1991 with bench seat and early model steering wheel?

[Slapperbar]

The Di*k Fu*k cut a perfect dash to but that bull**** center speaker in it.

 

[ryoken]

Ah....you guys are goofy. You can keep your stripped down no badging, trim, anything naked trucks all you want.

I don't like trim at all on newer trucks, like my Ram with the Sport package that is completely match painted with zero plastic trim, but on the 80's Chevies, having the full SILVERADO exterior trim package really meant something back then. There is such a huge difference between a Scottsdale and Silverado, and back in the day when these were new someone would say "oh wow, it's a Silverado", that is part of the reason why I like the trim.

Without all the trim, like a Scottsdale, these trucks just look like a solid colored blob without anything to help offset and break up the sections of sheetmetal. These trucks seem to have just so much sheetmetal, they just look naked without anything to break it up a little, IMHO.

I'm betting you like white lettering too, eh Bob?

A car/truck is more pure to it's art without that stuff... Any classic vehicle relies on it's sheetmetal lines for it's integrity... Just think of all the cool hotrods, it's the bodystyling you remember, not some ghey chrome strip down the middle of the door...

I always prefer something with the absolute minimum of colors and 4 or 5 main groups (tires, body, bumpers, tops, etc), as opposed to 4 or 5 colors/finishes and 12 seperate items... I don't know, must be the oldschool painter in me...

Heck, I DISPISE low profile tires on anything that wasn't designed to run em... IMO, any hotrod from 65 to 75 looks best with a full, blackwall tire...

 

[pauly383]

When you see a 57 Chevy , you immediately think of the hard to miss side trim , tail fins , and wide front bumper and grille , you already KNOW its shaped like a box

 

[ryoken]

bleh..... I'm more a 55 guy anyway...

 

[j20m715]

Look at the seat brackets.
That seat is from the newer body style trucks (88-94).

 

[rjfguitar]

I'm betting you like white lettering too, eh Bob?

A car/truck is more pure to it's art without that stuff... Any classic vehicle relies on it's sheetmetal lines for it's integrity... Just think of all the cool hotrods, it's the bodystyling you remember, not some ghey chrome strip down the middle of the door...

I always prefer something with the absolute minimum of colors and 4 or 5 main groups (tires, body, bumpers, tops, etc), as opposed to 4 or 5 colors/finishes and 12 seperate items... I don't know, must be the oldschool painter in me...

Heck, I DISPISE low profile tires on anything that wasn't designed to run em... IMO, any hotrod from 65 to 75 looks best with a full, blackwall tire...

Nope, always tell the tire man to put the white side in and I peeled all of the "4x4" and "Dodge" stickers off of my Ram.

I like that "ghey" chrome strip down the middle of the body... it means it's a SILVERADO and not a pile of junk Scottsdale.

I also like the fully painted, no trim on most muscle cars and that era that you bring up, but sometimes it just depends on the vehicle, for the 70-80's GM trucks, I think the sheetmetal is too tall vertically not to have some sort of body trim, or at least wheel well trim to help accent the giant body panels.

I'll tell you what.... I'll meet you in the middle. If we were going to paint an '82 K30 together, you paint everything a solid color, but leave the trim there and paint it too.

 

[j20m715]

It's factory, that's an established fact.

Show me an rpo code for the frt bench.

 

[Craig Artzner]

Ah....you guys are goofy. You can keep your stripped down no badging, trim, anything naked trucks all you want.

I don't like trim at all on newer trucks, like my Ram with the Sport package that is completely match painted with zero plastic trim, but on the 80's Chevies, having the full SILVERADO exterior trim package really meant something back then. There is such a huge difference between a Scottsdale and Silverado, and back in the day when these were new someone would say "oh wow, it's a Silverado", that is part of the reason why I like the trim.

Without all the trim, like a Scottsdale, these trucks just look like a solid colored blob without anything to help offset and break up the sections of sheetmetal. These trucks seem to have just so much sheetmetal, they just look naked without anything to break it up a little, IMHO.

Agreed! I prefer the trim, and I also love the old-school, thin steering wheel on that blue Blazer. I'm not a fan of the 4-spoke, swollen steering wheel GM used from '88-'94. Ugh.

