Cummins 6.7

[K10ANDYKHAMNIC]

you should be a daimler chrysler Pr rep .... barf .....

Some of this is opinion, but most is preferance. A 1993 has locking hubs, inferior to later flanges and CAD system. No having to get out to lock hubs, and no goofy holes in the the front center cap.

Leaf springs-
Yes, the 1993 uses old techonolgy. Inferior leaf springs to later much smoother 4 link coil suspension that also can bear more weight.

Serviceable wheel bearings-
You got me there, that is better than sealed unit bearings, a lot better.

kingpins-
while the kingpins are marginally better, there really isn't the problems with failing ball joints left and right like you hear on the internet.

Passenger side drop-
I love this one. Inferior, everything is driverside drop regardless of brand and has been that way for roughly 10+years. Passenger side drop mates to old outdated, technologically speaking, vehicles.

Front D60-
It's every bit as tough as the older 60, with advantages and drawbacks. It uses the better CAD system over manual lock out hubs. It has unit bearings and not serviceable bearings. (this is basically a give or take thing, so I'll stop there)

Tracking systems on both trucks-
while there has been some problems with the track bars on 2nd gens, the trucks still track much better than the older models with leaf springs.

Interior,
Yes, the 2nd gens use more plastic. Not a lot more, besides the bottom part of the dash, my 1976 Chevy C30 has about as much plastic and rubber inside as my 2001 Ram does. Door panels, top of dash, guage cluster, etc.

My point is, while the 1993 is indeed the cream of the crop for 1st gen trucks, it's still the cream of the crop of 70's/80's technology and is inferior in most ways to later designs.

 

[rjfguitar]

There is no problem with the type of thinking that a truck should be a rough riding, rattly, rubber floored, bench seats, basically like they were 40 years ago. Thats fine for some people.

I'll be thinking of you next week when I put 500 miles on my truck while sitting in my comfy heated leather seats, with the A/C on, floating across the interstate with my soft but stout "sissy" coils, as I relax and don't have to hear the road because I have about three times the insulation which lets me hear my premium infinity system better.

Oh, and if I get into a little mud around the ranch, I don't have to get out to lock my hubs in and track mud all over my nice black carpet and leather.

 

[rjfguitar]

Okay Alot of it is opinion . But theres now way the Cad system is Better It's Junk all the way back to 81 when they started that Crap If your too lazy to get out and lock your hubs (and know your locked in ) then I guess having a weaker axle might be a good trade off .

Well, again personal preferance. The Cad systems on both our Dodges have worked flawlessely for us (and I am in and out of 4x4 a lot between the ranch and launching from lights). I don't see where it's a weaker axle at all, since it's not. If these 60's can handle launching down the track in 4x4 with 900HP Cummins motors sitting atop them down the 1/4 or pulling a sled, it's plenty strong.

the Dodge frontend Does Have a High rate of eating up trackbars and Balljoints (personel Experiance) .

Explain your experience? My truck has the original track bar and ball joints at 125K, tracks wonderfully. Same for dad's at 107K. Infact, most guys I know that have Dodge diesels have had little problems with these areas.

How many people are searching out late Model Dodge axles to put Under there 4x4's??? Our why would Companys like Dynatrac Make kits to convert Dodge (and newer unit bearing fords)to Servicable bearings and one piece inner axles??

It's a late model axle that is drivers drop, thats the main reason. The CAD system doesn't make sence in a offroad rig, lock out hubs do. But we are talking about a TOWRIG that sees miles down the highway. I would agree that unit bearing suck. I have completely agreed since it first came up a few posts back.

I like my trucks to be just that "TRUCKS" if I was worried about the rough ride I'd buy a Caddy and put a big Pink Feather in my hat and go PIMPIN' for hoes in da hood dawg.

Don't be dumb....

......okay I'm getting of track MY POINT 93 Dodge The best Combination of parts ever offered alot like the 87 K30 fuel injected 454-sm465/th400-Np205 KINGPIN 60 and a 14bolt rear and LEAFSPRINGS

It's the best combination of early technological parts and doesn't compare to the smoothness, handling, and comfort of later models. Oh, and I prefer the 1989 K30.

Torsion bars and coils are for sissy's

Leafsprings are for people that can't figure out how to set up a more complicated suspension that doesn't beat the driver to death, flexes better, and carries more weight.

 

[K10ANDYKHAMNIC]

Front D60-
It's every bit as tough as the older 60, with advantages and drawbacks. It uses the better CAD system over manual lock out hubs. It has unit bearings and not serviceable bearings. (this is basically a give or take thing, so I'll stop there)

So your cummins make 900 hp and you pull sleds with it ? You know that the guy who one that does that with it hasnt upgraded it ? Have you have had your 60 apart ? The shafts are slightly larger than 1/2 ton junk and the cad is a pile of junk .This is from personal experience .

