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Black Betty TBI swap

mrdrinksalil said:
So I think I've got my shopping list from MOATES complete but I have a question for those who have done this.

I am planning on the Burn2, a G2 Memory adapter, (2) C2 sst 27sf512 chips.
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This way works fine for a daily street driven vehicle that sees little or no off-road service.

mrdrinksalil said:
Can you solder the G2 directly into the board? Once I go to the EEPROM chips I dont see why I should need an original 24 pin socket.
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Yes, the G2 can be soldered directly to the '7747 board.

mrdrinksalil said:
If I can't solder in the G2 and have to go with a D1 24pin socket then the G2, is the 28-Pin ZIF socket necessary or can you just use a plain 28 pin IC socket?? I dont like the idea of the ZIF socket outside the ecu considering this is a rock crawler that lives outside with no windshield or doors.
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What I do for off-road service is modify a 28 pin zif socket to work exactly like the G2, and I then solder the modified 28 pin zif socket directly onto the '7747 board. The 27SF512 chip and modified zif socket fit nicely under the '7747 access cover.:D

I plan to modify a '7747 with a 28 pin zif socket in the next week or so ... I can take pictures when I do the mod. Maybe you'd like me to modify your '7747? I'll even program the 27SF512 with a stock 350 baseline .bin (with or without emissions) file if you want.

dave w
 
man I really appreciate the offer but with your guidence I think I can handle the soldering work and the ZIF modification. Why dont you take some notes and detailed pics. I'll order up a ZIF and some chips and burner ASAP. I got called out of town for the next few days on buisness.
 
ok, Burn2, 28 pin ZIF socket and two chips are in the mail from moates. Waiting on the laptop battery to data log. Might get the power invertor out tonight to data log though.
 
I've had trouble using a power inverter when data logging. I don't know if the trouble is related to the software, or the trouble is in my laptop.

dave w
 
wow the truck sure does run like a turd. I drove it around a little bit here tonight and logged minimal data. Attached is the BLM data. Fuel pressure is right at 12psi. At one point the truck stalled and when I started it back up it backfired loud enough that my ears hurt. wtf. Also noticed code 42 was set and I haven't had the est bypass unplugged in a long time and the ecu has been unplugged several times since.

I think I know what your advice is gonna be but let me know...

DataLog7_20.JPG

DataLogSample#7_20.JPG
 
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mrdrinksalil said:
wow the truck sure does run like a turd. I drove it around a little bit here tonight and logged minimal data. Attached is the BLM data. Fuel pressure is right at 12psi. At one point the truck stalled and when I started it back up it backfired loud enough that my ears hurt. wtf. Also noticed code 42 was set and I haven't had the est bypass unplugged in a long time and the ecu has been unplugged several times since.

I think I know what your advice is gonna be but let me know...
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The log numbers clearly show the engine is running lean. The ideal number is 128, any number above 128 is lean, and any number below 128 is rich. The accepted window for lean / rich is (+ / -) 2, so numbers between 126 ~ 130 are considered good.

Based on what I see, I would adjust the Base Pulse Width (BPW) up 3 maybe 4 more. As a guess, the BPW is usually 134, so I set the BPW to 137 or 138 if you BPW was 134. I'm sure it goes without saying, but the only way to change BPW is change the PROM programming.

dave w
 
What he said^

But refresh our memories on your engine. Is it stock? What ECM and chip to start?

What your describing above, even though you have 13 PSI fuel presure sounds like it is loosing fuel presure off idle. Is there anyway to watch fuel pressure while driving? I know specs are 9 to 13 PSI but I have never seen one run right at anything other than 13 PSI. If you are now at 12 look for a clogged filter, kinked line or some cause for restriction. If none found look up how to make your regulater adjustable and get it up to 13 PSI and check data. If the same try 14 PSI and data should be way closer. One pound fuel pressure can fix all sorts of issues including running lean...

I have never had an issue with the new chips mounted directly in the G2 soldered to the board... on or off road...
 
For the reminder its a gen1 350 (1982) with an edelbrock intake and an adapter. The doner truck was a c10 with a tbi350.

I've got the fuel pressure gauge under the hood. When I looked at it last night it looked to be roughly 12psi and if I hit the throttle the pressure didn't drop. What in the data looks like it was falling off?

