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tranny swap opinions, yea or nay, also other ramblings

supersize75k5

supersize75k5

OrganDonorRacing.com
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gilbert az
I have just about thrown my hands in the air on what to do with these two blazers.

I took the 75 out this weekend, to say the least I was so disapointed and unhappy with it, when I got home to Kristians I cleared out the garage and parked it. I think I will leave it that way for a while too.


Also..it fits in a garage now!...

"after the body drop" /forums/images/graemlins/deal.gif /forums/images/graemlins/woot.gif

The truck just plained sucked, no weight in rear, 454 and a lack of a front shaft = alot of stucks. Not to mention the stupid thing is way to freaking loud, "my ear are still hearing the BB."

seems I have my trucks all mixed up,..

the 75 has awsome power now, tranny seems to be holding but may need some help as it had metal shavings after my last monthly fluid change. Seems to have held up but when I had it built it was just under 1800.00 bucks and I dont want to go through that any time soon. Considering what I have put it through I am happy with it, but it leaks like a sob now, and every time I get rear fleexed out it leaks bad between the motor and tranny. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

motor and tranny mounts"? or bad seal? /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

I also dont have any low gear to speak of, a t-400/203 and 4.56 gears are not impressing me. I have a guy selling me a doubler but it is taking a while, plus I need to get new tires, so I would be dumping even more into this money hole in deep space /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif Then there is the 35 spline upgrade and duel flanged d-shafts...

that is alot of coin..

then there is the 86, that is slow as a dog, but has a kick a$$ low range "sm465", but the carb is junk so I am looking into swapping it to an Hei distibuter and a new q-jet..

sad that I want to wheel my daily driver more than the 75, the 86 has 1 ton eaton rear, 3/4 ton front and lockers, lifted and on 35's.

This just sucks, sometimes I wish I should have sold the 75 when she was all purdy and got some good $$$ out of it, I had offers I just was too busy humping the new paint /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif

I dunno, would you guys swap in a hydro sm 465 or spend the money and put a doubler in and get the new tires?

seems I would rather cruise the 75 and wheel the daily driver... /forums/images/graemlins/1zhelp.gif /forums/images/graemlins/doah.gif
 
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I also dont have any low gear to speak of, a t-400/203 and 4.56 gears are not impressing me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you serious ? With a big block and no weight /forums/images/graemlins/yikes.gif Put a front driveshaft on before you go wheeling. With four tires spinning youd have better gearing, and not get stuck. I'd be happy with that drivetrain . Besides if I can turn 33's with a 305 and 3.08's, theres no reason the 454-4.56-38's wouldn't work. /forums/images/graemlins/k5.gif
 
I don't want to try an be a dick but seriously think about what you do to your truck. The tranny is shot because of neutral drops and hard driving. The tires are shot because you smoke them so much. Super Swampers don't like to last very long under normal street driving but when you do things like neutral drops, full throttle reverse to smoke the tires, etc what do you really expect is going to happen? /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

As for the tranny setup and gearing. Stay with the TH400. Get the doubler and call it a day. The SM465 is a good tranny and has ok low range, but you have never driven anything with real lowrange.

The 465's you have driven came with a 208 case. I will tell you right now a 208 WILL NOT hold up to your driving style. If you use a 205 behind a 465 you low range will suck again. Get the doubler, rebuild the TH400 right and take care of it.

We had a talk about this if you don't recall. Your driving style is hard on parts to say the least. If you really want things to last then take care of them and calm/change your driving style. If you don't then expect to keep paying big $$$$ all the time.

If you want any info, ideas, thoughts, give me a call.