 

[AJMBLAZER]

Well, I for one switch between my '81 K30 and my 2001 Dodge Ram Cummins everyday. I'll put 100 miles in the AM on my K30, then switch at lunch time and put another 100miles on my Ram in the afternoon.

With doing that and being able to compare an "old school" 1 ton truck to a "new school" 1 ton rig (ok, my ram is a 3/4, but it's close enough) I would have to definantly disagree.

My Dodge is just as tough as my K30, if not tougher. The newer automatics make my Th400 in my 30 look fairly light duty, and the engine choice is a mute point, a 454 vs. a hopped up Cummins.

The best thing to compare is ergonomics between new and old school. While I can cruise with one hand on the wheel in my K30, my Dodge has a tighter steering system than my K30, and it has more miles on it to boot. The A/C and ventalation systems have come along way, my Ram holds 1.875 lbs of R134A and hits 40.1* with an outside temp of 106*. My K30 holds 3lbs of R12 and it couldn't hit 40.1* on an 85* day, not to mention how strong the blowers are.

Seats, I've got a standard issue crew cab bench in my K30 3+3, I've got leather buckets in my Ram that are heated..... I don't think I need to continue there....

fourwheel drive! I would definantly say my Ram has a better designed 4wd system. Both use a D60, so nothing has been compromised there, bigger driveshafts ( I think the Dodges use 1410's in the rear, IIRC), and uses a much better transfer case than for all intents and purposes, the dinosaur NP205 in my K30 (close your gasping mouth and hear me out ) My Ram has an NP241HD case with a 2.72:1 low range, my NP205 is a 2:1 box. 2:1 is flat out a sucky low range. Sure sure, it's cast iron and all...... There are 1000HP sled pulling Dodges out there using their aluminum 241's without problems, the case being alum is just not an issue, and helps it be lighter! That cast iron 205 only matters if you are going to smash it on a big rock, which will never be an issue with 99.9% of the 4wd vehicles out there, I know I won't get my $30K worth of Dodge diesel near a rock big enough to hit my case on!

For all intents and purposes, my "new school" rig could put a whuppin' on my "old school" rig.

I actually think my 21 year old bench seat has the most comfortable "cushness" of any vehicle I've owned since...probably my '86 K5's buckets. Nobody seems to know how to make a comfortable seat anymore.
Now heating pads in that seat...

Ever seen the inner axleshafts on your Ram's D60? Aside from the crappy 2-piece "long side" inner axleshaft with the trouble prone CAD system there's the fact that the inner axleshafts are actually the size of D44 pieces. On a 94-01 Dodge D60 only the stubshafts are actually "D60" size. A lot of the guys over on www.PavementSucks.com were damn surprised when their diesel Rams broke front axle parts and then discovered the size of their front axleshafts. Then there's the expensive ass unit bearing hubs with their non-replaceable components that require you to press the studs in and out every time you have to replace one (which is kinda often from what the guys on PS have found)...
...that's just the front axle.
The Cummins is great but their auto trans suck and they managed to mess up the NV4500 enough to give them issues behind the Cummins. Seems like Dodge wanted everything their way and got it...at the detriment of quality and robustness.

I will grant you the NV241 vs the NP205, I'd rather have my 208 or a 241 until 3:1 gearsets for the 205 get cheaper.

Then there's the rattly dash, rust prone doors and bumpers (probably not much of a factor in Cali but they're horrible here in the salt belt), and ugh I couldn't believe the troubles I had with the Magnum 360 V8...

It might not have the power of a Cummins or an OD...but I'll take my K30 any day provided the work required is within it's capabilities. AC and cruise would be nice but it's got fresh air vents and well, I can live without cruise, need to pay attention anyways. Put the radio in so I have something else to listen to...power windows and door locks? No thanks, my manuals work just fine and will never break on me baring some freak failure.
Yep, simple is better.


This is like asking a crowd of guys, "Blondes, brunettes, or redheads?"

 

[nvrenuf]

While I agree that bench seats were available in K5's I think this one is swapped in, the upholstery is different from the rear seat. My 91 K5 has a blue interior and the front buckets match the rear seat perfectly, the front in the Ebay truck has a vinyl border and the cloth is a different material.

