Nope.
Not unless you want to see house remodeling photos....
Tomorrow is a guaranteed shop day.
-G
Im up for good house remodeling pics....that's the other hobbie I have.
CK5
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'72 K5 - Greg's @MightAsWellK5 Build
- Thread starter Greg72
- Start date
This is the build description. I will improve this later. (GB)
Im up for good house remodeling pics....that's the other hobbie I have.
2015.01.05 - UPDATE - !!! HAPPY NEW YEAR, LET'S GET STARTED...!!!
Happy New Years everyone!
I've had a great couple of weeks off from work.... I ate too much, I drank too much and had a lot of great times with my family and friends. Hopefully you all did the same...
Yesterday, I stumbled out into the garage to survey the damage of a long holiday season and to dust off the cobwebs to see where I left off:
Not surprisingly, the truck was buried underneath a huge pile of debris and a small archeological dig was required to find it!
I restocked my supplies with gifts from Santa...
....and YES there is still too much chocolate kicking around the house that is still finding me!
Eventually, I got the truck exposed again and removed the rear wheel and portal to get a closer look at the framerail project.
This reminded me what a total pain it had been to climb over the axle and 4-link to get into position to take measurements and get new parts fitted up... clearly the best course of action for efficiency was to spend an hour or so giving myself a better work area.
So I pulled out all the rear links, the axle housing and the P.S. wheeltub....
Much better!
The next thing that happened was I looked at my hodge-podge framerail that was built just before the holiday. It was kind of a mess.... lots of small scabbed-together sections....lots of rust that would need to be bead blasted somehow and still a LOT more work to build it as a fully boxed framerail replacement. It just didn't seem like the right direction to go anymore, so I grabbed a fresh length of 2" x 4" rectangular tubing off the metal rack and started over... using the old version as a template.
Basically for the lateral C-notch... all you need to do is pick an angle that you like and cut notches on both sides of the tube, when you draw the notches together and weld them, the angles "cancel each other out" so to speak and the overall section of tube is still straight but with a nice "C" shaped transition in the middle of it.
Here's a shot with a few of those "V's" closed up and tack welded in place:
With the 4 inside "V's" cut and tacked into place, I ended up with the C-notch that is needed to clear the upper link mount brackets on my rear axle....
It's a good start, but the framerail back there isn't completely flat... in fact, due to the amount of uptravel of the rear axle... it needs to sweep UP in a pretty dramatic fashion to prevent a collision between the underside framerail and the axle truss....
A few more "V's" cut in the vertical axes allowed me to create a 12* slope for the front of the framerail (which picks up the factory frame angle), and I did an 18* angle at the rear which will end up landing just before the massive rear crossmember / recovery hitch setup.
The end result is quite elegant and nicely rendered!
The only thing left to do was to cut out the hot-mess frame section on the current frame so that I could begin the fitment of the new frame section. I thought it would be good to take care of this late last night while I still had the courage to do it..... now I don't have a choice, I HAVE TO figure out how to merge these two parts together...
I'll see how that goes tonight!!!!
-G
Happy New Years everyone!
I've had a great couple of weeks off from work.... I ate too much, I drank too much and had a lot of great times with my family and friends. Hopefully you all did the same...
Yesterday, I stumbled out into the garage to survey the damage of a long holiday season and to dust off the cobwebs to see where I left off:
Not surprisingly, the truck was buried underneath a huge pile of debris and a small archeological dig was required to find it!
I restocked my supplies with gifts from Santa...
....and YES there is still too much chocolate kicking around the house that is still finding me!
Eventually, I got the truck exposed again and removed the rear wheel and portal to get a closer look at the framerail project.
This reminded me what a total pain it had been to climb over the axle and 4-link to get into position to take measurements and get new parts fitted up... clearly the best course of action for efficiency was to spend an hour or so giving myself a better work area.
So I pulled out all the rear links, the axle housing and the P.S. wheeltub....
Much better!
The next thing that happened was I looked at my hodge-podge framerail that was built just before the holiday. It was kind of a mess.... lots of small scabbed-together sections....lots of rust that would need to be bead blasted somehow and still a LOT more work to build it as a fully boxed framerail replacement. It just didn't seem like the right direction to go anymore, so I grabbed a fresh length of 2" x 4" rectangular tubing off the metal rack and started over... using the old version as a template.
