'72 K5 - Greg's @MightAsWellK5 Build

[Greg72]

QUICK UPDATE!

Did a little bit of "plate work" last night just to start the process of getting the fitted plates onto the new bedfloor, and locating and drilling the through-holes needed for the cage plates.

The "sandwich" is a small top plate (which welds to the rollcage foot), then a CNC'ed top plate to sit on the convoluted floor, then the underside CNC'ed plate cut with the opposite convoluted pattern, and finally a small bottom plate which ultimately gets welded to the frame. The CNC'ed parts become a permanent part of the bedfloor, but the rollcage itself remains completly removeable (if needed) from the truck.

Originally, I was transfer-punching all the hole centers from the top plate but realized that even a small error (or walking of the drillbit) would probably create a series of mis-aligned holes through the 4 layers of metal and I'd never get my 1/2" bolt cleanly through them all. A better solution was to use the top plate as a drill-guide instead. The hole centers the bit for cutting the other layers and when it's done, a fresh 1/2" bolt is torqued down to make everything even MORE precise for the subsequent holes. Worked great!

The end result from the first try:

Drilled the 4 holes through the bedfloor and ran all the bolts completely though all 4 layers. The fitment was beautiful and smooth... no misaligned holes, and no hand-filing for clearance. Only 2 plate assemblies were completed last night, so there are still 10 to go just for the rear bedfloor... but at least the process is easily repeatable now that there is a reliable method for getting perfect holes.



-G

 

[Truckman4life]

So if I am interpreting this correctly the machined pieces will get welded to the top and bottom of the floor?

 

[Greg72]

So if I am interpreting this correctly the machined pieces will get welded to the top and bottom of the floor?

Yes, that's right.

There isn't much value structurally to welding them to the floor, so really a few small welds at each corner will be sufficient. Mostly just to hold them down tightly to the floor and to lock-in the alignment of all the through holes.

Before the final paint / Line-X, they will be fully seam-sealed to prevent water from getting underneath and will give them a really clean integrated look with the floor.


-G

 

[JoshHefnerX]

Is this a squirrel moment, you weren't done w/ the gas tank were you?

 

[Greg72]

Is this a squirrel moment, you weren't done w/ the gas tank were you?

Josh,

It's worse than just that!!!

The fuel tank needs more work (clearly) and I need to drop about $1000 on fuel pumps and senders to move it along. For now it's "done enough" in that it effectively blocks-out the space so that my exhaust work can be finalized in the remaining spaces...

The cage plates arrived on Sunday, and I was excited to test fit them to provide feedback to my machinist... so the tank got pushed aside.

Then.... knowing that the bedfloor was going to be dropped into place in the coming weeks I need to go back and refine my exhaust routing which is going to force me to design new upper frameside link mount bracketry.... I've got some templates worked out in cardboard, but I'm not happy enough with them to render them in 1/4" plate steel (yet)

And...I still need to get some kind of overhead lifting system designed/installed to lift the cage up into the rafters so that I can get the bedfloor dropped into place when the time comes. I can do it "cheap and dangerous" with ratchet straps... or maybe a bit less dangerous with cable come-a-longs... or maybe a 12V HarborFreight winch setup?? Haven't really spent much time thinking about it, but I need to get started.


Initially, it seems like a really fragmented way to work but the nice thing is that bouncing between a few projects keeps things "fresh" and also gives my brain time to process the roadblocks that I hit, and come up with elegant solutions. Sometimes when you are stuck on a single task and trying to force a solution, you don't do your best thinking and tend to build in ways that aren't always very smart.

However, without SOME amount of pressure, you also don't ever get things finished... so a bit of stress can sometimes be it's own form of "inspiration" and lead to solutions too.


-G

 

[bp71k5]

Dig the cage plates. Don't dig the "cheap and dangerous" idea so much. Keep it safe over there.

Your planning to baffle/brace the inside of the tank with steel or another method?

 

[Greg72]

Dig the cage plates. Don't dig the "cheap and dangerous" idea so much. Keep it safe over there.

Your planning to baffle/brace the inside of the tank with steel or another method?

Definitely more internal bracing for the tank. I've got LOTS of stainless sheet left over, but I need to get the fuel pump in my hands (and a Holley Hydramat) to see how big the internal "baffle box" needs to be.

