lak2004
1/2 ton status
ok got the new bask gasket on and tv cable set, running a little better. still rich though. hopefully going to my buddies house to use his laptop for a couple of days and get some data logged.
CK5
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tbi running rich-now with codes!
- Thread starter lak2004
- Start date
You said you had some smoke coming out of the tail pipe at high idle. Blue smoke out the tail pipe is a good indicator that you may have leaking piston seals and/or leaking valve seals. I would suggest doing a cylinder leak test. Excessive amounts of oil in your engine can cause piston rings and seals to fail. Also, what is your engine running rich in? HC? CO? Do you have an emissions reading? This can also help with diagnosis.
lak2004
1/2 ton status
no emissions here. it is burning too much fuel. the smoke was black and it went away after i changed the tb base gasket yesterday.
lak2004
1/2 ton status
Data
Finally got some data logged so now how should I post it? I have the logs saved in Excel 07. Any ideas? Thanks
Finally got some data logged so now how should I post it? I have the logs saved in Excel 07. Any ideas? Thanks
dave w
1/2 ton status
I file share (MS Word, MS Excel, .BIN and such) using FREE MediaFire; http://www.mediafire.com/whats_new.php Set up an account and post the link to your data log on MediaFire. My MediaFire files are here: http://www.mediafire.com/myfiles.php
dave w
dave w
lak2004
1/2 ton status
Ok here are the logs i did. All were not while driving because the laptop battery was too low. So I just did them while parked and ran through the RPM range a few times. Let me know what the hell all this means 
Thanks guys!
http://www.mediafire.com/?mznmk3omtnl
http://www.mediafire.com/?czmd3mwi2zd
http://www.mediafire.com/?ntghq0umoky
Thanks guys!http://www.mediafire.com/?mznmk3omtnl
http://www.mediafire.com/?czmd3mwi2zd
http://www.mediafire.com/?ntghq0umoky
dave w
1/2 ton status
I have organized the 3rd log. http://www.mediafire.com/?mwmnkmdny2g I think the organized file will help? I don't have much time at the moment to analyze the three logs. I'm am wondering about the TPS in log 3????? What's up with the -.3 volts?????
dave w
dave w
Colotow
Registered Member
also double check the temp sensor and wires, if it's disconnected or bad, the computer is trying to keep it rich until it warms up.
any chance the TPS moved out of adjustment? or, if it went bad, some systems will go into a limp home mode.
any chance the TPS moved out of adjustment? or, if it went bad, some systems will go into a limp home mode.
dave w
1/2 ton status
The files show the temp sensor is reading good, about 170 degrees / average in the three files.
The files show TPS angle / not volts, so I wonder why -0.3 at idle. It could be OK to have a -0.3 at idle. I noticed the files show changes in TPS ... at about 34 degrees at 2050 RPM.
Colotow
Registered Member
I'm no expert, so it's just something else to check
digital (not analog) multimeter, mine it's the center and bottom of the 3 wires. should be 0.5-0.7 v at idle, going up to 5v at wide open, and as you cycle the throttle it should be smooth. I just had to replace the TPS on my projection, it was good at idle and off-idle, but had a couple dead spots in it in the middle. I've been chasing problems with running rich and overheating on it. Checking the temp sensor was one of the things the Holley techs said to check on mine.
Only other thing I can think of is an exhaust leak, if it's drawing in air before the sensor, it will try to richen the mixture thinking the engine is running lean.
With the vacuum leaks you found, it could have caused a lean misfire in individual cyl's, so there would have been "unused" air going into the exhaust stream, causing the computer to richen things up.
Good luck, hope you get it figured out. Mine's awesome when it runs right, and a royal pain when it don't!
digital (not analog) multimeter, mine it's the center and bottom of the 3 wires. should be 0.5-0.7 v at idle, going up to 5v at wide open, and as you cycle the throttle it should be smooth. I just had to replace the TPS on my projection, it was good at idle and off-idle, but had a couple dead spots in it in the middle. I've been chasing problems with running rich and overheating on it. Checking the temp sensor was one of the things the Holley techs said to check on mine.
Only other thing I can think of is an exhaust leak, if it's drawing in air before the sensor, it will try to richen the mixture thinking the engine is running lean.
With the vacuum leaks you found, it could have caused a lean misfire in individual cyl's, so there would have been "unused" air going into the exhaust stream, causing the computer to richen things up.
