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Welding on the frame

As most everybody here who has more than a couple of hours welding experience, knows, a proper weld will be as strong or stronger than the parent metal.
The heat treated big truck frames do have stickers saying not to weld to them and for good reason.
They can be welded to, but to maintain the original strength, would require heat treatment beyond the abilities of most welding shops.

Not because they cannot heat treat, its just that they don't have a way to get the frame in the kiln.

Regular truck frames are tough, but not hardened. A well done weld should not be any problem at all.

The main way a proper weld could fail is to crack just past the weld. You see this a lot especially on thin pieces of steel. The weld holds, but the parent metal cracks right next to it.
This is caused because an arc weld dumps a lot of heat into the metal real fast. And then, in a thin piece, the heat goes away quickly.
This caused a stress riser because the metal changes to two different hardnesses in a very narrow area.
In one place the metal is fairly soft having been annealed, and right next to it, it is really hard having been hardened by the high heat and quick quench.
It breaks right at that border.

Thats why when welding thin pieces, you often need to reheat the weld and the area around it with a torch to let the transition zone spread out.

Also, a BIG gotcha, is that a lot of the newer truck have plastic fuel lines.

In 1989, when I had my brand new 3/4 ton truck cut in half and shortened to SWB specs, it all went great. I wound up with a SWB 3/4 ton truck.
As I took it out on it maiden voyage to the farm, I switched to the back tank just as I turned off the highway.
When I pulled up to the gate, A HUGE cloud of white smoke enveloped me. I shut it down and jumped out.
Turned out a tiny piece of weld spatter had bounced all the way across the underside of the truck and melted its self into the back fuel line.
When I turned on the back tank, the pressure caused a stream of gas to shoot across under the truck and hit the cat dead on........
Lots of fun.

I carefully switched back to the front tank, eased into the yard, and went looking for a splice kit.

So watch the splatter.

J.
 
Ugh...get back with me in 10 years, IF you stick with it, then you can tell me how much you DON'T know. :rolleyes:

Must....resist....urge....to....talk....****.....



:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


So I am I wrong??????????? :surepal: Please point out where I am wrong. Whats your point? Point out where I'm talking about what I don't know then get back to me. OR keep running you mouth just because you feel you need to.

HMMMM.... why would my boss put me in a positiion with THE most liability out of any other if I didn't know what I'm doing?

I'm sorry but when you question my trade/skills/knowledge I don't take it lightly.... especially since you don't know me, have never seen my work, and I pointed out a known fact that any fabricator who makes his paycheck fabricating knows and you want to argue. Pfffft. Ok.... wheres that ignore button.

Go ahead and do your garage fabbing and thinking you know everything.... I'll stick to what I learned from 3 master fabricators (20+years of fabbing) over 7 years.
 
Weld away!

I did.

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I like that bobbed truck. I am about to do the same to my 79 k30 crew. Did you use the stock spring hangers? How far forward did you move the axle?
 
Kurt!!

Long time no talk brother. :D

Come to make fun of me arguing with the youngsters? :haha::haha:

Whazzup! It has been a while.

Was there an argument happening?:dunno::whistle: Just enjoying the melee!

ding ding! Get back in there!:D
 
Or you can't.......

You have a pm:angry1::draw:

You're slowly finding all the fabricators here at CK5 that do have 20 years of experience...and butting heads with them. Joe has spent many many years doing high end fab, before heading to the Army.

I'm not saying either one of you is right or wrong, but you do have a certain 'ability' to rub people the wrong way. Whether it's just the medium or not i don't know...but you come off as quite cocky and arrogant.

What do I know though, I only have 22 years experience as a Fitter/Fabricator/Welder/Lead hand/Charge hand/Foreman.......

Guess what skippy...I don't know it all, and I never will. Stop trying to impress us all. :draw:

Rene
 
KidJethro said:
Fabrimacator21 said:
UH.... ok... please tell me why I don't know anything. YOu don't have any points. You just come back with "your a moron" after I asked you to explain why I don't know anything. This is VERY simple dude. All I said was vertical welds can cause cracks/weakspots if you don't know what your doing. YOU my friend are a moron if you can't recognize that.

How did I know this pm was coming.....:rolleyes:

Ok, I'll explain it again. These are pickup trucks. Not high strength big rig frames, or ag parts. They are not swiss watches, or space shuttle pieces. Working on them is not rocket science. What I said was a vertical weld on the frame of one of these trucks will not cause a frame failure. I know all about stress risers, heat affected zones, heat treating, stress relief blah blah blah. Almost NONE of that is even relevant to some guy welding a cross member to his K5 for a fuel tank mount. I'm not so ignorant to just shoot off random statements like that without the ability, knowledge and experience to back them up.