Basically for the lateral C-notch... all you need to do is pick an angle that you like and cut notches on both sides of the tube, when you draw the notches together and weld them, the angles "cancel each other out" so to speak and the overall section of tube is still straight but with a nice "C" shaped transition in the middle of it.
Here's a shot with a few of those "V's" closed up and tack welded in place:
With the 4 inside "V's" cut and tacked into place, I ended up with the C-notch that is needed to clear the upper link mount brackets on my rear axle....
It's a good start, but the framerail back there isn't completely flat... in fact, due to the amount of uptravel of the rear axle... it needs to sweep UP in a pretty dramatic fashion to prevent a collision between the underside framerail and the axle truss....
A few more "V's" cut in the vertical axes allowed me to create a 12* slope for the front of the framerail (which picks up the factory frame angle), and I did an 18* angle at the rear which will end up landing just before the massive rear crossmember / recovery hitch setup.
The end result is quite elegant and nicely rendered!
The only thing left to do was to cut out the hot-mess frame section on the current frame so that I could begin the fitment of the new frame section. I thought it would be good to take care of this late last night while I still had the courage to do it..... now I don't have a choice, I HAVE TO figure out how to merge these two parts together...
I'll see how that goes tonight!!!!
-G
I am sure you have a plan, so what are you using to make sure it stays level and square before welding the new piece back in?
I am sure you have a plan, so what are you using to make sure it stays level and square before welding the new piece back in?
I leveled the whole truck on jackstands before making any cuts. I plan on only doing one side at a time and running my digital level across the framerails to make sure things are cool before final welding. Realistically, there isn't a whole lot of frame left at the very end (maybe 12") it might have been better to just run the new frame all the way out the back and redo the crossmember to fit the new rails?
-G
I leveled the whole truck on jackstands before making any cuts. I plan on only doing one side at a time and running my digital level across the framerails to make sure things are cool before final welding. Realistically, there isn't a whole lot of frame left at the very end (maybe 12") it might have been better to just run the new frame all the way out the back and redo the crossmember to fit the new rails?
-G
"Might as well"™
"Might as well"™
I think it ultimately saves me time to just scrap the entire frame from that first cut-line near the upper link hanger....
The belief is strong enough that I already ordered up some additional 2" x 4" tubing so that I'll have enough material to do it.
-G
As an aside, how well insulated from the house is your garage? I just got to thinking about all the cutting/grinding you've been doing and wondered how that translates to the wife and kids in the house.
It's not bad. Charlie's room is closest to the garage, but I think the only thing that will really bother him when he's sleeping are the sharp hammer strikes on steel... those really "ring". The rest of the noises I think are mostly muffled or are low-frequency stuff that is easier to ignore.
I tend to be pretty careful working in the shop. I'm not the kind of person who throws materials around, and makes a lot of noise to begin with.... I wouldn't necessarily call it a "tranquil" environment, but things are pretty mellow in there most of the time.
-G
Mmmmmm love that new frame smell
It's not bad. Charlie's room is closest to the garage, but I think the only thing that will really bother him when he's sleeping are the sharp hammer strikes on steel... those really "ring". The rest of the noises I think are mostly muffled or are low-frequency stuff that is easier to ignore.
I tend to be pretty careful working in the shop. I'm not the kind of person who throws materials around, and makes a lot of noise to begin with.... I wouldn't necessarily call it a "tranquil" environment, but things are pretty mellow in there most of the time.
-G
I'm one noisy mofo..
I don't how you can work at night with the family there...
grinding, cutoff's, the comp, etc are screaming all the time when I'm in the shop..
I live in shooter's muffs...
2015.01.07 - UPDATE! - FISH PLATE SPECIAL....!!!!!
Waiting on some new 2" x 4" tubing so that I can build the DS frame rail... I'd kind of like to do these in pairs so that I can compare dimensions and insure that they are perfect mirror-image parts before I weld this first one into place.
Speaking of that. Here's my "back of the napkin" sketch of how I think it's going to work:
Basically, the new tubing is exactly 1/4" smaller overall than the I.D. of the "stock" factory framerail.... so to get it in there tightly it needs a 1/8" thick plate on each side to take up the gaps.