As for the steering wheel and grille, they're options - dual headlamps vs quad and standard steering wheel vs sport. My 91 crew cab originally had the 2 spoke standard wheel also.

 

[Slapperbar]

My '91 'Burb Scottsdale has the same blue interior. That ain't the correct bench, They were ALL vinyl.

 

[rjfguitar]

I actually think my 21 year old bench seat has the most comfortable "cushness" of any vehicle I've owned since...probably my '86 K5's buckets. Nobody seems to know how to make a comfortable seat anymore.
Now heating pads in that seat...

My bench in my K30 is "comfortable" and feels nice driving for 20 minutes at a time. I have found it doesn't provide the back support for long trips, but I'm also 6'4" too so that may make a difference.

Ever seen the inner axleshafts on your Ram's D60? Aside from the crappy 2-piece "long side" inner axleshaft with the trouble prone CAD system there's the fact that the inner axleshafts are actually the size of D44 pieces. On a 94-01 Dodge D60 only the stubshafts are actually "D60" size. A lot of the guys over on www.PavementSucks.com were damn surprised when their diesel Rams broke front axle parts and then discovered the size of their front axleshafts. Then there's the expensive ass unit bearing hubs with their non-replaceable components that require you to press the studs in and out every time you have to replace one (which is kinda often from what the guys on PS have found)...
...that's just the front axle.
The Cummins is great but their auto trans suck and they managed to mess up the NV4500 enough to give them issues behind the Cummins. Seems like Dodge wanted everything their way and got it...at the detriment of quality and robustness.

I won't disagree that you know what size this shaft is, and that stub blah blah is. I'm honestly not that interested in getting the mic out and seeing what is what. What I care about is what breaks. I don't know or care what goes on Pavementsucks.com but I sledpull and drag race my Ram along next to a TON of other guys. Ever read a magazine called Diesel Power? I've either seen most of the those trucks in person, seen them in action, and have even competed against a few of them (yes, they kicked my butt ) and breakage up front is pretty much a non issue. The Dodge and Ford D60's do just fine, and even the GM IFS holds up to sled pulling with aftermarket tie rods. Oh, I personally LOVE my CAD system, zero problems and no getting out to lock in when I want to race.

NV4500???? Besides the 5th gear nut falling off, which isn't Dodges fault as New Venture didn't design it around the vibs from a diesel, it's a bulletproof trans. The only difference between a GM and Dodge 4500 is the input and output shafts, neither being weak points. Ever heard of an NV5600?

Automatics.... the reason why the Dodge autos "suck" is because they've had a 12v Cummins in front of them that are so rediculously easy to hop up that they've lived a torcherous life and have gotten a bad rep. In the 90's, tons of guys were adding 100HP or so to their diesels, the Dodge 47RH's were doing fine under stock power, but as soon as they saw that added power they couldn't handle. Now they have a pissed owner that thinks his Dodge auto is a pile because it was designed for 175HP/400ft lbs and it couldn't handle 300HP/700ft lbs.

Put a Th400 or 4L80E stocker behind a Cummins and send 100,000 of them out into the public, those two "venerable" trans will become pieces of junk practically overnight.

Does this mean that my Dodge's drivetrain is stronger than the one in my K30? No, all I know is that stuff doesn't hardly break underneith them. I might have a chance to put the good 'ol 205/60/14 into the same catagory as my Ram soon, as a customer of mine wrecked his '94 Dodge Cummins and wants to sell me the motor, this winter my K30 is likely going to be cummins powered.

Then there's the rattly dash, rust prone doors and bumpers (probably not much of a factor in Cali but they're horrible here in the salt belt), and ugh I couldn't believe the troubles I had with the Magnum 360 V8...

It might not have the power of a Cummins or an OD...but I'll take my K30 any day provided the work required is within it's capabilities. AC and cruise would be nice but it's got fresh air vents and well, I can live without cruise, need to pay attention anyways. Put the radio in so I have something else to listen to...power windows and door locks? No thanks, my manuals work just fine and will never break on me baring some freak failure.
Yep, simple is better.


This is like asking a crowd of guys, "Blondes, brunettes, or redheads?"