I know what I'm talking about. My cert is expired, but I've held an AWS d10.1 (i think thats what it was...its been awhile) structural steel welding cert. Unlimited thickness, all positions with xx18 series rods. One of the toughest structural certs to get. Minus my time in the military, I've been doing this kind of work all my life. I'm 32 years old now. I've been through 1.5 years of formal training in welding, metalurgy etc. I'm not just some guy with a craftsman welder bought at lowes that thinks making a cart for my wleder makes me an expert.

My point is his title is WELDING ON FRAME. You asked why people are afraid of them and I said vertical welds can cause weak spots which if you have the experience you say you do, you should know. Its good to know for anyone who wants to weld on a frame to know. Why not give good info that will come in handy later?

How many truck frames have you fixed becasue of vertical welds in the wrong spot? For me it's upwards of 10. You might think that it's not a big deal but I can tell you first hand that cracks do happen on frames from vertical welds. ESPECIALLY work trucks or frames that get twisted up alot like a 4x4.

I really don't understand where you get off telling me I don't know what I'm doing. Sure you may have more years then I do but they are spread out where as I'm doing it every day of the week. I would say I've seen more projects come and go then you have... as well as had the benefit of learning from 3 guys with 20+ years in the business.... couldn't tell you how many guys I've watched come and go with 10+ years while I had a job for 4 years through winters when everyone else was gettting laid off.

I honestly didn't mean to disrespect you or your knowledge but you sure disrespected mine.... I assure you I know EXACTLY what I'm doing. I was the youngest in that shop by a good 15 years.... EVER. (largest fab shop north of sac) and was part of 5 main guys who ran that shop day in and day out. When the boss took a day off I'd have the "boss for the day" asking me how we should fix said backhoe, frame, etc. Do you know what kind of liability is involved in that? I can honestly say I had ZERO comebacks and worked on upwards of a thousand projects.

You have 1.5 years of formal welding training. I have 4. Show a LITTLE respect. I've trained guys with 10 years exp.... And certs don't mean jack. I've seen guys certified in everything you can think of that couldn't lay down a bead and took 4 hours to build a square tube frame.

My dad worked at NASA for 20 years and go me into it at 14 so if you say you've got x amount of experence then that would mean I have 8 years total... however on the side fabbing and doing for a living consistently are VERY different.


I don't remember ever questioning your knowledge. You took something the wrong way... got butthurt thinking I'm insulting you then attacked me.

Ryoken came in and said exactly what I was saying.... so I'll ask you again.... please point out where I'm wrong and how I don't know what I'm talking about.

You haven't shown anything to prove it and honestly your talking out your ass telling me I don't know what I'm doing.

I don't mean to "tute" my own horn but you question me so there it is.

I am only posting this because you've lead alot of people to believe that vertical welds are "not a big deal" and truck frames are "not a swiss watch". I apologize to the Original poster for taking this off topic. This will be my last post in this thread.
 
You're slowly finding all the fabricators here at CK5 that do have 20 years of experience...and butting heads with them. Joe has spent many many years doing high end fab, before heading to the Army.

I'm not saying either one of you is right or wrong, but you do have a certain 'ability' to rub people the wrong way. Whether it's just the medium or not i don't know...but you come off as quite cocky and arrogant.

What do I know though, I only have 22 years experience as a Fitter/Fabricator/Welder/Lead hand/Charge hand/Foreman.......

Guess what skippy...I don't know it all, and I never will. Stop trying to impress us all. :draw:

Rene

What would you do if someone pretty much told you that you don't know what your talking about? I don't want to come off as cocky but he questioned my skills/knowledge/ability and I'm just telling him my backround.... not trying to impress ANYONE.... no more no less. I never made any false statements or mislead anyone... what is the reasoning for telling me I don't know what I'm doing?

AGAIN.... I apologize for taking this OT. This is my last post.
 
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as a substaintially less expirenced fabricator, I have repaired frames where the welds cracked in all sorts of directions. I have also welded vertically on frames, more important than the direction of the weld is the quality of the weld the prep etc.

I typically put bracing on any crossmember I do in whatever direction I can. Where I can I will cut a hole in the frame run the crossmember through the hole stick it out a little then weld then brace.
 
What would you do if someone pretty much told you that you don't know what your talking about? I don't want to come off as cocky but he questioned my skills/knowledge/ability and I'm just telling him my backround.... no more no less. I never made any false statements or mislead anyone... what is the reasoning for telling me I don't know what I'm doing?

AGAIN.... I apologize for taking this OT. This is my last post.

My god. You ARE a moron. And an immature one to boot. Whats the point of a PM if you're just gonna copy and paste it here for everyone to see?

Go ahead and run away with your tail between your legs you god damn jack ass. You've got 4 years formal training, you're 22 years old and you've been doing this since you were 14? Somethin doesn't add up. Highschool metal shop doesn't count.

Some examples of my "garage fab"-
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I win.
 
Shmoke and a pancake?

Ya know, a flapjack and a cigarette, No?

Alright, Cigar and a waffle? No?

Pipe and a Crape? no?

Bong and a blitz?

Well, then there is no pleasing you!
 
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