Harley
 
Not that I ever chime in on your posts, but I think you need to really think about what you want out of both your wheeling truck and daily driver truck. You seem to jump around very quickly from one set-up to the next (as we all have seen in the last 6 months). Sounds like your 75 is not done yet (or redone) but you are out wheeling it anyways and then coming home dissappointed. Well yeah, theres no front driveline /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif , I think that makes a big difference when it comes to how well it wheels /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Anyways, if you are like a lot of us around here, you probably don't have endless money to build your truck with, so give things some thought, and don't rush. You seem like the I want it to be perfect tomorrow type, but its gonna take time. Plan it out, and follow the plan. Get it done, wheel it some, and then decide if its what you wanted or not. Truck should be for your liking anyways, not to impress your friends and everyone in town. Just my 2 cents anyways /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
 
you lightened the back up too much compared to the front so what, pull the big block and put it in your daily driver, then learn to stay off the throttle!!! I learned, it was hard but I learned(3 months without a license and $300 a month insurance does that). Then put the smallblock in the 75, work on a fuel injection setup, put in the doubler and new tires, and you will have a real wheeler you will love. And yes if you are dissapointed with its performance in 2wd thats your own dumb fault. 4.56s with 38s or 39.5s will be perfect with a doubler. Consider puting the radiator in the back as well, will lighten the front end and add some rear weight. When I was building the buggy, I was striving for as close to a 50/50 weight bias as possible.
 
Harley I hear ya man, but the whole point of having a second blazer was so if I break the 75, it is not a huge deal. I know I am hard on it, so I bought a second blazer. It just sucks because if I knew what I know now I would have gone a different route.

I will get back into it in a couple of weeks I guess, it is just apalling to try and save for a house of my own and then realize how much I put into these trucks.

seems I want the big bad blazer for the street and the nice and quiet one for the trails, I am shure once I get some bugs worked out and get to play with the lockers and have a front shaft I will be happy..


I hope!

Looks like the doubler will have to happen to make it what I want /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif


As for the driving style I have tonned it down BIG time, I cant recall any neutral drops latly /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif Hell I even got to change oil instead of changing a motor out for once /forums/images/graemlins/yikes.gif /forums/images/graemlins/woot.gif.... /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

looks like trucks4me said it best..

[ QUOTE ]
Sounds like your 75 is not done yet (or redone) but you are out wheeling it anyways and then coming home dissappointed.

[/ QUOTE ]


just jumped the gun /forums/images/graemlins/thumb.gif
 
What the hell did you pay $1800 for a TH 400 for?

Next time, pull it, ship it to me, send me $500 and I'll send it back to you completely rebuilt.

$1800 for a TH 400? That is robbery.

As to whoever suggested a TH 400 + doubler for better crawl ratio than a 465, or implied that the crawl ratio on a 465/205 combo sucks:

2.48 x 1.98 x 1.96 x 4.56 = 43.89:1
6.55 x 1.96 x 4.56 = 58.54:1 /forums/images/graemlins/eek.gif
 
There is one little thing that an auto has over a manaul. The torque converter. It tends to multiply torque.

The actual number of the crawl ratio of a manual might be lower but the torque converter more then makes up for the difference.

If you know anything about Arizona you know that this state is a rock crawling state. If you bring a truck with a manual and only a 205 in here you will look foolish. The guy with the "less crawl ratio" in his th400 and doubler will spank you all day everyday.

The TH400 & doubler will outcrawl the 465/205. If you want to crawl rocks with a manual you better have a doubler behind it and a driver with some quick feet and a hand throttle. You need 100-120:1 with a manual in the rocks.

For most types of wheeling a 465/205 is fine but not on the rocks. It may cut it with the Jeep guys or the Toyota guys but here in AZ you will struggle with only one transfer case.

Harley
 
There is a 30% difference there. The automatic guys can argue that the torque converter helps, but the degree in which it helps is questionable. It can be said that an auto has an infinite crawl ratio because you can be in gear and the engine not stall even if you're not moving. So, engine is turning, and you're in gear, but you're completely stopped. In theory, that crawl ratio would be infinite.

Back in the real world....

I don't have enough experience on rocks to cry BS, but I can say that in the slow speed stuff I've done, I've never ached for 100-120:1. In fact, I think with the shock loading of a clutch, a doubler with a 465 would have serious potential to be destructive to drivetrain components.

Although your preference should detirmine what transmission you use, and both the TH 400 and SM 465 are good choices, I think your statements that a 400/doubler combo will stomp all over a 465/205 combo is questionable at the very minimum.