I ended up buying a nice Wilton 8" drillpress vise and a couple of slot-clamps today so I should be a lot more efficient drilling the remaining holes in the cage plates going forward.

SAFE is definitely the way to go. 2016 started off with a "bang" and really cost me a LOT of recovery time.



-G

 

[Bent77]

2018 is just around the corner. Avoid the ladder and good luck!

 

[JoshHefnerX]

You've had enough 'danger' in your garage...

 

[76zimmer]

Greg, maybe its already been hashed out, but will there be room for a body or two to sleep in the bed, for an excursion type outing, or would you be planning something exterior?

 

[Greg72]

Greg, maybe its already been hashed out, but will there be room for a body or two to sleep in the bed, for an excursion type outing, or would you be planning something exterior?

The addition of the rear strut towers was an unfortunate loss of delicious bed space, but for solo trips I can fit between those towers and sleep in the center of that space pretty comfortably.

The backup plan for a larger sleeping space is to stretch a large canvas-type tarp across the 4 rear vertical cage bars (above the strut towers) which will give me full-width / full-length sleeping surface. Strong eyelets at each corner could be used to hold the tarp, and a tensioning system (think: glorified ratchet strap system) could tighten up the perimeter and could also be designed to support the diagonals to prevent excessive sagging in the middle.

It seems like a valid option, and it's what I designed in my head when I realized the rear struts were going to cost me too much bed space. 4x8' sheets of lumber (my other minimum standard of K5 utility) will still fit also...the only concession, is that I have to load them at bedrail height instead of floor height. Ultimately, since I rarely expect to carry plywood / sheetrock it was an acceptable trade-off.


-G

 

[FOR MUD]

Josh,

It's worse than just that!!!

The fuel tank needs more work (clearly) and I need to drop about $1000 on fuel pumps and senders to move it along. For now it's "done enough" in that it effectively blocks-out the space so that my exhaust work can be finalized in the remaining spaces...

The cage plates arrived on Sunday, and I was excited to test fit them to provide feedback to my machinist... so the tank got pushed aside.

Then.... knowing that the bedfloor was going to be dropped into place in the coming weeks I need to go back and refine my exhaust routing which is going to force me to design new upper frameside link mount bracketry.... I've got some templates worked out in cardboard, but I'm not happy enough with them to render them in 1/4" plate steel (yet)

And...I still need to get some kind of overhead lifting system designed/installed to lift the cage up into the rafters so that I can get the bedfloor dropped into place when the time comes. I can do it "cheap and dangerous" with ratchet straps... or maybe a bit less dangerous with cable come-a-longs... or maybe a 12V HarborFreight winch setup?? Haven't really spent much time thinking about it, but I need to get started.


Initially, it seems like a really fragmented way to work but the nice thing is that bouncing between a few projects keeps things "fresh" and also gives my brain time to process the roadblocks that I hit, and come up with elegant solutions. Sometimes when you are stuck on a single task and trying to force a solution, you don't do your best thinking and tend to build in ways that aren't always very smart.

However, without SOME amount of pressure, you also don't ever get things finished... so a bit of stress can sometimes be it's own form of "inspiration" and lead to solutions too.


-G

I enjoy that "What comes first" part of a build.... Kind of a puzzle inside a puzzle. Can be a challenge not painting yourself into the corner at times.

 

[Greg72]

I enjoy that "What comes first" part of a build.... Kind of a puzzle inside a puzzle. Can be a challenge not painting yourself into the corner at times.

HA!

Yep, last night I was redesigning the frame side upper link mount hangers... its like working in a circle sometimes.

-G

 

[AgDieseler]

...its like working in a circle sometimes...

Truth.

David

 

[dremu]

4x8' sheets of lumber (my other minimum standard of K5 utility) will still fit also...the only concession, is that I have to load them at bedrail height instead of floor height. Ultimately, since I rarely expect to carry plywood / sheetrock it was an acceptable trade-off.
-G

I'll be curious to see if you can pull this off. I had tremendous hassle doing it when I tubbed in my dually wheel wells.

-- A

 

[Greg72]

2017.02.09 - UPDATE! - SPEED HOLE LINK MOUNTS!!!