Well, you are right, this comes down to preferance. You sound like the guy that would check off a basic package buying a new factory order truck, as I would order the truck basically fully loaded. Pure preferance. No doubt though, new school caters much better to "fully loaded" than old school could, but more importantly reliably. Stuff like power windows and locks actually work these days. I don't know how many threads I've read on CK5 about problematic power options. For that, I'm also glad my 30 has manual roll ups and locks.

You are correct, I don't know about rust issues and what not with me living in California.

You hit the nail on the head, redhead, blonde, or brunette?

 

[muddybuddy]

I used to think the badges were must just for the old school coolness.

Now I feel no reason to put them on Big Ugly, even after I repaint it.

no repainting, its badass camo!

i like badges personally, but can do without the trim and everything else.

 

[trixblazer]

You hit the nail on the head, redhead, blonde, or brunette?

Not picky here. If she is good looking doesn't really matter the hair color. Hell, half the time I can't even remember anyway. Most of them die their hair now-a-days anyway. Look at Wynona Ryder, who would have known she is actually a natural blonde?

 

[Copasetic]

Definatley a clean truck and looks like it's in pretty good shape. Never cared for those style grills though. Needs some chrome. Mmmmmm.... chrome... I like chrome....

 

[rjfguitar]

Not picky here. If she is good looking doesn't really matter the hair color. Hell, half the time I can't even remember anyway. Most of them die their hair now-a-days anyway. Look at Wynona Ryder, who would have known she is actually a natural blonde?

Ahh, I only look from the neck down anyway....

 

[AJMBLAZER]

My bench in my K30 is "comfortable" and feels nice driving for 20 minutes at a time. I have found it doesn't provide the back support for long trips, but I'm also 6'4" too so that may make a difference.

Dude, mine is like...just comfy. The wife even likes it and Big Ugly sorta isn't her style...or height. I get no complaints about us taking Big Ugly as long as I can help hoist her into it.

I won't disagree that you know what size this shaft is, and that stub blah blah is. I'm honestly not that interested in getting the mic out and seeing what is what. What I care about is what breaks. I don't know or care what goes on Pavementsucks.com but I sledpull and drag race my Ram along next to a TON of other guys. Ever read a magazine called Diesel Power? I've either seen most of the those trucks in person, seen them in action, and have even competed against a few of them (yes, they kicked my butt ) and breakage up front is pretty much a non issue. The Dodge and Ford D60's do just fine, and even the GM IFS holds up to sled pulling with aftermarket tie rods. Oh, I personally LOVE my CAD system, zero problems and no getting out to lock in when I want to race.

The Dodge D60's inners are small, like D44 size. A lot of the guys over on PavementSucks got 2500's and 3500's for the "1 ton stuff" and were not happy when they exploded front axle parts that just shouldn't have gone. Ford D60's and even the new AAMCo 9.25" front are hot swaps over there last I knew. You won't see many people swap the Dodge D60 of this era into other trucks.
The CAD...it's just sorta like the GM IFS CAD and after a while it gets unreliable and problematic. Also apparently can be a weak spot of the housing but only under hard abuse. The guys on big tires and wheeling the piss out of their trucks had the issues with that. However Dodge did seem to make note of this as in the last year of that body style (02) they went to a 1-peice longside inner and left the CAD system off entirely. No 2-peice axleshafts or CAD but the front was always spinning after that.

NV4500???? Besides the 5th gear nut falling off, which isn't Dodges fault as New Venture didn't design it around the vibs from a diesel, it's a bulletproof trans. The only difference between a GM and Dodge 4500 is the input and output shafts, neither being weak points. Ever heard of an NV5600?

Yep, heard of the 6 speed but yeah...that option costs more than some of my vehicles. The NV4500 issue seems to have been a Dodge only issue as I've never heard or seen of it on GM's or Fords with the tranny. I might have missed that part though.

Automatics.... the reason why the Dodge autos "suck" is because they've had a 12v Cummins in front of them that are so rediculously easy to hop up that they've lived a torcherous life and have gotten a bad rep. In the 90's, tons of guys were adding 100HP or so to their diesels, the Dodge 47RH's were doing fine under stock power, but as soon as they saw that added power they couldn't handle. Now they have a pissed owner that thinks his Dodge auto is a pile because it was designed for 175HP/400ft lbs and it couldn't handle 300HP/700ft lbs.