I have allready spent MANY hours adjusting fuel pressure and rebuilt the regulator two dozen times (no joke). I've extensively checked the fuel lines when I was tracking down the previous issue that ended up being a cracked spark plug. The fuel lines are all brand new -6 stainless braided stuff. At this point I am VERY confident there is nothing wrong with the supply and return lines or size or possible restriction.

I'll adjust the fuel pressure up a bit but the MOATES stuff should be here tomorrow.

Any ideas as to why I had code 42 set?
 
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OK since your familar with it make it 13 PSI.

If your timing wire has been disconected it will set a 42. Clear the codes and if you get it again then replace the EST (module in distributor) This is the only part of these systems that is varible. Everything else either works or does not, this piece has proven to be a gremlin time after time. If you have it tested at a parts store. Ask them to test three times. If it fails any time it's bad, even if not replace it as this is the only part I will say to replace rather than diagnose do to previous experiance. HTH!
 
eagle mark said:
If your timing wire has been disconected it will set a 42. Clear the codes and if you get it again then replace the EST (module in distributor) This is the only part of these systems that is varible. Everything else either works or does not, this piece has proven to be a gremlin time after time. If you have it tested at a parts store. Ask them to test three times. If it fails any time it's bad, even if not replace it as this is the only part I will say to replace rather than diagnose do to previous experiance. HTH!
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GOod to know. I allready changed it one time when I was diagnosising what turned out to be the cracked spark plug. The spare I put in there could have a glitch. I'll clear it and see if it comes back again. I know it didn't come up due to the bypass wire being disconnected cause I havn't touched it since initial start up and base timing.

This DIY tuning stuff if fun, dont get me wrong, but damn I wanna go crawl some ****in ROCKS!
 
Wait till you crawl with EFI!!! It's way better. Once you have worked out the bugs it's also very long term reliable! Some people only read these threads were a guy had problems. If you take all the problem threads you will see it's usually human error on the installation. Then the truck runs forever and instead of opening the hood to adjust the carb you need to remember to open the hood to check oil!
 
My neighbor asked me yesterday if I was building a house under that hood. I laughed and told him once this efi is done im welding the hood shut. hahaha
 
So the moates stuff is gonna be at the house today. Guess I need to figure out how to burn a chip.

Does the Burn2 come with instructions? I am going to mess with tunercats and/or tuner pro tonight if I have time.
 
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mrdrinksalil said:
So the moates stuff is gonna be at the house today. Guess I need to figure out how to burn a chip.

Does the Burn2 come with instructions? I am going to mess with tunercats and/or tuner pro tonight if I have time.
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The most important thing to figure out for 27SF512 chip and the '7747 ECM is the offset. The '7747 chip is a 4K chip, but the 27SF512 chip is 512K chip. The offset "tricks" 27SF512 chip to work like a 4K chip. I can post some screen shots that help. The Burn 2 needs a USB driver installed. Then the fun begins.

Here is link that can help.

http://www.moates.net/manuals/FlashAndBurn.pdf

dave w
 
ok so ive got my burn2 hooked up and the driver installed. Downloaded Flash and Burn, Aldltobin, TunerCATS RT Tuner, and saved a bin that Dave W emailed me a while back and I opened it in TunerCATS and looked at the fuel table. Am I cool yet! :haha:

Enough computer time I'm gonna go pull the ECU and chip outta the rig and see if I can figure out how to read the stock chips .bin file.

Baby steps.
 
ok so I put the stock chip in the burn2 selected 2732a, hit read chip and then saved to buffer file. Tried to open in CATS and it says "selected source file is either corrupt or unrecognized format". I know the instructions on the flashandburn you provided say
"Note: All addresses and file sizes must be 64-byte aligned. " But I dont know what that means.

What am I missing?


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UPDATE: Took me forever to get the aldltobin program to work. Most of that was probably because I was trying to use the stock bin I tried to read with the Burn2 and I obviously arn't doing that right. So I used the bin Dave gave me and was able to make the aldltobin program work and loaded it into CATS. What an ugly fuel table.

So what are some tips on smoothing the table out? Should I not mess with the cells that I had a good amount of data in and just the ones around those???
 
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