Fortunately, if I fillet a small section of that same 2" x 4" tube I end up with 4 pieces of shim material that all have the proper corner radius built-right-in!! When laid around the framerail, it creates the correct overall dimensions I need, and leaves a 1/4" gap between the parts. Perfect for laying down a weld bead when the time comes!
Here's a mockup showing one plate inside the frame and out outside for illustration purposes.
I did a test fit with some small scraps and the result was awesome. Everything was really tight and I actually had to tap the shims into position with a hammer and drift. That tells me that the odds of welding all of this together ahead of time (and then sliding it into the old frame section) is NOT going to happen. Ultimately the assembly process should go as follows:
That's about it for that part. Then I need to start laying out more fishplates across the remaining vertical seams to add more strength to those as well....
This cute little diamond pattern is the right idea, but realistically as I looked at it the right method would involve making it a LOT wider (across the frame) to also incorporate the next two vertical bends in a single plate. Basically it's the diamond shape stretched to about 8" wide...
Across the top and bottom of the frame there is another opportunity to cut a single strip of 1/8" plate to follow the curved profile of the frame and lock that whole thing together....
As you can see, if I smooth-out those corners by running the metal plate straight across it gives me a nice little "landing pad" for some 1.75" DOM tubing in two spots. These would be obvious places to build a triangulated tube support the rear ORIs directly off the framerail and would put the entire strut assembly into a nice double-shear mounting. I'm already going to lose interior space as a result of the wider rear wheeltubs, so dropping a couple of tubes down just to the inside of the tubs isn't going to cost me much space... but will add a TON of strength to the rear mounts.
We'll see......
-G
Waiting on some new 2" x 4" tubing so that I can build the DS frame rail... I'd kind of like to do these in pairs so that I can compare dimensions and insure that they are perfect mirror-image parts before I weld this first one into place.
Speaking of that. Here's my "back of the napkin" sketch of how I think it's going to work:
Basically, the new tubing is exactly 1/4" smaller overall than the I.D. of the "stock" factory framerail.... so to get it in there tightly it needs a 1/8" thick plate on each side to take up the gaps.
Fortunately, if I fillet a small section of that same 2" x 4" tube I end up with 4 pieces of shim material that all have the proper corner radius built-right-in!!
When laid around the framerail, it creates the correct overall dimensions I need, and leaves a 1/4" gap between the parts. Perfect for laying down a weld bead when the time comes!Here's a mockup showing one plate inside the frame and out outside for illustration purposes.
I did a test fit with some small scraps and the result was awesome. Everything was really tight and I actually had to tap the shims into position with a hammer and drift. That tells me that the odds of welding all of this together ahead of time (and then sliding it into the old frame section) is NOT going to happen. Ultimately the assembly process should go as follows:
- Cut out fillet pieces to match the fishmouth profile in pic
- Predrill the original frame with 3 holes per shim for a plug weld
- Predrill the shim with the same 3 holes so that the puddle locks all three thicknesses of metal to each other
- Insert new frame section
- Insert all 4 shims and hammer to final position (aligning all plug weld holes)
- Puddle in the holes, then perimeter weld the gaps and fishmouth areas as shown in illustration
That's about it for that part. Then I need to start laying out more fishplates across the remaining vertical seams to add more strength to those as well....
This cute little diamond pattern is the right idea, but realistically as I looked at it the right method would involve making it a LOT wider (across the frame) to also incorporate the next two vertical bends in a single plate. Basically it's the diamond shape stretched to about 8" wide...
Across the top and bottom of the frame there is another opportunity to cut a single strip of 1/8" plate to follow the curved profile of the frame and lock that whole thing together....
As you can see, if I smooth-out those corners by running the metal plate straight across it gives me a nice little "landing pad" for some 1.75" DOM tubing in two spots. These would be obvious places to build a triangulated tube support the rear ORIs directly off the framerail and would put the entire strut assembly into a nice double-shear mounting. I'm already going to lose interior space as a result of the wider rear wheeltubs, so dropping a couple of tubes down just to the inside of the tubs isn't going to cost me much space... but will add a TON of strength to the rear mounts.
We'll see......
-G
K20Chevrolet
1/2 ton status
2015.01.07 - UPDATE! - FISH PLATE SPECIAL....!!!!!
