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Building the Ultimate GM vehicle

Its still gonna be heavy even if you cut it shorter.

The t-case will still be a slip yoke if the truck is '80 or newer. And if its a K30 up to '84, the 465 tranny will still have 10 splines. '85 and newer K30's have 32 spline and slip yokes again. Would either have to replace that with a fixed yoke or find a whole replacement t-case.

I'd still prefer a SWB truck for the weight. And IMO, its gonna flex better than the K30 frame, too, since its not as tall a frame as the K30 is.
 
yellowK20 said:
I still say K-30 cut the rear short then you start with the HD stuff I think it would be cheaper in the long run Because then your not Buying the good axles and t-case you already have them
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And if it's military/diesel, no smog. Better frame too. 11.00x16.00 Michelin XLs are very streetable, affordable, and effective.
 
thatK30guy said:
Its still gonna be heavy even if you cut it shorter.

The t-case will still be a slip yoke if the truck is '80 or newer. And if its a K30 up to '84, the 465 tranny will still have 10 splines. '85 and newer K30's have 32 spline and slip yokes again. Would either have to replace that with a fixed yoke or find a whole replacement t-case.

I'd still prefer a SWB truck for the weight. And IMO, its gonna flex better than the K30 frame, too, since its not as tall a frame as the K30 is.
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You're right. Blazer bodies are too long and heavy and fight the fame flex, which hurts both, but may or may not be relevant depending on the cage. I will prolly end up building a CUCV for the reasons I mentioned...I intend to have a 500 cid Caddy to help with the weight :D .

I think the truck should be affordably done and practical. Here's my brother's.

Carbed 305, intake, exhaust. Built TH350, F*RD NP208 slip yoke. HP F*ORD 60, ARB, 4.56. 14BFF, Detroit, 4.56. F-150 rear springs, Tahoe rears in the front. The truck is light, stripped interior, one gas tank moved to the bed, no winch or cage, racing buckets. 11.00x16.00 XLs. No bed floor, and the stepside is almost like a narrowed bed. It works very well, even with the little 305, climbs dunes. He intends to finish his doubler with F*RD 205, cage is in the works, and engine choice is up in the air. He's thinking about mogs now too... He gets half his flex from his frame, but it is eventually going to get tired and break...this is where the 1/2 ton vs 1 ton frame question comes into play. If you go 1/2 ton you get flex and light weight, unless you add a cage, in which case you become heavier, but stronger. Probably the ideal setup. I'll probably use the 1 ton frame cuz the wheelbase fits what I intend to do.

In my opinion, and to the extent of my knowledge, the best bang for the buck when it comes to a building platform is a CUCV (or diesel K30). Can be had for cheap, body is usually OK, but doesn't matter, grill guard and tow points if you like, and can be run diesel or gas with no smog problems. Already has 4.56 gears and one locker. Combine with XLs (siped?), standard chevy beefup stuff (Xover, steering bracing, flexy leaves, etc.) and a front Traction Aiding Device, and you're golden. Only downside I see is the Tcase, but that depends on your engine, your right foot, and your terrain. Also can double as a work/tow rig, which is part of the reason I want to use one. Wheelbase helps with DL angles too...

Noticed this K30 flex pic when I was looking for a pic of my brother's truck. Appears to have some frame flex :D

EDIT: I prefer auto cuz a stick is pretty useless duning.

PS This thread is AWESOME. I've been waiting for/wanting to start a build theory thread. COG material?

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The ideas so far are great.
My quick little personel disclaimer. Those of you that know me also know who I am related to. I am doing this for research for myself as well as them. Remember I am only related not on the payroll.

Now I will throw one more little curve ball.

Something will be built in the next three months.
This vehicle will go to an event that will have major coverage.
It needs to be a showcase vehicle that sells parts and it may not survive the trip with all of it's body simply because we have learned that the guy that makes stuff look easy does not get the coverage. It will be loud and get beat on just to get attention.

Pauly, I like your idea and that is really the point of me asking this question. Part of the problem that seems to always come up is the "working mans" truck vs. the "cool dude parts truck". This is a business decision that hopefully CK5 gets to have a some influence on.
What do you do if you have access to coilovers in the rear, coil kit in the front, doubler, production bumpers etc?
Not that that stuff is just laying around and free but it is possible and feasable. It sells parts and shows off the design and ability of a company to build skillfully the parts that the "working man" can afford and will buy at the same time it gives him the dream to want to buy the "cool dude parts" cause they are cool.

