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Idle has gone to craps

dabomb6608

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Marion, Illinois
Ok so i had messed with the timing a bit and had to bring the idle up a bit and went for a test run and it seemed to run fine until i noticed that the idle was coming up....I popped it in neutral and it was idleing at 2k so i new i brought the idle up way to much....i got home and turned the idle screw out to bring it down and when it did go down it would stumble and fluxuate between 900-700 sometimes dropping around 500? it sounds really crappy and almost like a miss. Did i just mess with the timing to much or could it be bad gas since i got a full tank friday? Or????
 
thanks a ton for the link! i will be checking to see were the vac advance is coming from and am waiting for it to cool off so i can check the plugs since its been a while since theyve been lookd at
 
cylinders 2,4,6,8
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1,3,5,7
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#2 what i thought was the worst one... They all where white and #2 looked to be getting deteriorated


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http://i975.photobucket.com/albums/ae234/dabomb6608/031000_142700.jpg
http://i975.photobucket.com/albums/ae234/dabomb6608/031000_142701.jpg
http://i975.photobucket.com/albums/ae234/dabomb6608/031000_140700.jpg
 
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update. it is gettin vac advance from a manifold port on carb...i put the plugs back in and now it is only running with the choke engaged and rpms above 1200 once i disengage it it wants to studder and stumble on itself then die.
 
What carburetor? If it's a Qjet, I've had the secondaries hang open just a touch and make it idle all sorts of weird.
 
ya its a qjet im almost startin to think that could be it cause all of a sudden i hear this hissing sound that is coming from that area...idk if the secondaries would allow THAT much air flow to be making a sound but who knows...
 
borrowd my dads timing gun and got it in time it got the idle better but i think the idle mixture screws in the front are off. Where is a good starting point for those? I read somewhere 2.5ish turns out for the coarse threads and 4or6ish out for the fine threads. How do i no which threads i have do i have to take those screws out?
 
Hissing sound = vacuum leak. Secondaries on a Q-jet don't open unless under load, so they're not the source of the hissing sound.

Chase the vacuum leak first. Fix that, then ballpark the timing, and then look at the idle screws. Motor off, count the number of turns while you turn the idle mixture screws all the way in, no force. Turn them back where they were. Motor on (and warmed up), turn the idle mixture screws in for half a turn each. Note the point where the rpms start to drop. Back off 1/2 turn on each side from that point. By the way, you should be able to stop the motor by turning the idle mixture screws in. If not, your motor is not running on the idle circuit, but on the primaries; in that case, your idle speed screw is too far in, or your idle circuit is plugged in the first place. That means carb cleanup/new gaskets/rebuild>

Your plugs indicate that the motor is running lean, as in not enough fuel (possibly due to a vacuum leak).

And I'm sorry to inform you that we are forced to subtract a Point from your total for out-of-focus pictures. They don't count. :D
 
ok so ?'s how do i find the leak if there is one?
and when i am screwing in the screws until it looses rpms do i do them at same time? what if it immediately looses rpms? sorry for all the ?'s but im tryin to learn the most i can and im a beginner...on the subject of the crappy pictures sorry they were from my camera fone our camera is dead and cant find the right batteries for it
 
Vacuum leak - visual first. Don't know what year your truck is, some have a vacuum line diagram sticker on the core support, so you can see what goes where. Some of the repair manuals have those diagrams as well. Make sure all lines are there (no open ports on the carb - did you reconnect the vacuum advance to the distributor?), tight, and not crumbly, maybe replace them, cheap and easy to do. With the engine running, spraying a little brake cleaner around the base of the carb can help - if it changes idle speed, it's an indication for a leak. Make sure the carburetor base gasket is in good shape, and the carb sits tight (but don't over-tighten the carb bolts/studs).

Idle screws - yep, always both at the same time. Before you start, make sure they're both at the same # of turns out from fully seated. If it looses rpm immediately, turn them further out, then turn them in where it looses rpm, then back out 1/2 turn.
 
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k i will get to that here in a bit...mine is a 85 btw with a slightly modified 305(headers,roller tip rockers,intake, and a quadrajet from a 76 vehicle so no ecm) it also doesnt have the emissions stuff on it. Just plain jane vac advance, brake booster, vac for 700R4 and interior vac. No egr as well. Thanks for all the help so far!
 
ok update...got new plugs in and adjusted the idle/idle mixture and it is running really strong and the idle is really improved BUT there is a dead spot/hesitation still but now it is even happening when sitting in park. any thoughts?
 
I don't know '70s Q-Jets well... I'm guessing 'dead spot' as in it won't rev up when you step on it? - lean bog, check the accelerator pump - it's not getting enough fuel.
 
By dead spot i meant that when i step on it it kinda hesitates(moment of silence) then will go...to check the accelorator pump do i just push that pin out holding the arm in place and c if it will rev better? Or is there a different way?
 
By dead spot i meant that when i step on it it kinda hesitates(moment of silence) then will go...to check the accelerator pump do i just push that pin out holding the arm in place and c if it will rev better? Or is there a different way?

The hesitation means it's either getting too much fuel at that moment and can't burn it (in which case the exhaust should be black/rich), or not enough fuel and the mixture is too lean to burn right - since your plugs are white, methinks it's more likely to be a lean condition.

Motor off, air cleaner off, look down the primaries. When you push the linkage to open the primaries (simulating that you're stepping on the gas pedal), it should push the accelerator pump lever up at the linkage, meaning it'll push the little pin on the left front top of the carb (i.e. the acc. pump) down into the carb. When you look down the primaries while you actuate the linkage, you should see/hear/smell a spray of fuel.

If it doesn't do that, my guess would be that the little gasket skirt on the accelerator pump might be broken/kaputt and needs to be replaced as it doesn't seal anymore. For that, the top of the carb needs to come off, and you'll need a carb rebuild kit (which usually contains a replacement accelerator pump).

If it does spray fuel, could be it's not enough. One option might be to look where the pin from the linkage connects to the lever that pushes down on the acc. pump. There's typically two holes where the pin from the linkage (not the pin that serves as fulcrum!) connects; those two mounting locations mean you can get a different amount of stroke onto the acc. pump via different travel/engagement of the lever.

If that's maxed out, you're gonna have to get the Doug Roe book on Q-Jets (as I said I don't know 70's Q-Jets that well).

Yet a different possibility is that the timing is not right and you'd need a little more advance to allow the mixture the time to burn.
 
ok well the pump is doing sumthin cause i can hear/smell/see the gas it pumps....the 2 holes are there on the lever and it is currently connected to the one farthest from the linkage so im guessing i should try it on the one at the end of the arm closer to the linkage which would increase how much it moves?
 
ok well i changed the spot were the linkage connects to the pump arm and it didnt help any it just seemed like it was slow to gettin rpms when i hit the throttle ....so i pulled out one of the idle mixture screws to see if it had course or fine threads and it lookd like it was fine threads so i turned them both in till they were seated and went out 4.5 turns and it seemd to help hte hesitation a bit...its still there alittle and the idle sounds like there is a slight miss in it again. im gonna look at the rotor and see what shape all thats in tomorrow....what u guys think? anywhere else i should look?
 
To find a vacuum leak, get you a can of WD-40 and give it a quick spray around the intake gaskets, the base of the carb, anywhere you might suspect a leak. If you have a leak, it will speed up due to the WD-40 acting as fuel. Check the hoses by either pinching them off or disconnect them at the intake and put a cap on the fitting. Caps are available at auto supply stores.
 
I think you'll get more help if you back up and explain the original problem that got you "messin" with it in the first place.
 
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