Man you guys just hit a major nerve. Last year i lost my last rig in a snow storm due to some A-hole in a minivan and a guy comming up behind me. Here i am cruising down a nice straight patch of highway since it was snowing i was probably doing 45 in the left lane. I look in my rearview low and behold a guy in a newer import is barreling toward me so i speed it up a bit tryng to avoid a rearender. so now im cruising at 50-55 maybe a lil more about to pass a minivan in the middle lane so i can merge out of the left and let the a-hole pass. Well the guy in the minivan decides he wants to get into the left lane so he shoots in front of me about 3 yards from my bumper he must have been traveling about 30 mph at the time. So in attempt to drive around him i turn the sucker sideways and tryd to slide around him in the middle lane. here where the fun part is the guy flying behind me tryd to veer out his way as well but instead tagged my rear quarter completly spinnin me round and into a concrete wall. Now that i think of it im glad they both fled the scene cause i probably would have beat there heads in with my trusty tire iron. So the rig was basicly a complete loss(had to part it out) . And all for what? Some Mouron thinking he can ride fatser then i big truck with mud n snow tires? /forums/images/graemlins/angryfire.gif once i finish this new k5 i think im gonna drive in the grass on the side of the parkway /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
CK5
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When did they raise the speed limit to 85mph???
- Thread starter diesel4me
- Start date
88Silverado
1/2 ton status
[ QUOTE ]
I just turn my disco lights and cool horn on. I usually only do that when I'm late for the shift briefing down at the donut shop............
[/ QUOTE ]
At least you an Honest one /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif
I just turn my disco lights and cool horn on. I usually only do that when I'm late for the shift briefing down at the donut shop............
[/ QUOTE ]
At least you an Honest one /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif /forums/images/graemlins/histerical.gif
Thunder
3/4 ton status
[ QUOTE ]
Anyone have this problem in your state,
[/ QUOTE ]
Nope. Everyone drives 85. Its the slow pokes you have to watch out for.
Anyone have this problem in your state,
[/ QUOTE ]
Nope. Everyone drives 85. Its the slow pokes you have to watch out for.
fjleiter
1/2 ton status
I usually stick to a max of 7 mph over the posted limit, although I noticed on our local expressways where 55 is the speed limit, average speed is around 70-75mph and where it's 65 the average is 75-85 mph.
On a side note, I remember reading a study showing that survival rates in accidents at 55mph were around 40%, with each 10mph increase it dropped by half till at 85mph it dropped to under 5%. The study was based on mid 80's to mid 90's vehicles and stated that later model vehicles (mid 90's to present) were being engineered to make low speed collisions (30-45 mph) "more survivable without injury" however due to the design of the vehicles with crumple zones etc... higher speed collisions were actually showing a lower survival rate due to the car's literally disintegrating.
Another interesting note was on a TV show showing the changes in race cars. One of the guys stated in the 60's and 70's the cars could be wrecked and still make a race the next weekend although the driver was usally killed from bouncing around inside the car, now the cars are totalled but the driver usually survives.
Personally, I used to like to drive fast (even got a ticket for 107 mph in a 55, and I was decelerating at the time... needless to say I was sans license for a while...)
Nowdays, I have noticed that the younger generation with the "ricers" thinks that the cars are indy bred and can do 105 mph sudden lane changes etc... It's not my driving that scares me, it the guy haulin a** that's unrealistically driving beyond the limits of his experience and car's capabilities. Now I just ride the right lane and watch the wrecks in the left...
Ask any cop and they will tell you, high speed driving takes some skill and a heightened awareness of whats around you. There's a reason why they beef up the suspension on police cars, put in better brakes and stabilizers etc.. as well as make them take high speed driving instruction. All the things that a 17 year old in his 10 year old honda civic DON'T HAVE...
And it's usually the same idiots complaining how the people actually doing at or near the speed limit are the dangerous ones. Well.. news flash... the reason you have to jam on your brakes, nearly get in a wreck etc... when that "slow" guy moves in front of you is because he is doing the speed limit and YOU are going too fast...
On a side note, I remember reading a study showing that survival rates in accidents at 55mph were around 40%, with each 10mph increase it dropped by half till at 85mph it dropped to under 5%. The study was based on mid 80's to mid 90's vehicles and stated that later model vehicles (mid 90's to present) were being engineered to make low speed collisions (30-45 mph) "more survivable without injury" however due to the design of the vehicles with crumple zones etc... higher speed collisions were actually showing a lower survival rate due to the car's literally disintegrating.
Another interesting note was on a TV show showing the changes in race cars. One of the guys stated in the 60's and 70's the cars could be wrecked and still make a race the next weekend although the driver was usally killed from bouncing around inside the car, now the cars are totalled but the driver usually survives.
Personally, I used to like to drive fast (even got a ticket for 107 mph in a 55, and I was decelerating at the time... needless to say I was sans license for a while...)
Nowdays, I have noticed that the younger generation with the "ricers" thinks that the cars are indy bred and can do 105 mph sudden lane changes etc... It's not my driving that scares me, it the guy haulin a** that's unrealistically driving beyond the limits of his experience and car's capabilities. Now I just ride the right lane and watch the wrecks in the left...
Ask any cop and they will tell you, high speed driving takes some skill and a heightened awareness of whats around you. There's a reason why they beef up the suspension on police cars, put in better brakes and stabilizers etc.. as well as make them take high speed driving instruction. All the things that a 17 year old in his 10 year old honda civic DON'T HAVE...