465/208 with 4.56 nets nearly double the crawl ratio of a 400/doubler combo and I personally refuse to say that an automatic with would stomp all over that without seeing the two in action.

As you know, I'm biased. I'm very pro-manual, but I definitely have learned it's just not for everybody. If it is for you though, and a manual is what you want, I think that a 465/205 will crawl just as well as a 400 with a doubler.

This can become an endless debate, but I definitely disagree with you. Either you've never driven an SM 465/NP 205 combo in slow speed stuff or you simply refuse to deny its capability.

Either way, I think your implication that a 465/205 will not crawl as well as a 400/doubler is false, but like I said above, I don't have enough experience with either combo to cry BS.

My personal experience was going from a 32:1 automatic combo to a 53:1 manual, and I think that was a night and day improvement myself.

The hydro clutch just makes it all that much sweeter!!
 
I will say that I don't have alot of personal experience crawiling a manual. This could definitly be an endless debate. I will also qualify my statement with this too. Your auto has to be setup to crawl rocks too. I don't know how your auto with the 32:1 was built but my auto with 36:1 was built for the rocks. A low stall converter makes the world of difference. If you has a stock or higher stall converter in your truck then you wouldn't get the full affect of the auto's crawl. I run a 1200 stall converter and other guys run lower stalls then that. The converter is the key to the crawl.

I have seen some wheeled though and talked to alot of people that wheel them. Alot give up on the manual for the rocks and go to an auto.

I have seen a 465/205 combo in action in the Potent Rodent. We were up on the side of a mountain one night and he had to crawl past me on a trail. He was having all kinds of problems getting on and over this rock because the manual didn't have enough gear ratio to get him over without having to use more gas then he would have liked. He had a 496. You would think that with that much torque and a 465/205 would have crawled right past. Nope. Shawn now is switching to a 4L80E with a doubler and a WMS 3:1.

I have driven my roommates old F250 with a NP435/205. The low range was pretty good but I honestly don't believe it would be enough for the rocks in AZ. You would be trying to use too much throtle to climb things or you would have to roll into them alot faster then you want to. For most other types of 4 wheeling the 435/205 in that truck would be great though.

I am currently running an auto in my truck and like the way the 700R4/208 works with my 4.56's. It crawls pretty damn well. If this 700R4 goes out I am pretty much desided on a 465/208. I know I will gain actual crawl ratio but my truck will not crawl as well because the torque converter effect.

A friend of mine has both an auto and manual setup. Th350 & doubler, and 465/208. Even with the 208 he tells me the th350 doubler outcrawls the 465. He said bottom line you need more gear then a 465/208. The 208 has more gear then the 205 so /forums/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
************************
Back to Shawn's post.

Get the doubler, get a TH400 rebuilt with a 1000 stall. Have it built right, take care of it, and take it easy on the skinny pedal. Once you get a doubler in you will hardly need to use the skinny pedal. And trust me with that much gear and that much torque from the big block you won't want too. The bill for the new parts to replace the ones you broke will be quite large.

Harley

P.S. It is not the goal of rock crawling to see how many parts you can break, it is to go offroad and have fun. You carry spare parts just in case but the goal is not to use them.
 
What about a 465 wif a doubler.... /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
I took the 75 out this weekend, to say the least I was so disapointed and unhappy with it, when I got home to Kristians I cleared out the garage and parked it. I think I will leave it that way for a while too.


Also..it fits in a garage now!...

"after the body drop" /forums/images/graemlins/deal.gif /forums/images/graemlins/woot.gif

The truck just plained sucked, no weight in rear, 454 and a lack of a front shaft = alot of stucks. Not to mention the stupid thing is way to freaking loud, "my ear are still hearing the BB."



[/ QUOTE ]

No front shaft...and you got stuck alot! Man, I would get rid of that POS. /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Here's a plan:
1. put a front driveshaft in the truck so you actually have 4wd
2. install quieter mufflers on the big block

Not trying to be an ass, but what did you expect......
 
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