Again, I've seen and heard so much trouble with these transmissions, even on stockish trucks, that sorry, can't blame it solely on the engine. A friend has a 250k STOCK Cummins Ram that is a work truck and it's on tranny 3 or 4 now. Engine keeps going, doors are rusting, dash rattles, transmissions fall to pieces on him. Oh yeah, he's a landscaper so it's not like he's pulling bulldozers with the thing.

Put a Th400 or 4L80E stocker behind a Cummins and send 100,000 of them out into the public, those two "venerable" trans will become pieces of junk practically overnight.

Never said either would. However how about an Allison? Seems like GM's the only one recently who went and actually put an auto transmission worth a $hit behind their diesel. I know my TH400 will live and survive happily behind my 6.2L or any other engine from that era for decades. They used appropriate drivetrain components for the engines and work requirements expected of those vehicles.

Does this mean that my Dodge's drivetrain is stronger than the one in my K30? No, all I know is that stuff doesn't hardly break underneith them. I might have a chance to put the good 'ol 205/60/14 into the same catagory as my Ram soon, as a customer of mine wrecked his '94 Dodge Cummins and wants to sell me the motor, this winter my K30 is likely going to be cummins powered.

Nice. I've seen a Cummins powered Sub and man, it was a sweet swap. Aside from the garish paint job the guy had on it but that's irrelevent.

Well, you are right, this comes down to preferance. You sound like the guy that would check off a basic package buying a new factory order truck, as I would order the truck basically fully loaded. Pure preferance. No doubt though, new school caters much better to "fully loaded" than old school could, but more importantly reliably. Stuff like power windows and locks actually work these days. I don't know how many threads I've read on CK5 about problematic power options. For that, I'm also glad my 30 has manual roll ups and locks.

Yep, the reason I went with an older truck was after pricing used Super Duty diesels (90% of which are former plow trucks up here), I'm leary of the 03+ Ram 2500's yet, and then seeing the price tag (with the GM A plan discount of my uncle's) of a bare bones stripper model GMC K2500 6.0L, 5 speed stick, vinyl floormats, no options but cruise, tilt, AC, and a sliding rear window truck...yowza...I ran away. It'd have been like having two mortgage payments. Just out of reach of the common man.
Besides, the dealership couldn't understand why I wanted a truck like that and they kept trying to show me the $10k more expensive fully loaded truck they had sitting on their lot...with an automatic.
Oh yeah, did I mention my '99 Ram's "humming" door locks that somehow everyone in the world could hear EXCEPT for the employees of the Dodge dealerships I took it to? A1 customer service there.

You are correct, I don't know about rust issues and what not with me living in California.

Poor drainage in the doors. Water pools inside the bottoms of the doors and doesn't drain out like it's supposed to. Dodge has known about it since at least the late 90's but has never willingly acknowledge it or fixed it. Guys who still had their trucks under warranty occasionally got it fixed but that was uncommon. My '99 at 3 years old and 33,000 miles had rust bubbling up under the paint at the exterior bottom of both doors. It was a dirt free cream puff when I got it like that too. My queries about using the body rust part of the warranty got me flat refusals and comments like I was nuts for even asking.
Not sure what the bumpers issues are but around here it's not uncommon to see a Ram of this vintage with golfball to softball sized holes in the door and completely rust coated bumpers.

You hit the nail on the head, redhead, blonde, or brunette?

All 3! Beggars can't be choosers! As long as the head has something in it, the curves are right, and the grille isn't fugly I couldn't care! Well, didn't.







muddy, it needs some body work so the camo will be splotched with Rust Encapsulator. I plan on Rhino Lining the lower portion of the truck and then flat black on the top. Unfortunately around here camo screams redneck to most people long before they would ever actually realize it might mean military. It's caused me troubles and well, if I need to do paint work to it I'd rather not have to worry about maintaining the CARC paint and camo patterns anyways.

 

[Craig Artzner]

Wow, what a reply that was! Whew! I'm getting tired just looking at all that work.

 

[ryoken]

Wow, what a reply that was! Whew! I'm getting tired just looking at all that work.

I broke out in a sweat...

 

[Randy92782]

i think i should go outside and cool off. it's only 97*