And it's usually the same idiots complaining how the people actually doing at or near the speed limit are the dangerous ones. Well.. news flash... the reason you have to jam on your brakes, nearly get in a wreck etc... when that "slow" guy moves in front of you is because he is doing the speed limit and YOU are going too fast...
[ QUOTE ]
On a side note, I remember reading a study showing that survival rates in accidents at 55mph were around 40%, with each 10mph increase it dropped by half till at 85mph it dropped to under 5%. The study was based on mid 80's to mid 90's vehicles and stated that later model vehicles (mid 90's to present) were being engineered to make low speed collisions (30-45 mph) "more survivable without injury" however due to the design of the vehicles with crumple zones etc... higher speed collisions were actually showing a lower survival rate due to the car's literally disintegrating.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeap... look at Ford truck's crumple zones for the last ten years... the entire front of the truck is junk at anything over 25mph. Second generation S10s, while using pretty much the identical frame, would actually crumple behind the tires and you'd usually lose your legs above 50mph.
[ QUOTE ]
Another interesting note was on a TV show showing the changes in race cars. One of the guys stated in the 60's and 70's the cars could be wrecked and still make a race the next weekend although the driver was usally killed from bouncing around inside the car, now the cars are totalled but the driver usually survives.
[/ QUOTE ]
Seatbelts back then were a joke at best. The helmets were far inferior and very heavy.
[ QUOTE ]
Personally, I used to like to drive fast (even got a ticket for 107 mph in a 55, and I was decelerating at the time... needless to say I was sans license for a while...)
Nowdays, I have noticed that the younger generation with the "ricers" thinks that the cars are indy bred and can do 105 mph sudden lane changes etc... It's not my driving that scares me, it the guy haulin a** that's unrealistically driving beyond the limits of his experience and car's capabilities. Now I just ride the right lane and watch the wrecks in the left...
[/ QUOTE ]
Ricers are an interesting breed... but they're competing with old men in 2500HDs going the speed limit in the hammer lane not paying attention and 20something women shooting the [darn] on their telephone in their SUV.
[ QUOTE ]
Ask any cop and they will tell you, high speed driving takes some skill and a heightened awareness of whats around you. There's a reason why they beef up the suspension on police cars, put in better brakes and stabilizers etc.. as well as make them take high speed driving instruction. All the things that a 17 year old in his 10 year old honda civic DON'T HAVE...
[/ QUOTE ]
Asking a cop is the wrong person. They think they can drive the best in the world because they've had two 8 hour sessions at a "driving school" which is mostly just low-speed (under 40mph) maneuvering and tactics for stopping a vehicle. Anybody that has been to SCCA driving school will school a cop like a fat bitch that sat down too fast (Eminem joke). Anybody.
Cop cars are only marginally better than their stock counterparts. The main reason why they get the "added horsepower" is the extra 500lbs of equipment and emergency gear they carry at all times.
[ QUOTE ]
And it's usually the same idiots complaining how the people actually doing at or near the speed limit are the dangerous ones. Well.. news flash... the reason you have to jam on your brakes, nearly get in a wreck etc... when that "slow" guy moves in front of you is because he is doing the speed limit and YOU are going too fast...
[/ QUOTE ]
Failure to yield right-of-way. It doesn't matter how fast I'm going the accident will be your fault if you fail to yield right-of-way. Now if you're moseying along at 45mph in your own lane and I rear-end you it's my fault. If the retards that are going slow were half as aware as the retards going fast there would be far fewer accidents. But, we've got the idiots that like to go obnoxiously fast like it's a racetrack and we've got the idiots that pay no attention to what is going on around them going at or 10mph below the speedlimit. If you can't go the speedlimit get off the fscking expressway and take two lane roads to wherever you're going.
On a side note, I remember reading a study showing that survival rates in accidents at 55mph were around 40%, with each 10mph increase it dropped by half till at 85mph it dropped to under 5%. The study was based on mid 80's to mid 90's vehicles and stated that later model vehicles (mid 90's to present) were being engineered to make low speed collisions (30-45 mph) "more survivable without injury" however due to the design of the vehicles with crumple zones etc... higher speed collisions were actually showing a lower survival rate due to the car's literally disintegrating.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeap... look at Ford truck's crumple zones for the last ten years... the entire front of the truck is junk at anything over 25mph. Second generation S10s, while using pretty much the identical frame, would actually crumple behind the tires and you'd usually lose your legs above 50mph.
[ QUOTE ]
Another interesting note was on a TV show showing the changes in race cars. One of the guys stated in the 60's and 70's the cars could be wrecked and still make a race the next weekend although the driver was usally killed from bouncing around inside the car, now the cars are totalled but the driver usually survives.
[/ QUOTE ]
Seatbelts back then were a joke at best. The helmets were far inferior and very heavy.
[ QUOTE ]
Personally, I used to like to drive fast (even got a ticket for 107 mph in a 55, and I was decelerating at the time... needless to say I was sans license for a while...)
Nowdays, I have noticed that the younger generation with the "ricers" thinks that the cars are indy bred and can do 105 mph sudden lane changes etc... It's not my driving that scares me, it the guy haulin a** that's unrealistically driving beyond the limits of his experience and car's capabilities. Now I just ride the right lane and watch the wrecks in the left...
[/ QUOTE ]
Ricers are an interesting breed... but they're competing with old men in 2500HDs going the speed limit in the hammer lane not paying attention and 20something women shooting the [darn] on their telephone in their SUV.
[ QUOTE ]
Ask any cop and they will tell you, high speed driving takes some skill and a heightened awareness of whats around you. There's a reason why they beef up the suspension on police cars, put in better brakes and stabilizers etc.. as well as make them take high speed driving instruction. All the things that a 17 year old in his 10 year old honda civic DON'T HAVE...
