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Aftermarket EFI

Edelbrock's MPFI is junk when you compare it to Accel's DFI. DFI is also cheaper (or it used to be).



For what you spend on a aftermarket fuel injection system and a budget rebuild of a cast iron small block you can buy a LS1 complete with mantrans computer and then pick up LS1EDIT. 200lbs lighter and easily make 350hp without opening up the motor. Makes more torque at 1200rpm than your current motor peaks at. Kind of a no-brainer to me.
 
You know, I shoudl research the LS1 option. Not only would it be different, but if I'm going to spend $3500-4000 to build a motor and I can use factory stuff such as that to make it work, that sure might be the hot ticket.

This is kinda in the back of my mind. My Q-jet right now damn near works on its side, I've got two TBI setups, but I've just got this idea burning the back of my head. Maybe I should throw TBI on it, put off the engine mods, and do the LS1 in the future.

Decisions, decisions.

Dirtwarrior,

As Doran already pointed out, there are plenty of places to discuss factory EFI options. This is an idea I got in my head and I figured I'd bring it up on the board. Outside of the realm of emissions, there are TONS of ideas for EFI that will make for a more powerful and efficient running setup that puts the factory to shame, it's just like anything else, how how much is it worth to you, and what degree do you want to go for the ultimate in performance?
 
I guess what im trying to figure out is if they both support the desired hp goal(400) then what is the difference? besides getting mpfi? It sounds like chip burning is involved with both. Not trying to hijack, I just don't see where your compromising any performance.
 
dirtwarrior17 said:
I guess what im trying to figure out is if they both support the desired hp goal(400) then what is the difference? besides getting mpfi? It sounds like chip burning is involved with both. Not trying to hijack, I just don't see where your compromising any performance.
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The difference is that I want 100% control over my fuel map and ignition map at my fingertips. This is something that cannot be accomplished with factory fuel injection.

If I can't have that I'll just install TBI and live with the anemic power output indefinitely.
 
dirtwarrior17 said:
I thought thats what a prominator was for...
Click to expand...

Well you thought wrong, because i'm not going to erase and reprogram a PLC every time I want my maps to change.
 
I kida agree with CyberSnyper about Accel's DFI. It is prolly one of the most versitile aftermarket FI systems out there. I would definatly check into it before you buy anything else. It will give you the most bang for the buck. Its easy to program with a laptop. Very good easy to use Windows based software package. You can control almost all of the engine functions and some tranny functions like TC lock up.
 
Tim to be absolutely honest and whether this is off-topic I'm going to say it anyways.

If you can live with your Q-jet, do so. With your application, if a carb isn't cutting out on you, or causing other problems, IMO, swapping to EFI just isn't worth it.

Don't get me wrong, I love my TPI, and it runs great. I won't be going back to a carb, ever. Heck, the new motor may have tons more power than it did with carb (guess it did blow my gov-lock up) but the truck sat so long between the two, and I didn't do a before/after dyno test, so it's really impossible (being honest here) to know what kind of difference the injection made. Besides the fact I added headers, roller cam, and the engine is nice and tight.

The motor is strong, it runs good, (not ideal, chip burning and new injectors are on the horizon of course) but to be honest, the Q-jet when tuned right, ran just as well for me. For a daily driver, the choke sometimes sucked, and so on, but if it was just a trail rig, I really think I'd hold off until a carb just doesn't cut it. The amount of money required to swap over (like the $2200 Edelbrock) is just an obscene amount if you are going to replace something that works ok already.
 
Go to thirdgen.org and start reading everything on the TPI and similar boards. You really need to figure out what making 400HP with TPI takes from real world experience.

That place seems a little sketchy to me. The guy isn't here to defend himself, but just looking at the vortec manifold pictures, I see a few "problems", even if those aren't the finished product.

Other than that, the rest of the stuff looks like stock GM TPI with siamesed/larger diameter runners, different fuel rails (due solely to the larger runners?) and then some larger injectors and a free chip burn.

You should be able to pick up stock TPI (complete) for $500. Used components, so figure what that is worth to you to get all new sensors, etc., but that's not ("starting at") $1900.

That setup doesn't look to me like it will be enough to make 400HP. Maybe with a good set of heads you can do it, but like I say, go to thirdgen, as there are people there that know what it takes to get there, because they've done it.
 
CyberSniper said:
For what you spend on a aftermarket fuel injection system and a budget rebuild of a cast iron small block you can buy a LS1 complete with mantrans computer and then pick up LS1EDIT. 200lbs lighter and easily make 350hp without opening up the motor. Makes more torque at 1200rpm than your current motor peaks at. Kind of a no-brainer to me.
Click to expand...

Ill second that idea. Sure makes good sense. Heck even to grab a 8.1 would be pretty bad a$$ to me, oh wait, he wants adjustability.
 
P1010003.jpg


Mmmmm tastey
Edelbrock burns the chip only with your cam specs so the ECM can 'plug' thoes numbers into it's calculations being fed in by all the sensors on the engine. The hand held control unit plugs into the main harness when you want to change a setting or two. You can adjust spark, fuel and air. THe control modual also displays alot of vauable info the sensors are producing to help when troubleshooting. It even will tell you what sensor had failed or is way out of range for whatever reason. There are many different combinations you can use for the enviroment the engine is being used in. Basically there are 3 different senarios to set up for. WOT (sand dunes or drag racing) Fuel economy(freeway driving) and Lowend towing (trail busting). The is a 100% stand alone setup, everything you need to convert a carbed engine to MPFI comes with the kit.
 
So with the cam swap scenario, how does that work with the "chip"?

If you had the inclinaton, could you make all changes yourself with the hand held unit, or will it only let you do so much before you need another chip?

I'm kind of at a loss why you would have settings for how the engine should run though...my experience is based on factory stuff, but the ECM should "know" whether you want to have power or if you need economy. Seems odd why the ECM Edelbrock uses doesn't "automatically" do this. Cruise and WOT are two totally seperate events and the SHOULD be able to have both "sets of data" in it for them. :confused:

Guess I could read up on it, but its better to hear from those that actually use it.
 
Basically if you change your cam shaft you need a new chip from Edlebrock (1 to 2 days wait).

The settings you can change are simply to dial in or fine tune the perfect ratios. You don't 'have to' set up for them but if you are in compitition or racing you want the adjustability to optimize your engines potential.

Like WOT ~ If you are useing this setup on a Drag car then you would adjust your WOT settings, run your car down the strip and note your times, adjust again and drag the car again. When your times increase you are going in the right direction when they decrease you need to go back in your setting. The idea is you fine tune your injection system to the best performance of your engine.

Fuel economy ~ This one you adjust while going down the hwy (Well for safty reasons Edel. says to have someone in your pass seat do it:D ) after you are up to hwy speed you can cut the fuel back then adjust spark forward giving you best fuel economy.

Once you shut your engine off the ECM resets to the default configuration (A)
You can save any configuration to (B) or (C) so you don't have to 'fine tune' every time you want to run the drag strip or get the best possiable fuel econmy.
You dig?
 
Yep, I got it now.

Might as well call this thread dead anyways, Tim's been banned, so it's not like he's going to be reading any more of this. I guess if anyone wants to hijack, he won't be complaining at this point.

Apparently that entails no email or PM's (duh) either, so that's it.
 
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