Good luck, hope you get it figured out. Mine's awesome when it runs right, and a royal pain when it don't!
dave w
1/2 ton status
Trouble shooting over a keyboard is difficult. Having a data log files to look at is a better way to see what is going on, without being next to the engine. It's takes several hours, maybe even days, to figure out how to get a data log and be able to share the data log information with other.
I've looked at the files, the BLM numbers are averaging below 128 (about 123 ~ 124), so that means the engine is running rich. A BLM of 128 is not rich / not lean. Usually a number between 126 ~ 130 is good.
dave w
I've looked at the files, the BLM numbers are averaging below 128 (about 123 ~ 124), so that means the engine is running rich. A BLM of 128 is not rich / not lean. Usually a number between 126 ~ 130 is good.
dave w
lak2004
1/2 ton status
so now what should I try?? send the files to tbichips.com and have them burn a chip or ??? should I try another program like tunerpro. i have no idea what any of this stuff means
dave w
1/2 ton status
so now what should I try?? send the files to tbichips.com and have them burn a chip or ??? should I try another program like tunerpro. i have no idea what any of this stuff means
I think, the files I downloaded were not long enough to "tune" a chip. The most important stuff to figure out is BLM, MAP, and RPM to "tune" a chip. The ECM controls the fuel by knowing what the BLM, MAP and RPM are.
BLM - In a nutshell, the Block Learn Multiplier (BLM) is the long term fuel adjustment that the ECM "learns" to keep the air/fuel ratio within acceptable parameters. Ideally a BLM of 128 is what the PROM is "tuned" for. Lower BLM of 128 is Rich, Higher BLM of 128 is Lean.
MAP - Manifold Absolute Pressure - Is engine main vacuum. GM converted to the metric system for measuring engine vacuum so the metric measurement of vacuum is Kpa (Kilo Pascals). Wide Open Throttle is usually close to 100 Kpa. Most engines with a stock cam have an idle vacuum of 35 ~ 40 Kpa.
RPM - I think everyone knows.
As the engine runs the ECM is changing the fuel signal to the injectors by knowing what the MAP and RPM are. If something is wrong with the any of the sensors, or the engine has a vacuum leak, the ECM will send the wrong signal to the injectors.
I usually data log for at least 20 minutes while driving at different speeds, some freeway / highway and city / in town stop and go. I'm also close to a few 5000+ feet mountains passes. It's not necessary to tune a chip for mile high+ driving, but is nice.
dave w
lak2004
1/2 ton status
yea I live in Durango, CO so we have a bunch of passes and our altitude here is 6500ft. So doing some mtn driving is easy enough. i just read the advice on tbichips.com on how he wants data logged in windows vista, so i will try that when i can borrow my buddies laptop again
Before you start mailing data and chips look into changing the socket on the ECM to 28 pin. Then you can install a much better chip that can be erased and programmed with no UV eraser...
If you can't solder mail it to me...
If you can't solder mail it to me...
dave w
1/2 ton status
Here is the tutorial (link) for adapting a 28 pin chip to a 7747 ECM. http://www.moates.net/documentation.php?documentation_id=10
dave w
dave w
1/2 ton status
Southwest - Washington, just north of Portland Oregon. I'm just across the I-205 bridge crossing the Columbia River in Clark County Washington.
dave w
lak2004
1/2 ton status
So would I be able to burn my own chips if I do this? Can I still use the chip in it now if I do the mod? thanks
dave w
1/2 ton status
You can burn 28 pin chips (27SF512) using the Moates.net Burn2 http://www.moates.net/product_info.php?cPath=64&products_id=197
The original chip for a 7747 is a 24 pin chip. If you modify the 7747 ECM EXACTLY like the tutorial in this link http://www.moates.net/documentation.php?documentation_id=10 you can use the 24 pin chip, AFTER removing the 24 pin chip from the OEM chip holder. It's EXTREMELY EASY to DESTROY a 24 pin chip when removing the 24 pin chip from the OEM chip holder. Using the Moates.net G2 adapter http://www.moates.net/product_info.php?cPath=64&products_id=36 is not needed if you use a 24 pin chip.
Removing the old OEM chip holder from the 7747 and updating to a common / standard 24 pin chip socket is the BEST option for do it yourself chip programming.
dave