[/ QUOTE ]
Asking a cop is the wrong person. They think they can drive the best in the world because they've had two 8 hour sessions at a "driving school" which is mostly just low-speed (under 40mph) maneuvering and tactics for stopping a vehicle. Anybody that has been to SCCA driving school will school a cop like a fat bitch that sat down too fast (Eminem joke). Anybody.
Cop cars are only marginally better than their stock counterparts. The main reason why they get the "added horsepower" is the extra 500lbs of equipment and emergency gear they carry at all times.
[ QUOTE ]
And it's usually the same idiots complaining how the people actually doing at or near the speed limit are the dangerous ones. Well.. news flash... the reason you have to jam on your brakes, nearly get in a wreck etc... when that "slow" guy moves in front of you is because he is doing the speed limit and YOU are going too fast...
[/ QUOTE ]
Failure to yield right-of-way. It doesn't matter how fast I'm going the accident will be your fault if you fail to yield right-of-way. Now if you're moseying along at 45mph in your own lane and I rear-end you it's my fault. If the retards that are going slow were half as aware as the retards going fast there would be far fewer accidents. But, we've got the idiots that like to go obnoxiously fast like it's a racetrack and we've got the idiots that pay no attention to what is going on around them going at or 10mph below the speedlimit. If you can't go the speedlimit get off the fscking expressway and take two lane roads to wherever you're going.
Bubba Ray Boudreaux
1 ton status
[ QUOTE ]
Ask any cop and they will tell you, high speed driving takes some skill and a heightened awareness of whats around you.
[/ QUOTE ]
The one's that have the skill. Cybersniper is right. Depending on where the cop goes to school, the driving training may be piss poor, my academy it was. From what I hear on this school I'm going to, they put an emphasis on driving and with the new facility, they say it might be one of the best in the country.
In the last two weeks, I've had a couple of incidents where driver skill has been blown-up. First one involved a pursuit. Cop that initiate spun out into a dirt field. Doesn't seem like much until you hear him say he was doing approximately 110 mph when the pavement ended. Hit the dirt, lost it. A lot of people don't realize that our cars are really hard to control in the dirt at speed and myself, I ran that same dirt road at 85 and knew I was on the edge. It's not the same as a 5K pound K5.
The other incident involved a veteran highway patrol officer. We were en route to a fatality accident a few days ago. He comes up behind me and passes me. Don't have a problem with that since he has the faster car, but the whole way there, he kept on whipping out into the other lane to get around people. Myself, that's one area I'm really gun shy. I hate passing on a 2 lane road. At one point, he was about 200 yards in front of me, we were about a touch over 100 and he whips out and there's a car coming the other way that is too close. The trooper gets around the car he is passing, forcing the oncoming car to go to the shoulder and on the brakes while I'm standing on the brakes cause I saw another fatality accident a coming. Luckily for us, we didn't collide and this guy kept on pulling away, but when we got there, I caught the yahoo driving smooth as can be.
With cops, it's usually the deputies and highway patrol that have the skill cause we get out and have a lot of high speed runs and usually have secret 'test tracks' to practice. /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif
Ask any cop and they will tell you, high speed driving takes some skill and a heightened awareness of whats around you.
[/ QUOTE ]
The one's that have the skill. Cybersniper is right. Depending on where the cop goes to school, the driving training may be piss poor, my academy it was. From what I hear on this school I'm going to, they put an emphasis on driving and with the new facility, they say it might be one of the best in the country.
In the last two weeks, I've had a couple of incidents where driver skill has been blown-up. First one involved a pursuit. Cop that initiate spun out into a dirt field. Doesn't seem like much until you hear him say he was doing approximately 110 mph when the pavement ended. Hit the dirt, lost it. A lot of people don't realize that our cars are really hard to control in the dirt at speed and myself, I ran that same dirt road at 85 and knew I was on the edge. It's not the same as a 5K pound K5.
The other incident involved a veteran highway patrol officer. We were en route to a fatality accident a few days ago. He comes up behind me and passes me. Don't have a problem with that since he has the faster car, but the whole way there, he kept on whipping out into the other lane to get around people. Myself, that's one area I'm really gun shy. I hate passing on a 2 lane road. At one point, he was about 200 yards in front of me, we were about a touch over 100 and he whips out and there's a car coming the other way that is too close. The trooper gets around the car he is passing, forcing the oncoming car to go to the shoulder and on the brakes while I'm standing on the brakes cause I saw another fatality accident a coming. Luckily for us, we didn't collide and this guy kept on pulling away, but when we got there, I caught the yahoo driving smooth as can be.
With cops, it's usually the deputies and highway patrol that have the skill cause we get out and have a lot of high speed runs and usually have secret 'test tracks' to practice. /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif
fjleiter
1/2 ton status
Didn't mean to imply that police were "expert" drivers, only that they are sent to driving school for a reason, your average driver usually highly overestimates their driving abilities. Put Joe Schmoe in a 5000 lb police car doing 110 mph and you might as well pack a good supply of body bags... The driving schools (the better ones anyways) usually place a strong emphasis on knowing vehicle limitations and how to recover when something does go wrong...
[ QUOTE ]
Asking a cop is the wrong person. They think they can drive the best in the world because they've had two 8 hour sessions at a "driving school" which is mostly just low-speed (under 40mph) maneuvering and tactics for stopping a vehicle. Anybody that has been to SCCA driving school will school a cop like a fat bitch that sat down too fast (Eminem joke). Anybody.