That is what I personally think needs to be built.
There is a Crew cab truck in the line up that is kinda beat to start with. It could be shortened and a tube bed built. No short beds laying around to do a tapered bed on.
There is a 454 that is a good known running motor.
Trans will be a auto. It will be something that is around but in good condition or put together from the best parts that are laying around.
A doubler will most likely be used
Front suspension could be a coil with a shock next to it, or it could be leaves.
Front axle will be a D60 that is locked? don't know the locker.
Rear most likely will remain leaves BUT could be coiled or coilover.
Of course the rear will be a 14 bolt with a locker. Type yet to be determined.

Body protection will be used and everything else will either be functional or there for surviveability/reliablity. There is still a fine line between cost and need in this area.

This is not a great example of the "working mans" truck but at the same time it is not a great example of the "cool dude parts" truck.

Thaks guys
 
If it's gonna advertise, that changes the point some - go for it. Showcase as much as you can without becoming blingy or overexpensive one-off custom. Crewcab=cooler. You got my vote.
 
From the selling parts point of view I would try to make it look like a one stop shopping trip. You guys know all that stuff works, so build to showcase it. Cut the rear quarters high enough so you can see the shackle flip, the fronts to show the HD shackles. We all know ORD here, but not every one out there does. Cram the most ORD stuff onto it you can-even if its someone else's stuff that they sell, like TC or TR.
 
Thanks for the input and help guys I am sure that the results will show and the pics of build progress will be shown here.
Keep giving input.
 
MTMike said:
I'm shooting to have the cab swap done by July 1

I'll surely post pictures
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Mike, I hope you're planning on bringing it to DR 06...I want to see the beast! Too bad about the paint job, I guess you now have an option for something else.:D
 
mouse said:
Mike, I hope you're planning on bringing it to DR 06...I want to see the beast! Too bad about the paint job, I guess you now have an option for something else.:D
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That's the plan :D
 
yeah, I see what you're saying about every-man vs bling. Remember that Ford got rich selling cars to every-man though. :grin: :thumb:

At any rate, one thing you could do to show off and keep it every man at the same time is: link just one end. Keep leaves in the rear and do a cool 3 link up front with coils and all the bling. You can get close to 90 degree departure angles with the right leaf set up in the rear anyway. :) Dunno about anyone else, but when I look at the price of all the heavy DOM, big rod ends, bracketry, fab time, coil overs etc you need to do a full on linked rig, front and rear... it makes my head spin. Its cool, but its a LOT of coin.

As far as drivetrain goes, so long as you don't throw a gazillion bucks at it... 454/th400/203/205 is pretty damn cool and is very "every man". I don't make much money, but I could put a drivetrain like that together if you gave me enough time. Hell, I have everything but the 454 now. :) I guess what I'm saying is... don't do what Peterson's does where they say they are "going cheap" and then turn around and buy a brand spanking new supa-bling-bling crate engine. Thats not every man... thats daddy warbucks. It really isn't necessary anyway... a stockish TBI 454 will run at crazy angles and has plenty of power. No need to throw a blown-nitroused supa-bling bling 502 or some pie in the sky poop in there. As they say on the midnight downtown bus I ride home from work... "keep it real".

j
 
Brandon, this sounds like a cool project! I may be off the band wagon here, but I think a built Burb would be sweet! What happened to project Burly Burb that Stephen was building? Anyways, I know whe people think of a Burban they think of a trail Anchor. There is a guy here in Vegas, Dean Bennet who wheels the hell out of his Burb and it's a 1-ton on 42's! He has body damage and all!

A Bigass Suburban on the trail will def stand out, the only problem is does the driver have the skills to wheel the big bastard.

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I'll save you all the time of buiding a truck, just invite me and my truck along :D :haha:

Come on you know you want me to come this year...
 
Stephens project Burly Burb is in the shop getting the prototype front coil suspension as we speek. The Burb idea would be great but both subs that are on the property are very straight and/or daily drivers.

We have this crew cab we call Cousin Willard that officialy got the nod last night to go. Willard is kinda straight but still pretty beat and rusty so it makes a great canidate.
There will be the least amount of $$ spent on the drivetrain as possible and still have it reliable.
One end will probably get linked up the other will stay leaves.

