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HELP! WHY is my base timing @ 60* and won't run at 0*

UP K5er

UP K5er

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What is causing my base timing to be at 60*? The engine runs suprisingly good but takes awhile to start when it has been sitting. When I try to adjust to 0* the engine starts to backfire and stalls.

HISTORY: 1987 blazer with a FRESH rebuilt '86 engine with the 87 tbi heads and equipment. I heard something about the balancer and timing cover having different TDC marks on them but I think it said they were only off by about 12*.

I am stumped... What would cause this?

Oh yeah, I rebuilt the engine:rolleyes::dunno:
 
I had that problem with my '79. You don't happen to have a 400 do you? Anyhow, while it's taking a while to start, does it turn over easy or rough? If it's easy, it might actually be too retarded, try advancing it a little and see if it starts easier. Unless someone has a correction for this, you'll have to forget the timing marks and tune by ear.
 
It's a 350. It does turn over easy, just takes awhile for it to fire up.

I was hoping I wouldn't have to tune by ear. :doah:I never seem to be able to get the timing just right.
 
I would say wrong damper for the pointer or vise verse.
 
Advance it until it fights turning over, then retard until it agrees that turning over is what it's supposed to do. After that, put the motor under load. If it's pinging like you have bad gas it needs retarded some more. If it doesn't, then it should be fine. If it tries dieseling after she's warmed up when you shut it off, it needs retarded. Both of those adjustments are small movements of the distributor.
 
You can't time TBI like that.

Your starting issue could be a bad/weak fuel pump relay. Does the pump prime every time you turn the key to run? (when the engine has been sitting awhile, won't work if you keep trying it) It could also simply be tied into the fact that base timing is very wrong.

I somehow doubt it would run at 60* advanced, I'm of the same mind that the timing pointer or balancer is wrong, there were a couple variations.
 
Cowboy_80 said:
It won't set right. They only settle right the right way or 180* out
Click to expand...


That's not true, if the oil pump shaft gets turned far enough it will go in off a tooth or even two. You can take a long flat tip screwdriver and turn the oil pump shaft so the distributer will line up and drop in at the correct spot.(pointing at number one)
 
possible, but how would the oil pump get rotated w/o a distributor, shy of sticking a priming tool through the hole?
 
The pump does prime every time and the pump relay is new. All most everything is new on this darn B1tc#! Would being a tooth or two off on the distributor have this effect? The oil pump shaft was turned to TRY to get the rotor close to #1 firing position but its a little off. I'll try Cowboy 80's advise for timing it by ear.

Still doesn't explain why it's taking so long to start. There are no visible leaks outside or inside the gas tank. The gas tank is new and so is the sending unit and GM fuel pump. Could gas somehow drain back to the tank via a bad check valve? I don't even know if there is such a thing.
 
I'm also sure that the 60* I'm seeing is not a 'true' value. A motor can't run with that much. What causes the readings to be that far off. I am hooked up to the #1 wire with the strobe light.
 
i'm still saying it's a tooth off. i did it to a camaro i had one time. fired up and ran but the timing mark was no where near where it should be.
 
I had a similar problem. I believe the damper is from the original engine, so the timing mark doesn't line up at all with the tab on the crate engine. Like you, I was scratching my head trying to figure out how it could run like that and run terribly when the timing light said it was right.

So I dropped the oil pan, adjusted #1 as close to TDC as possible and then put timing tape on my balancer with 0 degrees right at my timing tab. The tape is like $8 from Summit.

The only other choices are to put the timing tab on the other side of the block or replace the balancer.
 
Is this a tbi engine? Do you have the bypass unplugged? The timing will read all kinds of goofy if you don't.
 
ok, thanks for the help. I'm going out to the garage right now to try tuning by ear. If I still don't get it right, I'll try the distributor or the tape method. I believe the damper is from the carb '86 motor.

BTW the bypass wire is disconnected while I am checking the timing. Forgot to mention that.

I'll check back on this thread later on tonight. I've been waiting a long time to drive my blazer again. Did a total rebuild of everything and this little stuff is killing me for time. I want it on the road for hunting season!!!
 
If, after you have done all the timing checks, and you find that the timing is good, but it still has a hard time starting, it possibly could be a weak starter.

If it's been a while since it's been started, and you are not sure if the starter still has a "like new" zip to it, a weak starter will take a few more turns of the engine to get it to fire.

If it's a new starter, then forget you read this and continue on to other tests.

:wink1:
 
You can put it at top dead center with the #1 plug out and a little screw driver then see if the mark is right I have cut a new mark before in a balancer.
 
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