Cop cars are only marginally better than their stock counterparts. The main reason why they get the "added horsepower" is the extra 500lbs of equipment and emergency gear they carry at all times.
[/ QUOTE ]
Again, I wasn't really referring to Joe Idiot who thinks he can talk on his cellphone, drink his coffee and read his memo's while doing 45 in a 55 and wandering all over the road....
On more than one occasion, I have been doing 60 mph or so in a 55, come upon someone doing 45 and go to pass, seconds later I have Joe Riceburner doing 95 in a 55 just about rearending me, keeping his bumper within 6 inches of mine then doing his high speed "I'm pissed off so I'm going to pass you and swerve in front of you so close that I nearly wreck you) manuever. He drives away thinking, jerk cut me off, dang slow drivers are gonna kill somebody....
who's right and who's wrong? I'd say it's the person who's clearly driving faster than normal traffic is the one who's dangerous.
If you are driving at such a high rate of speed, and are exceeding the speed limit. you are the idiot, not the guy doing the speed limit doing a legal lane change. (The idiot who thinks the fast lane is a good lane to cruise along doing 45 in a 55 is a different story altogether...)
Another thing that's being overlooked in some areas are the speed limits, look at areas where the speed limits are 75 mph. Not to burst anyones bubble but very few vehicles are really safe (as in handling, braking etc...) at 75-80 or 85 mph (which is what people drive in these speed zones)
It's in these areas where I find no fault with people who are only doing 65 or so in the right lane. I trust the person who knows their limits more than I trust the 17 year old kid who thinks his 10 year old Tercel is safe at 85 mph....
Ain't no way your getting me in a K5 with 10" of lift and 38" tires to get on an expressway and do 85 mph and feel comfortable.
[ QUOTE ]
Failure to yield right-of-way. It doesn't matter how fast I'm going the accident will be your fault if you fail to yield right-of-way. Now if you're moseying along at 45mph in your own lane and I rear-end you it's my fault. If the retards that are going slow were half as aware as the retards going fast there would be far fewer accidents. But, we've got the idiots that like to go obnoxiously fast like it's a racetrack and we've got the idiots that pay no attention to what is going on around them going at or 10mph below the speedlimit. If you can't go the speedlimit get off the fscking expressway and take two lane roads to wherever you're going.
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Asking a cop is the wrong person. They think they can drive the best in the world because they've had two 8 hour sessions at a "driving school" which is mostly just low-speed (under 40mph) maneuvering and tactics for stopping a vehicle. Anybody that has been to SCCA driving school will school a cop like a fat bitch that sat down too fast (Eminem joke). Anybody.
Cop cars are only marginally better than their stock counterparts. The main reason why they get the "added horsepower" is the extra 500lbs of equipment and emergency gear they carry at all times.
[/ QUOTE ]
Again, I wasn't really referring to Joe Idiot who thinks he can talk on his cellphone, drink his coffee and read his memo's while doing 45 in a 55 and wandering all over the road....
On more than one occasion, I have been doing 60 mph or so in a 55, come upon someone doing 45 and go to pass, seconds later I have Joe Riceburner doing 95 in a 55 just about rearending me, keeping his bumper within 6 inches of mine then doing his high speed "I'm pissed off so I'm going to pass you and swerve in front of you so close that I nearly wreck you) manuever. He drives away thinking, jerk cut me off, dang slow drivers are gonna kill somebody....
who's right and who's wrong? I'd say it's the person who's clearly driving faster than normal traffic is the one who's dangerous.
If you are driving at such a high rate of speed, and are exceeding the speed limit. you are the idiot, not the guy doing the speed limit doing a legal lane change. (The idiot who thinks the fast lane is a good lane to cruise along doing 45 in a 55 is a different story altogether...)
Another thing that's being overlooked in some areas are the speed limits, look at areas where the speed limits are 75 mph. Not to burst anyones bubble but very few vehicles are really safe (as in handling, braking etc...) at 75-80 or 85 mph (which is what people drive in these speed zones)
It's in these areas where I find no fault with people who are only doing 65 or so in the right lane. I trust the person who knows their limits more than I trust the 17 year old kid who thinks his 10 year old Tercel is safe at 85 mph....
Ain't no way your getting me in a K5 with 10" of lift and 38" tires to get on an expressway and do 85 mph and feel comfortable.
[ QUOTE ]
Failure to yield right-of-way. It doesn't matter how fast I'm going the accident will be your fault if you fail to yield right-of-way. Now if you're moseying along at 45mph in your own lane and I rear-end you it's my fault. If the retards that are going slow were half as aware as the retards going fast there would be far fewer accidents. But, we've got the idiots that like to go obnoxiously fast like it's a racetrack and we've got the idiots that pay no attention to what is going on around them going at or 10mph below the speedlimit. If you can't go the speedlimit get off the fscking expressway and take two lane roads to wherever you're going.
[/ QUOTE ]
Bubba Ray Boudreaux
1 ton status
You need the reread. Most cops don't have too much formal training. The best training is usually in the highway patrol academies.
Also, a Crown Vic doesn't weigh anywhere near 5000 pounds. Rallying a Crown Vic down dirt is a kneeslapping good time, almost as much as a Honda Accord.
Also, a Crown Vic doesn't weigh anywhere near 5000 pounds. Rallying a Crown Vic down dirt is a kneeslapping good time, almost as much as a Honda Accord.
