if the truck is stationary.
The longest distance between mounting point the better. Direction of axle travel as well
 
Lack of Shock can aid in the body roll, especially if the are away from the center of the arc of travel enough that they lose their leverage

In that aspect, straight above axle is King
 
I should also mention that it turns to the right much quicker than it turns to the left…in case that means anything
 
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