Great attitude for a mod there , insinuating that anyone who runs leaves is inept . If leaves are inferior why isnt the rears of anything coiled from the factory (trucks only )? Maybe you should let all the mfgs know they are retards for using leaves . What is so great about leather anyway ? Do you
have it so you can just brag about you having it and make yourself feel superior ? You have a very snudey attitude from what I gather out of your posts . -A

 

[yellowK20]

There is no problem with the type of thinking that a truck should be a rough riding, rattly, rubber floored, bench seats, basically like they were 40 years ago. Thats fine for some people.

I'll be thinking of you next week when I put 500 miles on my truck while sitting in my comfy heated leather seats, with the A/C on, floating across the interstate with my soft but stout "sissy" coils, as I relax and don't have to hear the road because I have about three times the insulation which lets me hear my premium infinity system better.

Oh, and if I get into a little mud around the ranch, I don't have to get out to lock my hubs in and track mud all over my nice black carpet and leather.

My 93' had Cruise and A/C and tilt and Very nice seats and the ride while a bit rough when unloaded wasn't all that bad (also mine had buckets with a console not a bench) and it had carpet when I bought which I removed and replaced with a rubber mat ( I grew up in NE Minnesota lot's of snow and Mud ) My truck also had the "premium sound system" and with 35" BFG's would Knock down 22mpg at 80mph . My Dad is a Chevy Guy but he has been buying Cummins dodges since 91 when he found out you couldn't get solid frontend in a chevy All told we've had about 18 or 19 dodges With HARD use in the Logwoods and Road construction and our Quarry. I myself had a 98 cummins reg cab with 35" bfg's that would eat frigginn' balljoints and trackbars about every 30,000 miles as well as many problems with your Beloved CAD stystem even though it was a good truck I traded it for my gas powered LEAFSPRUNG superduty and have had no problem in 130,000 hard miles (other than losing a unit bearing) of course now ford went and F'd it up bye going to coils ( I will never buy another New ford)................Oh and one more reason Cad Sucks The housing is Much weaker because of the 2 piece axle tube and the goofy collor that house's the Disconnect. The older trucks were Built tougher Period the New ones are more "soccer mom freindly" there very nice and I'd like to have one But it wouldn't hold up to the abuse that an old leafspring truck would

 

[rjfguitar]

Front D60-
It's every bit as tough as the older 60, with advantages and drawbacks. It uses the better CAD system over manual lock out hubs. It has unit bearings and not serviceable bearings. (this is basically a give or take thing, so I'll stop there)

So your cummins make 900 hp and you pull sleds with it ? You know that the guy who one that does that with it hasnt upgraded it ? Have you have had your 60 apart ? The shafts are slightly larger than 1/2 ton junk and the cad is a pile of junk .This is from personal experience .

Great attitude for a mod there , insinuating that anyone who runs leaves is inept . If leaves are inferior why isnt the rears of anything coiled from the factory (trucks only )? Maybe you should let all the mfgs know they are retards for using leaves . What is so great about leather anyway ? Do you
have it so you can just brag about you having it and make yourself feel superior ? You have a very snudey attitude from what I gather out of your posts . -A

Slow down there. I was having a fun and basically friendly debate with yellowK20. Thats what makes forums fun here and there. You are making something out of nothing, lighten up man, it's just some fun debate to kill time.

For your two main points...

There are thousands of stock drivetrain Dodges and Fords that have 700+HP that pull and drag. There is never (I shouldn't say never, but close to it) discussion on the Dodge/diesel forums of frontend weakness when submitted to pulling/dragging down the track.

I never said anyone that runs leaves is inept. YellowK20 said coils were for sissies, I was just teasing him back as he was to me. Like I said, in fun.

 

[rjfguitar]

My 93' had Cruise and A/C and tilt and Very nice seats and the ride while a bit rough when unloaded wasn't all that bad (also mine had buckets with a console not a bench) and it had carpet when I bought which I removed and replaced with a rubber mat ( I grew up in NE Minnesota lot's of snow and Mud ) My truck also had the "premium sound system" and with 35" BFG's would Knock down 22mpg at 80mph . My Dad is a Chevy Guy but he has been buying Cummins dodges since 91 when he found out you couldn't get solid frontend in a chevy All told we've had about 18 or 19 dodges With HARD use in the Logwoods and Road construction and our Quarry. I myself had a 98 cummins reg cab with 35" bfg's that would eat frigginn' balljoints and trackbars about every 30,000 miles as well as many problems with your Beloved CAD stystem even though it was a good truck I traded it for my gas powered LEAFSPRUNG superduty and have had no problem in 130,000 hard miles (other than losing a unit bearing) of course now ford went and F'd it up bye going to coils ( I will never buy another New ford)................Oh and one more reason Cad Sucks The housing is Much weaker because of the 2 piece axle tube and the goofy collor that house's the Disconnect. The older trucks were Built tougher Period the New ones are more "soccer mom freindly" there very nice and I'd like to have one But it wouldn't hold up to the abuse that an old leafspring truck would