[ QUOTE ]
The one's that have the skill. Cybersniper is right. Depending on where the cop goes to school, the driving training may be piss poor, my academy it was. From what I hear on this school I'm going to, they put an emphasis on driving and with the new facility, they say it might be one of the best in the country.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's kind of sad that the school doesn't emphasize driving more. It'd definitely help out. The mentality of driving would be another good thing to emphasize. Cops have a handicap... it's REAL easy to get too comfortable driving when you put 30-45k miles on the cruiser each year.
I mean, you can go to SCCA driving school for $200-$5000 depending on where you go and who is teaching and for how long. They might not teach you how to spin a car out but they'll teach you everything else. If you don't know how to block a car in or park a car in then you shouldn't be driving anything but a desk anyway.
My best example is comparing cops to motorcycle riders. Usually if a rider doesn't wreck in the first four months they won't wreck. It's not until they get overly comfortable riding the bike that they get in an accident. I think that's why the percentage or enthusiasts that wreck is so low in the northern states. The riding season is only 4-7months long so you don't really get a chance to become overly comfortable. I think this is what happens to cops.
That and it seems that the police tend to forget things like road conditions and what they're really riding in. I remember 7 or 8 years ago a guy stole a box van and the police chased him across a furrow plowed field. The box van got stuck on the other side of the field in a ditch but the two cruisers tore the front of the car off and the Suburban wrecked the front end trying to haul ass across it. Road conditions... I see this all the time. They've got so much excitement, trying to follow procedure, worrying about their kids, and have to try to talk on the radio all at the same time. My favorite is to watch cops fling their cars around someone on a two-lane highway. The rear end will get light and start to swing around and they'll nearly take out both them and the car their overcoming. They're just lucky they're driving a RWD car so when they lift off the stupid pedal it straightens out.
In all honesty, if the people cops are pursuing weren't under the influence of something they'd never catch anyone. As far as radios go... you don't have to outrun the radio just outsmart it. No one ever expects you to park somewhere for an hour.
[ QUOTE ]
In the last two weeks, I've had a couple of incidents where driver skill has been blown-up. First one involved a pursuit. Cop that initiate spun out into a dirt field. Doesn't seem like much until you hear him say he was doing approximately 110 mph when the pavement ended. Hit the dirt, lost it. A lot of people don't realize that our cars are really hard to control in the dirt at speed and myself, I ran that same dirt road at 85 and knew I was on the edge. It's not the same as a 5K pound K5.
The other incident involved a veteran highway patrol officer. We were en route to a fatality accident a few days ago. He comes up behind me and passes me. Don't have a problem with that since he has the faster car, but the whole way there, he kept on whipping out into the other lane to get around people. Myself, that's one area I'm really gun shy. I hate passing on a 2 lane road. At one point, he was about 200 yards in front of me, we were about a touch over 100 and he whips out and there's a car coming the other way that is too close. The trooper gets around the car he is passing, forcing the oncoming car to go to the shoulder and on the brakes while I'm standing on the brakes cause I saw another fatality accident a coming. Luckily for us, we didn't collide and this guy kept on pulling away, but when we got there, I caught the yahoo driving smooth as can be.
[/ QUOTE ]
I bet that yahoo [darn] his pants when you caught up to him. One of the best ways to outsmart the cops is to keep changing directions. If a cop is coming towards you or parked on the shoulder on the other side of the road (which they like to do in Michigan) just make the first right you can and if you can see another road just haul ass down to it and make a left. Otherwise just drive normally. Most of the time cops never expect you to turn. A lot of them think they're slick that if they don't hit their brakes or start to turn around until they can't see you anymore that you will think you got away and they'll sneak up on you and give you a ticket. Like I said, most of the time they won't expect you to turn and they never look at the crossroads. If it's dark out just downshift through the gears to slow down for the corner without using the brakes and then turn the lights off just before the turn. Drive down the road just far enough that their headlights won't catch your reflectors and coast to a stop. If you've got an auto coast to a stop using neutral. Don't touch the brakes.
[ QUOTE ]
With cops, it's usually the deputies and highway patrol that have the skill cause we get out and have a lot of high speed runs and usually have secret 'test tracks' to practice. /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, it depends on where you're at too. I know that knowing the area is more important when you're in the city...
But yeah... it's the excessive speeders and the slowpokes that don't pay attention that irritate me. I'm certain you, as a police officer, despise those people that don't pay attention. I'd hate to know how often you run up on someone with your lights on and they never even notice and when they do they about [darn] bricks.
The one's that have the skill. Cybersniper is right. Depending on where the cop goes to school, the driving training may be piss poor, my academy it was. From what I hear on this school I'm going to, they put an emphasis on driving and with the new facility, they say it might be one of the best in the country.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's kind of sad that the school doesn't emphasize driving more. It'd definitely help out. The mentality of driving would be another good thing to emphasize. Cops have a handicap... it's REAL easy to get too comfortable driving when you put 30-45k miles on the cruiser each year.
I mean, you can go to SCCA driving school for $200-$5000 depending on where you go and who is teaching and for how long. They might not teach you how to spin a car out but they'll teach you everything else. If you don't know how to block a car in or park a car in then you shouldn't be driving anything but a desk anyway.
My best example is comparing cops to motorcycle riders. Usually if a rider doesn't wreck in the first four months they won't wreck. It's not until they get overly comfortable riding the bike that they get in an accident. I think that's why the percentage or enthusiasts that wreck is so low in the northern states. The riding season is only 4-7months long so you don't really get a chance to become overly comfortable. I think this is what happens to cops.