Waiting on some new 2" x 4" tubing so that I can build the DS frame rail... I'd kind of like to do these in pairs so that I can compare dimensions and insure that they are perfect mirror-image parts before I weld this first one into place.
Speaking of that. Here's my "back of the napkin" sketch of how I think it's going to work:
Basically, the new tubing is exactly 1/4" smaller overall than the I.D. of the "stock" factory framerail.... so to get it in there tightly it needs a 1/8" thick plate on each side to take up the gaps.
Fortunately, if I fillet a small section of that same 2" x 4" tube I end up with 4 pieces of shim material that all have the proper corner radius built-right-in!!
Here's a mockup showing one plate inside the frame and out outside for illustration purposes.
I did a test fit with some small scraps and the result was awesome. Everything was really tight and I actually had to tap the shims into position with a hammer and drift. That tells me that the odds of welding all of this together ahead of time (and then sliding it into the old frame section) is NOT going to happen. Ultimately the assembly process should go as follows:
- Cut out fillet pieces to match the fishmouth profile in pic
- Predrill the original frame with 3 holes per shim for a plug weld
- Predrill the shim with the same 3 holes so that the puddle locks all three thicknesses of metal to each other
- Insert new frame section
- Insert all 4 shims and hammer to final position (aligning all plug weld holes)
- Puddle in the holes, then perimeter weld the gaps and fishmouth areas as shown in illustration
That's about it for that part. Then I need to start laying out more fishplates across the remaining vertical seams to add more strength to those as well....
This cute little diamond pattern is the right idea, but realistically as I looked at it the right method would involve making it a LOT wider (across the frame) to also incorporate the next two vertical bends in a single plate. Basically it's the diamond shape stretched to about 8" wide...
Across the top and bottom of the frame there is another opportunity to cut a single strip of 1/8" plate to follow the curved profile of the frame and lock that whole thing together....
As you can see, if I smooth-out those corners by running the metal plate straight across it gives me a nice little "landing pad" for some 1.75" DOM tubing in two spots. These would be obvious places to build a triangulated tube support the rear ORIs directly off the framerail and would put the entire strut assembly into a nice double-shear mounting. I'm already going to lose interior space as a result of the wider rear wheeltubs, so dropping a couple of tubes down just to the inside of the tubs isn't going to cost me much space... but will add a TON of strength to the rear mounts.
We'll see......
-G
Looking great. I would also add a fish plate between the old and new frame rail though as the only thing holding the frame in the way you drew it is the weld around the end of the old frame and the 3 plug welds. Time for some new speed hole fish plates to tie this joint together... just my opinion. Might as well, when you are going this far already!
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There are 24 plug welds passing through from the original frame to the new frame section..... 6 per side, 4 sides.
-G
-G
K20Chevrolet
1/2 ton status
I don´t question the amount of plug welds. Just not sure if a plug weld is as strong as a longer weld bead.
Why not make the holes in the original frame section larger (might be more pain to allign it then) but then you could do a circumferential weld around each hole. Might be stronger than plug welds.
Looks great... as usual
Looks fancy as usual!
Why do you need the metal plate to weld the 1.75" DOM there? Why not just weld it directly to the rectangular tube? Isn't that 2" wide?
Why do you need the metal plate to weld the 1.75" DOM there? Why not just weld it directly to the rectangular tube? Isn't that 2" wide?
It just allows me a bit more flexibility on where I land the tube.
You could exaggerate that effect a bit further (with a gusset on the underside) and probably have mounting options +/- 4" from where the true frame center is at that spot.
I still want to modify and drop the stock rear seat into position to see how narrow it needs to be for the wheeltubs and these new triangulated strut bars. Once I get the seat where I want it, the final location of those DOM landing spots will be determined.... at this point, I just want to leave myself some flexibility and not permanently weld in that top plate (or commit to it's final shape) until I get a few other things figured out.
-G
I think it might break.. In my opinion.. And I'm not just some guy, cardboard is not nearly strong enough.. And when you weld it cardboard has a tendency to burn.. That's not really good for fusion.
Don't go by only what you see in those pics.
I am planning to use a scissor to cut holes for "glue plugs"... And once everything is thouroughly glued and dried, I am covering it all with a paper mâché topcoat, and then some Ryoken green zinc chromate. The zinc will make it burn-proof.
I am an automotive engineer.
-G