Thats too bad you had so many problems that frequently with BJ's and track bars. That is not real common, that fast of wear.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree which is tougher, but just look at towing weights between the 93 and say a 2003, or frame thickness, or spring rate, power output, etc.

 

[yellowK20]

Thats too bad you had so many problems that frequently with BJ's and track bars. That is not real common, that fast of wear.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree which is tougher, but just look at towing weights between the 93 and say a 2003, or frame thickness, or spring rate, power output, etc.

No I'm sure Mine wasn't normal . but all our newer Cummins trucks wear quickly also (about 60,000) they are heavly used (snowplows are brutal to a truck) and yes the Newer trucks have a higher "rated" towing capacity and more power and stronger frames I'm not saying that the Newer trucks are junk because there not i'm just saying that the old school truck has a better front axle and t-case and in my opinon a better front suspension . My Ideal truck would be a 93 reg cab with a new CR-TD 6-speed and NP-203/205 with 35" MTR's oh and a Gear Vendors overdrive.....Hmmm better make that an extended cab to fit it all but i'll probaly end up ordering a reg cab 3500 srw with the new 6.7 and a 6-speed

 

[DavidB]

Well, apparently my bro doesn't care for you much huh rjf?


He is right, though...

I had a 98 CTD 12 Valve Auto 4x4 Xcab longbed, everything from the frame down in front was always broken, and it went thru two trannies. Those trucks simply will not put up with hard use/driving/wheeling (abuse) like the old leaf sprung will. Check around on pavementsucks.com and even the dodge lovers hate all that crap. Rapid balljoint, steering, trackbar, CAD, and unit bearing wear/breakage is NOT uncommon, unless the truck is streeted all the time, and sometimes even then. Not to mention all the extra and more complicated, expensive parts. Unit bearings for my ABS-equipped Dodge were $500.00 EACH, and I wnet through a couple pairs in the 3-4years I owned the truck. Compare the steering setup to Ford as far as size of balljoints, etc. The weight of the CTD dictates stronger running gear under the front, and Dodge is just starting to get around to it. I'd give my eye teeth for a Power Wagon. Newer and newer for the last several years has meant more and more street friendly and less and less dirt friendly in general, but it seems the trend might be beginning to change. Something else...pulling sleds is not nearly as hard on the front end as wheeling. Cleaner (no dirt/sand/water getting places it shouldn't), and it's a gradual, straight pull on flat ground with the rearend doing the majority of the work. No shocks to the drivetrain, sideloads on the unit bearings, or anything. I blew up the front axle backing up in SAND (not throttling it) once for crying out loud! Speaking of which, larger tires trash unit bearings in a HURRY due to the increased leverage, and the fact that the innner and outer bearings are closer together than the old spindle setup. Less work, but a LOT more expensive to repair, and not nearly as durable. OK, I'm tired of bashing now. But seriously, I got screwed in the wallet by that truck for years, after thinking, "Oh wow D60 and all", turned out to be as weak as IFS. Who care if it rides better if it breaks and strands you and costs you all kinds of $$$ and time? I'm gonna go build a CUCV M1008 now....

 

[afroman006]

I swear to god I want to stab somebody with an unsharpened pencil every time they bitch about IFS being weak.

 

[K10ANDYKHAMNIC]

HEY afro , ifs is weak sauce . Just kidding man . My tacoma ifs is dang beefy to hold up to the abuse I dish it .

 

[DavidB]

I swear to god I want to stab somebody with an unsharpened pencil every time they bitch about IFS being weak.

Go read the articles in that mag that's doing the IFS stuff. Petersen's? Once again, too many expensive moving parts. <Dodges pencil>

 

[yellowK20]

Chevy IFS just won't hold up as well as the Solid axle trucks will . Idler and pitman arms and balljoints and CVshafts are constantly replaced on these trucks . Now as far as other IFS systems I have no Knowledge so I can't bash them . I currently have 3 IFS chevys and I've just got done rebuilding the front on 2 of them ( my burb has 68,000 on it) and I've wheeled a little bit and it does better than I expected but it seems like it's always pulling a front tire off the ground