That and it seems that the police tend to forget things like road conditions and what they're really riding in. I remember 7 or 8 years ago a guy stole a box van and the police chased him across a furrow plowed field. The box van got stuck on the other side of the field in a ditch but the two cruisers tore the front of the car off and the Suburban wrecked the front end trying to haul ass across it. Road conditions... I see this all the time. They've got so much excitement, trying to follow procedure, worrying about their kids, and have to try to talk on the radio all at the same time. My favorite is to watch cops fling their cars around someone on a two-lane highway. The rear end will get light and start to swing around and they'll nearly take out both them and the car their overcoming. They're just lucky they're driving a RWD car so when they lift off the stupid pedal it straightens out.
In all honesty, if the people cops are pursuing weren't under the influence of something they'd never catch anyone. As far as radios go... you don't have to outrun the radio just outsmart it. No one ever expects you to park somewhere for an hour.
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In the last two weeks, I've had a couple of incidents where driver skill has been blown-up. First one involved a pursuit. Cop that initiate spun out into a dirt field. Doesn't seem like much until you hear him say he was doing approximately 110 mph when the pavement ended. Hit the dirt, lost it. A lot of people don't realize that our cars are really hard to control in the dirt at speed and myself, I ran that same dirt road at 85 and knew I was on the edge. It's not the same as a 5K pound K5.
The other incident involved a veteran highway patrol officer. We were en route to a fatality accident a few days ago. He comes up behind me and passes me. Don't have a problem with that since he has the faster car, but the whole way there, he kept on whipping out into the other lane to get around people. Myself, that's one area I'm really gun shy. I hate passing on a 2 lane road. At one point, he was about 200 yards in front of me, we were about a touch over 100 and he whips out and there's a car coming the other way that is too close. The trooper gets around the car he is passing, forcing the oncoming car to go to the shoulder and on the brakes while I'm standing on the brakes cause I saw another fatality accident a coming. Luckily for us, we didn't collide and this guy kept on pulling away, but when we got there, I caught the yahoo driving smooth as can be.
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I bet that yahoo [darn] his pants when you caught up to him. One of the best ways to outsmart the cops is to keep changing directions. If a cop is coming towards you or parked on the shoulder on the other side of the road (which they like to do in Michigan) just make the first right you can and if you can see another road just haul ass down to it and make a left. Otherwise just drive normally. Most of the time cops never expect you to turn. A lot of them think they're slick that if they don't hit their brakes or start to turn around until they can't see you anymore that you will think you got away and they'll sneak up on you and give you a ticket. Like I said, most of the time they won't expect you to turn and they never look at the crossroads. If it's dark out just downshift through the gears to slow down for the corner without using the brakes and then turn the lights off just before the turn. Drive down the road just far enough that their headlights won't catch your reflectors and coast to a stop. If you've got an auto coast to a stop using neutral. Don't touch the brakes.
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With cops, it's usually the deputies and highway patrol that have the skill cause we get out and have a lot of high speed runs and usually have secret 'test tracks' to practice. /forums/images/graemlins/peace.gif
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Yeah, it depends on where you're at too. I know that knowing the area is more important when you're in the city...
But yeah... it's the excessive speeders and the slowpokes that don't pay attention that irritate me. I'm certain you, as a police officer, despise those people that don't pay attention. I'd hate to know how often you run up on someone with your lights on and they never even notice and when they do they about [darn] bricks.
Bubba Ray Boudreaux
1 ton status
I'll be honest; I've had three near wrecks since I've started that would have been my fault. Simple fact is that I overdrove the car everytime. One time at night, I came up on a 90 degree turn on a dirt road at 70 mph. My headlights suck ass, even on bright and I just had to slam on the brakes (ABS) and ride it out. I slowed down enough to make the turn. Did it one more time in the daylight. It all came down that I was learning what my car can and can't do. The other time, I was running 100+ backing up another officer, and went up a hill that has a left curve up top and once I topped the hill, momentum lightened up the car and I lost a lot of steering.
The incident I mentioned about the cop spinning out in the dirt, he was chasing a souped-up Ford F-250 Super Duty 4wd with BFG ATs. It's sad, but there's no Crown Vic driver that can keep up with that on the dirt. It's even funner thinking about trying to catch this guy doing something stupid, cause chances are he'll run again. He's got me outclassed on the dirt, cause he is usually liquored or cranked up, but since I have the terrain advantage and stick with my plan for the most part, I can nail his stupid butt to the wall.
I pride myself at being a great driver, not trying to sound arrogant, just my confidence in my ability. I've learned what the limits of my car are and the tricks of winning a pursuit. I'm averaging probably one 100mph+ run for 20+ miles once a week right now and it's really helped me out to become a better driver. With the two lane roads around here, our substandard light bars that can't hardly be seen during the day and, we really have to pay attention to the other drivers when we are running Code 3. I've had idiots that never see me not pull over. I could have keep flying by at 110 mph and make it, but why chance it when there's a vehicle coming the other way? That just results in lawsuits and funerals and I don't plan on being the center of attention for either of those events for a long time to come.
In all seriousness, most academies stress learning the law and shooting. Well, we use the law everyday. Very few of us actually have to shoot someone, and most departments have a yearly qualification. All of us have to put beaucoup miles on a car each year and a lot of us have to drive really fast through some harsh conditions such as traffic, urban areas, dirt roads and such; yet that's one of the areas that there's very little focus on in training.
I know I'm getting long winded and you may have seen it before; but my second week, we got a 911 call from a town 30 miles away. I hopped in with my SGT, and we took off. Got out on the highway and he's running 110-120. I look over and this guy is eating a [darn] apple! I am usually pretty leary of someone else driving, but this guy made the ride seem like a dream. I kicked back and made a comment, turns out this guy has eaten a cheeseburger at those speeds and another time had a blowout at 120 and didn't crash.