Give me a few weeks and I might have some pics.
I am in the middle of a little house redo project that the wifey is going to make me have done prior to playing with my toys agian.:doah: :(
 
Actually James is going to be driving Willard. He is in training to beat the crap out of things as we speek. He does not like it but the Jedi training should work.
 
Here's my thought on showcasing the ORD product and building an "everyman's" truck. From what I've read, I can understand wanting to get more exposure in ink than last time. When your the guy with the one rig out of the group that walks up everything without a hitch, breaks nothing in a group of throttle happy mainacs the camera will follow the carnage. I think that point was proven when one of the only pics of wally was with the seinor Watson napping by it.

Most of us know the capabilities of ORD. From simple, strong bolt on parts that work to full on custom truggies like Fox's. The general wheeling public don't. I would say stick with the bolt on stuff, short of going full on truggy with it linked up on coilover's on each end. If you got a bolt on front link/coil kit in the works then use it. Stick with a flip in the rear, maybe 56" springs and your HD shackles. Willard's drivetrain sould do the trick, only adding a doubler if it didn't already have it. (can't remember if it did or not from seeing it in the cheap truck challenge)

ditch the 8ft bed for a clean tube setup, but without a full on exo up front (you did say body damage was needed to get ink right?). Keeping it simple will keep the durability up even when hammering on it, but you'll have spares for breakage anyway.

If the front link/coil kit doesn't work out timing wise, then what about developing a kit to do the 52" swap to the front axle. Something with the simplicity of the original shackle flip kit, but for the front. Still being a bolt on kind of affair (or simple fabwork). There are many that have done it here, but alot that would like to don't have the time, skills or tools to effectively make the 52" swap. These are the same people that don't have the tools to fab up thier own shackle flip brackets (or cut a hole in the stock ones) but would gladly pay for a simple strong kit thats already been thought out. Could be sold as a basic kit with just whats needed for the 52's or a deluxe kit with the additional parts needed for the required x-over steering too.

Bottom line is, whatever you guys decide to use it would be most benifical that it be something the everyman could buy from you and install on his own truck. It helps because the cost in developing what ever you do can be recouped by selling it as a kit. Sure a full on truggy like Fox's or Wally can serve as a calling card too, but my guess is you guys build less complete vehicles than you do the bolt on stuff. Plus most of us average joes don't have the coin to have a ORD built truggy, but we do scrimp and save to buy the bolt on stuff. (I need a bolt on steering box brace and HD front shackles I'm saving up for) Put the stuff on that you sell, wheel the piss out of it, show that it works and you'll be busy.
 
ZooMad75 said:
Plus most of us average joes don't have the coin to have a ORD built truggy, but we do scrimp and save to buy the bolt on stuff. (I need a bolt on steering box brace and HD front shackles I'm saving up for) Put the stuff on that you sell, wheel the piss out of it, show that it works and you'll be busy.
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This is the goal.
From a personal point (remember I don't work there) the "company truck" needs to have one more cool part on it than the other trucks just like it. This IMO makes you the buyer of parts want to save for that part.
Willard is not going to be a truggy at all. He will probably be tapered and shortened with hopefully a coil kit on the front but that is the extent of the "cool dude" parts.
Wally is a product of the type of wheeling that we like/liked to do at the time he was built. The same is true of my buggy. BUT while on a trail ride the climate has to be perfect for us to be "comfortable". It gets hot, cold, dusty and in general sucks at some point on every trip. That is the price we pay for the full on "cool dude" stuff. Don't forget that at somepoint we always think that we maybe should have a windsheild or a heater or even more important an Air conditioner.

I think the point for ORD is that anyone can build this truck with a little time and some fab skills. You got to buy parts to do it but you will buy them and hopefully from ORD.

Thanks guys.
I don't want to get much more into marketing as I am not invlolved in the business and I don't have a vender title. And I think that I am getting close to stepping over the lines here.
 
Oh yeah, to help it get better coverage, paint it a bright magazine friendly color. My thought is bright red. The red will "pop" against the background for excellent shots plus when you do scrape and slam it through places where no crew cab should be going it will leave a nice bloody red stain on the rocks or trees where the paint got scraped off. Just a cheap Macco job will do. Just for nice shiney before pics that makes the truck look clean from 20ft (or in the camera lens). Enough to make them think the possible damage at the end of the run...
 
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