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Subframe?

Re: Here\'s what I mean....

So, if you want more than a 7" drop and drive it, go mustang II with drop spindles. Airbags won't get you much lower unless your parked or don't care about damage and increased tire wear. By the way, I've heard that dropped spindles and dropped A arms don't mix. Not sure why, just what I heard. My goal is to drive my truck every day so 7" is plenty up front. On the rear, if you go more than 6" (maybe less) you'll have to do something with your bed.

70 Jimmy, 454, 2wd
56 GMC, Big Window
 
Only if....

Only if you go with fixed suspension. If you are going to build, or rebuild the front suspension, I highly reccommend bagging it. Sooner or later you are going to wish you did, so why not do it now. The concerns about it being relaible for a driver are null if you just take the time to make sure the system is done right. All that requires, is the same forethought that you will probably be using on a fixed drop. I mean you didn't come on here asking about the cheapest, easiest, or quickest way to get the job done, so you are probably going to try to do it right the first time. I feel bags give you the best of both worlds. You can go low for cruising, or profiling, and raise it up to drive. Now is that cool or what?
The reason you don't want to mix spindles, and dropped A-arms is safety. What you will wind up with is a spring pocket that hangs lower than your rim. If you aren't already ahead of me here, that means if you have a flat, your spring pocket will make contact with the road instead of your wheel. This can cause you to loose steering control, and of course thats not a good thing. In some states it's actually a law that nothing can hang below the "scrub" line...

<font color=purple>N2TRUX<font color=purple>
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://n2trux.coloradok5.com/>http://n2trux.coloradok5.com/</A>
 
Re: Only if....

Cool, thanks for the answer on the a arm/spindle Q. Since bagging is rather expensive (in kit form), my plan is to wait. While Husker and Capt may be able to "spring" for the dough, I can't right now. I'll use springs now, and later I'll buy bags and build spacers/adapters. I don't think that there is much, if any, mods to the a arms. Any insight to this?

70 Jimmy, 454, 2wd
56 GMC, Big Window
 
So far....

So far, me personally I have:
4 bags = 62 x 4 = $248
miscellaneous metal (for 2 trucks) = less than $100
Spindles = $150
Used AirRide setup- guage, switches, tank, valves = $250
Personally, I don't see the cost difference.

The pics above are of my bagged trucks crossmember.
You ain't gonna get lower than that! As far as bag vs springs, you aren't thinking in correct terms. An airbag IS a spring. You can make it as low as you want an still have the same ride quality, but with springs, you are limited to your height. In essence, your limiting factor of going low isn't springs or bags, it is the body, like Ken said. You are pretty much going to have to mod ANY truck for full suspension travel after about 5" front and 7" rear. For the front, you will have to modify the inner fenders, for the rear you will have to notch the frame. Otherwise, you will be hitting. You get lower than 7" in front, and you will be cutting the A/C box to clear the tire.
bagged4.jpg

Notice the clearance above the passenger front tire at the heater box.

For the rear, after about 7" you are going to have to cut into the body tub so the differential will clear the body.

Chris Lucas
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.captkaoscustoms.com>http://www.captkaoscustoms.com</A>
 
Re: So far....

I am thinking in correct terms. Your right, airbags are springs. My point is that there is a misconception that they are able to "ride lower" While they do give a better ride at any height, your A arms and crossmember are you limiting factor, bag or spring (coil). As far as cost, your reference is for 73 up trucks mine is 67-72. While the Air ride setup is the same, the spindles are $100 more. You can modify your A arms to accept 73 up ball joints and therefore cheaper spindles. Also, Air ride (http://www.ridetech.com/CATALOG/CATALOG14.HTM )shows $499 for the front kit. I don't see used Air ride for our trucks very often (once in a year). I plan on making my own. I should have less than $300 with pump and tank, valves and gauges etc. Before that I'll still be into it $260.00 for drop spindles and $0 for cut springs(temporary) $80 if I buy new lowered and $0 for notched xmember. By the way, I like the rims, what are they?

70 Jimmy, 454, 2wd
56 GMC, Big Window
 
Actually...

I am talking 67-87 trucks. The brackets I have made can be used on 67-72's and 73-87's. I am using a set on my truck and a friend (the more that one reference) is using them on his '70 model.
I didn't buy a kit from AirRide, only the valves. He didn't have a use for the switches, guages and tank, so he gave them to me for $50. The only thing specail was the valves.
What you need to do since you have a '70 K5 is when you get an extra crossmemeber to chop, use the 73-87 version with the better A-arms and with disc and you will come out ahead in both directions. You will be able to get the cheaper spindles and probably cheaper discs/brake related stuff. The crossmembers will bolt right up to what you have. You should also be able to swap control arms.
As far as valves go, do go the cheap route and get non-application vavles. Spend the extra money and either get AirRides or Easy Streets valves.

Thanks for the compliments on the rims. They are 94-96 17" Impala SS wheels


Chris Lucas
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.captkaoscustoms.com>http://www.captkaoscustoms.com</A>
 
Re: Actually...

Yeah, I found out all of this the day after I bought a 72 crossmember disc to disc and all the rebuild parts for it. I'm kinda committed, though the price of 73 up stuff is getting cheaper by the month. Maybe I'll go that route.

70 Jimmy, 454, 2wd
56 GMC, Big Window
 
Re: Actually...

Capt,

Is there any way I could get a drawing or a picture of the brackets you've made? It always makes it easier if I can leverage off work already done. I plan on making some up and taking pics so others don't have to reinvent.

70 Jimmy, 454, 2wd
56 GMC, Big Window
 
Sure==>

Sure, send me an email and I will send you pics of the brackets I have so far. [email protected]
For a small fee, I will build you some.

Chris Lucas
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.captkaoscustoms.com>http://www.captkaoscustoms.com</A>
 
Crusher man...

Chris beat me to the reply. I was going to tell you that he built a couple of systems pretty cheap. I went the over priced kit route, only because at the time it was all new to me. I wanted to make sure I was getting something that would work. When I do another truck, I will build it, or have it built.Chris is also correct(excluding typo's) in that you can get bags from just about anywhere (EXCEPT AIM), make your own notch, brackets, and plates, even get by with a Wal-Mart air tank. The one place you don't want to cheese on, is the valves. They are the heart of the system, and can cause more grief than you can stand, if you try to use non-bubble tight valves.
On the ride discussion, the BIG advantage of having an "adjustable" suspension is just that. It is adjustable. It's true you can't blast down the freeway with it all the way down, but you sure can drop and roll at the local cruise scene...

<font color=purple>N2TRUX<font color=purple>
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://n2trux.coloradok5.com/>http://n2trux.coloradok5.com/</A>
 
Re: Crusher man...

Thanks for the advice on the valves guys. I am planning to use the brand I use at work, only the 12vdc version not the 24vdc. The company rep has already promise to sell them to me at the same discount and the quality is better than anything out there. As far as tanks go, I was thinking of fabricating my own. I want them to go down the frame rails. What do you think?

70 Jimmy, 454, 2wd
56 GMC, Big Window
 
I am sure you can....

I am sure if you post your crossmember on the 67-72 board under the parts section you can probably sell it. Here is the link: http://www.captkaoscustoms.com
 
Air tanks and valves...

As far as airtanks go, I don't think you can beat some of the prices that are offered right now. Plus, unless you are an EXCELLENTwelder and trust your welds to 150psi, I wouldn't make a pressure vessel. Some of the places that have good variations of tanks are:
http://www.onboardair.com New the bottom of the page
http://www.captkaoscustoms.com
 
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