The incident I mentioned about the cop spinning out in the dirt, he was chasing a souped-up Ford F-250 Super Duty 4wd with BFG ATs. It's sad, but there's no Crown Vic driver that can keep up with that on the dirt. It's even funner thinking about trying to catch this guy doing something stupid, cause chances are he'll run again. He's got me outclassed on the dirt, cause he is usually liquored or cranked up, but since I have the terrain advantage and stick with my plan for the most part, I can nail his stupid butt to the wall.
I pride myself at being a great driver, not trying to sound arrogant, just my confidence in my ability. I've learned what the limits of my car are and the tricks of winning a pursuit. I'm averaging probably one 100mph+ run for 20+ miles once a week right now and it's really helped me out to become a better driver. With the two lane roads around here, our substandard light bars that can't hardly be seen during the day and, we really have to pay attention to the other drivers when we are running Code 3. I've had idiots that never see me not pull over. I could have keep flying by at 110 mph and make it, but why chance it when there's a vehicle coming the other way? That just results in lawsuits and funerals and I don't plan on being the center of attention for either of those events for a long time to come.
In all seriousness, most academies stress learning the law and shooting. Well, we use the law everyday. Very few of us actually have to shoot someone, and most departments have a yearly qualification. All of us have to put beaucoup miles on a car each year and a lot of us have to drive really fast through some harsh conditions such as traffic, urban areas, dirt roads and such; yet that's one of the areas that there's very little focus on in training.
I know I'm getting long winded and you may have seen it before; but my second week, we got a 911 call from a town 30 miles away. I hopped in with my SGT, and we took off. Got out on the highway and he's running 110-120. I look over and this guy is eating a [darn] apple! I am usually pretty leary of someone else driving, but this guy made the ride seem like a dream. I kicked back and made a comment, turns out this guy has eaten a cheeseburger at those speeds and another time had a blowout at 120 and didn't crash.
fjleiter
1/2 ton status
My info may be a little old and I am basing it on personal experience. (went out for the New York State Police in the early 1990's but went into IT instead)
At the time, NYS Police were required to to take a 2 week high speed driving course as part of training. Cool part was that they used Caprices with great bigg outriggers attached so you couldn't flip the car.
Weight was also based on a Caprice of that era which stock would have been around 4150 lbs for the Police Package and around 4750 once all the Police equipment was added. (look inside the trunk of a State Police car and you'll know why, especially if they have radio repeaters etc... in it)
Stock Crown Vic is around 4000lbs so add extras plus all the police equipment and a 200lb driver and I bet your close to that 5000lb figure.
I do find it surprising that some police depts are devoting so little to driving skills like you suggest. Don't remember which but I think it was LAPD or CHP that used to have a VERY intense driving program for new recruits, maybe you could look into that? (I do realize that most small town PD don't have anywhere near the funds for any real training program though...) Don't feel bad, my local PD is made up almost entirely of officers who left our closest City PD to avoid criminal charges except for one who left to avoid being fired for writing an "Ebonics" dictionary for white police officers....
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You need the reread. Most cops don't have too much formal training. The best training is usually in the highway patrol academies.
Also, a Crown Vic doesn't weigh anywhere near 5000 pounds. Rallying a Crown Vic down dirt is a kneeslapping good time, almost as much as a Honda Accord.
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At the time, NYS Police were required to to take a 2 week high speed driving course as part of training. Cool part was that they used Caprices with great bigg outriggers attached so you couldn't flip the car.
Weight was also based on a Caprice of that era which stock would have been around 4150 lbs for the Police Package and around 4750 once all the Police equipment was added. (look inside the trunk of a State Police car and you'll know why, especially if they have radio repeaters etc... in it)
Stock Crown Vic is around 4000lbs so add extras plus all the police equipment and a 200lb driver and I bet your close to that 5000lb figure.
I do find it surprising that some police depts are devoting so little to driving skills like you suggest. Don't remember which but I think it was LAPD or CHP that used to have a VERY intense driving program for new recruits, maybe you could look into that? (I do realize that most small town PD don't have anywhere near the funds for any real training program though...) Don't feel bad, my local PD is made up almost entirely of officers who left our closest City PD to avoid criminal charges except for one who left to avoid being fired for writing an "Ebonics" dictionary for white police officers....
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You need the reread. Most cops don't have too much formal training. The best training is usually in the highway patrol academies.
Also, a Crown Vic doesn't weigh anywhere near 5000 pounds. Rallying a Crown Vic down dirt is a kneeslapping good time, almost as much as a Honda Accord.
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fjleiter
1/2 ton status
Just for fun I did a search on what some PD's are doing for driver training. Looks like some areas have VERY comprehensive training.
(check out what's available to the U.K. police)
Police training
Here's Marylands training facility
Maryland LEO driver training
Looks like some areas like Missouri have pitiful programs (8 ot 16 hours) and some have programs that last up to 4 weeks (160 hours). Looks like the U.K. has us beat hands down on driver training though (one program I found was a whole year long of nothing but high speed pursuit driving skills)
(check out what's available to the U.K. police)
Police training
Here's Marylands training facility
Maryland LEO driver training
Looks like some areas like Missouri have pitiful programs (8 ot 16 hours) and some have programs that last up to 4 weeks (160 hours). Looks like the U.K. has us beat hands down on driver training though (one program I found was a whole year long of nothing but high speed pursuit driving skills)
WoW! I guess this issue isnt just a problem in the northeast,judging by all your replies!.