As predicted, the rear frame-side link mounts need to go.... There's just no point trying to cut, shape and rework the original brackets to make clearance for the exhaust. When they were built, they needed to rely solely on the framerail for structural support. Now with all the additional tubework for both the rollcage and rocksliders, there are many more options to locate bracketry that can support that upper link equally well.... and do it in a way that still leaves plenty of clearance for the "crossover" portion of the exhaust system.

Step one was removing the old link mount:

This created a nice clean framerail and made it easier to visualize where new brackets could be hung...

This is the critical area where clearance needs to be maximized for the exhaust to pass through. This is a shot from the side of the truck looking toward the center (lower rear quarterpanel area, behind the torsion box)

As always.... paper templates were fitted and cut and modified to help generate ideas for a solution. The upper link is loaded in tension so the objective is to create bracketry that will resist the "PULL" of that link against the mount. The lateral 2"x3" rectangular tube used to support the cage seemed like a logical starting point. To resist deflection, additional triangulating plates were added on either side:

The paper templates..... in process:

A large plate will be added across the top of the assembly to tie the outer plates to the inner link mount brackets and to add even more strength against the "pull" effect of that upper link that wants to draw everything backward and out-of-position.

The view of the improved exhaust "crossover" area. There is a LOT of extra room now and it may even be possible to remove that V-band clamp completely and still get that tube out (if needed) once the bedfloor is reinstalled.

-G

 

[ashman]

do you have a pic of the area with the old bracket still in place? Just trying to visualize the difference.

 

[Greg72]

do you have a pic of the area with the old bracket still in place? Just trying to visualize the difference.

It's kind of a tough area to photograph due to the number of structures in that area..... but here's an overhead shot that shows the old mount and the exhaust trying to cross over the top of it.

-G

 

[folkenheath]

Nice work!

Seeing that empty 9" hole makes me think about all the research I did on centers, and I recommend this for the best all around center you can buy right now...

Strange HD Pro Case Set

Strange HD Pro Aluminum Complete Center

They offer it in all different configurations but it has the best oiling system and material of any aluminum center out there along with the through bolt design. You're best option is probably the 3.25 case with the 35 spline detroit locker (some prefer the ARB or truetrac). The case even allows large pinion 9.5 pro gears with the same pinion support, just a different bearing set. Which means if they ever offer large pinion 9.5 street gears there is even more potential. 40 spline is an option as well, but I don't think anyone makes a 40 spline locker.

Now if you are wanting high pinion (which I wouldn't think so with the portal axles, why drive it on the coast side when you don't need to) then Strange isn't the place to look. Or if you want nodular iron then they make that too along with every other company out there.

 

[Greg72]

Nice work!

Seeing that empty 9" hole makes me think about all the research I did on centers, and I recommend this for the best all around center you can buy right now...

Strange HD Pro Case Set

Strange HD Pro Aluminum Complete Center

They offer it in all different configurations but it has the best oiling system and material of any aluminum center out there along with the through bolt design. You're best option is probably the 3.25 case with the 35 spline detroit locker (some prefer the ARB or truetrac). The case even allows large pinion 9.5 pro gears with the same pinion support, just a different bearing set. Which means if they ever offer large pinion 9.5 street gears there is even more potential. 40 spline is an option as well, but I don't think anyone makes a 40 spline locker.

Now if you are wanting high pinion (which I wouldn't think so with the portal axles, why drive it on the coast side when you don't need to) then Strange isn't the place to look. Or if you want nodular iron then they make that too along with every other company out there.

Thanks Heath!

Believe it or not the "hot setup" for the locker isn't the 35-spline ARB (RD-99) it's got a ton of reliability issues with the locking collar. The BEST one to use is actually the 31-spline version which has been available forever and is well-understood and well-sorted. I'm not sure what that means for bearing size.... but it might use the smaller side bearings instead. I'd definitely go with the aluminum centers... they look cool and I can save some significant weight,

Remember that the 2-gear portal box changes the direction of the axleshafts in the conventional (low pinion) configuration. So the housings are actually "flipped" to create a high-pinion effect while still putting power to the drive side of the gearset. (This is commonly done with mid-engine sandrail type cars as well IIRC)... the only trick is making sure that the pinion gets properly oiled since it's pretty high up out of the oil vs. the normal low-pinion setup. I know that Currie sells a special pinion support to increase oiling.... and I think Strange and others do as well??? (Daytona support?).... Dunno exactly what is involved, but I know that it's an issue to keep in mind when I start buying 3rd parts.


-G