I am not saying I'm a perfect driver,but I do try to follow the rules of the road--it just frosts me when you see theese teenage punks in their mustang gt's that mummy and daddy bought them burning the tires off and passing you at 100 mph while smoking crack--then they shoot your windows out with a BB gun,or paintball your car,and get away with it 98% of the time.Not to mention people who shoot out of their driveways without looking,usually on a bad curve,then the crawl out of the way like a snail,and smirk at you because they know they just got you pissed.
I dont feel comfortable driving a 6000lb+ truck with lower gears at 80 or more on the highway(not that it would last very long at that speed anyway!)--I feel the brakes are inadequate --feels like even if I stand on the pedal I couldnt lock the wheels.And a GM 4x4 is not a corvette,nor does it handle like one.
I feel there should be more enforcement of the existing laws--not meaning to bash any police officers,I know they have a tough job(I wouldnt be able to be one--I'd be too tempted to use that gun on some of the jerks I've come across!)but it seems to be a free for all on the roads here lately,people drive any way they dam well please,and no one is telling them to knock it off and smarten up. They are always crying budget cuts,we dont have the money or manpower for more patrols or officers--but look at the number of troopers staring at a hole construction crews are digging around here to the tune of 40+bucks an hour--thats a gravy train in our state that should have ended years ago.Put them back in the cruisers and make then write some tickets,sure,it will make some people mad--but it just might save someones butt too!
Another gripe I have (especially this year)is the number of motorcycles around here that seem to be completly exempt from all traffic laws.Like the rice burners with their pissed off bumblbees screaming at 12,000 rpm,they pull up next to you and sidstep the clutch and pull a wheelie past you at 100+mph,scare the S$%6 outa you--and the harleys with no exhaust at all hours--seems like the more obnoxious somthing is,the more popular it is around here,from booming ghetto blasters in cars right down to the nonstop barking rotwilders everyone leaves chained out in their backyards all night,seems everyone's favorite pastime here is either getting someone P-O'd or destroying property,like mailboxes and car windows with pellet guns.What good are laws if there is no enforcement???. /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
I am not saying I'm a perfect driver,but I do try to follow the rules of the road--it just frosts me when you see theese teenage punks in their mustang gt's that mummy and daddy bought them burning the tires off and passing you at 100 mph while smoking crack--then they shoot your windows out with a BB gun,or paintball your car,and get away with it 98% of the time.Not to mention people who shoot out of their driveways without looking,usually on a bad curve,then the crawl out of the way like a snail,and smirk at you because they know they just got you pissed.
I dont feel comfortable driving a 6000lb+ truck with lower gears at 80 or more on the highway(not that it would last very long at that speed anyway!)--I feel the brakes are inadequate --feels like even if I stand on the pedal I couldnt lock the wheels.And a GM 4x4 is not a corvette,nor does it handle like one.
I feel there should be more enforcement of the existing laws--not meaning to bash any police officers,I know they have a tough job(I wouldnt be able to be one--I'd be too tempted to use that gun on some of the jerks I've come across!)but it seems to be a free for all on the roads here lately,people drive any way they dam well please,and no one is telling them to knock it off and smarten up. They are always crying budget cuts,we dont have the money or manpower for more patrols or officers--but look at the number of troopers staring at a hole construction crews are digging around here to the tune of 40+bucks an hour--thats a gravy train in our state that should have ended years ago.Put them back in the cruisers and make then write some tickets,sure,it will make some people mad--but it just might save someones butt too!
Another gripe I have (especially this year)is the number of motorcycles around here that seem to be completly exempt from all traffic laws.Like the rice burners with their pissed off bumblbees screaming at 12,000 rpm,they pull up next to you and sidstep the clutch and pull a wheelie past you at 100+mph,scare the S$%6 outa you--and the harleys with no exhaust at all hours--seems like the more obnoxious somthing is,the more popular it is around here,from booming ghetto blasters in cars right down to the nonstop barking rotwilders everyone leaves chained out in their backyards all night,seems everyone's favorite pastime here is either getting someone P-O'd or destroying property,like mailboxes and car windows with pellet guns.What good are laws if there is no enforcement???. /forums/images/graemlins/thinking.gif
Bubba Ray Boudreaux
1 ton status
If I remember right, my training out in Cali for vehicle ops was 40 hours, but that was with 24 spent inside the classroom. From what I hear, OK beats it hands down.
What made it even worse was the cars. We were driving cars that were retired at least 5 to ten years ago. We had the smaller Caprices and the bigger ones. The smaller ones were still pretty hot, but we had to drive the big ones during pursuit against the rabbit driving a smaller one. Talk about going into a gunfight with a butter knife.
I wanted to set foot on CHP's track up there in Sacramento. Seen some video and they really get after it. The State of CA also has an EVOC course down in San Bernadino that local guys can go to and it's supposed be great.
OK is getting a new training center in Alva, that is supposed to be opening in the fall, or early next year and they are even encompassing dirt roads in the driving.
What made it even worse was the cars. We were driving cars that were retired at least 5 to ten years ago. We had the smaller Caprices and the bigger ones. The smaller ones were still pretty hot, but we had to drive the big ones during pursuit against the rabbit driving a smaller one. Talk about going into a gunfight with a butter knife.
I wanted to set foot on CHP's track up there in Sacramento. Seen some video and they really get after it. The State of CA also has an EVOC course down in San Bernadino that local guys can go to and it's supposed be great.
OK is getting a new training center in Alva, that is supposed to be opening in the fall, or early next year and they are even encompassing dirt roads in the driving.
