I was pretty sure my link covered all that... 
CK5
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Need electrical help (ryoken u there???)
- Thread starter RootBreaker
- Start date
I was pretty sure my link covered all that...
yeah im just electrically retarded on this part.
so yeah i get it from your pic..
so i get it..
bed switch:
common to fuse/winch
1 to batteries
2 back to hood
what i dont get is in your pic you have 4 wires on the front switch..
so
1 to batteries
2 to back switch
common to both alt and batteries... duhhh i just thought of it logically..
if i hookup batteries to lug 1 and forget 2 for now...
alt to common.... i need some way to get power to starter.... DOH!!!!
by golly thinks i got it!!!!!!
It did, but he still seemed a little confused, so I tried stating the same thing from a slightly different angle.I was pretty sure my link covered all that...
The difference between us, is that you usually don't interact with the laypeople to the degree I always wind up seeming to.
Guy brings in his boat, tells you what is wrong, you fix what is really wrong, tell him what he needs to hear, and both go away happy.
I love those kind of jobs, I just never seem to get one.
I get called in, the same scenario happens up to the point where it gets fixed.
Then, I usually have to explain to the in-house guy what was actually wrong, how I fixed it, in detail, and what to do if it happens again.
To a guy who could not fix it in the first place. And did not understand the problem or what I did to make it work.
And most importantly, tactfully explain to him how he made it worse.
My favorite trick for that, is when they have had someone else besides the house guy in before me.
Then I can blame all the house guy's screw ups on him. The house guy knows darn well he was the one that did that, but he does not think I know.
So he will join in bad mouthing the other guy.
Of course, I have to make sure the other guy is not likely to walk in.........
In this situation, I agree, but I dunno, something in me wants to see a 3/0 wire nut ..........
And, yeah, I know, they use a compression bolt. Used several when I spliced into some 3/0 and ran 2/0 over to my shed.
But, a 3/0 wirenut..........Probably takes a 14" Crescent wrench to tighten it..........
And you've got it easier than you think. Marine stuff is complicated, and there are lots of things to remember to avoid galvanic corrosion and that sort of thing, but think about me.
I work on marine stuff, normal house wiring, got a copy of the electrical code book I had to learn, automotive DC circuits, low grade electronics, DC and AC circuits, low frequency RF, high frequency RF, microwave stuff, high power VHF and UHF transmitters and transmission lines, antenna theory, tower work, mechanical engineering, various chemical things, locksmithing, and thats just the first part of a week...........
Then, there is the plumbing I do from time to time, some farming when I get the chance.
Try to shoot a few hundred rounds each week so I can hit something when I need to. is it any wonder I can't find a woman to hang with me long enough for kids???
So, if I get preachy, jump in where I shouldn't, or confuse one discipline with another, please try to bear with me.
That is a lot of stuff to try to cram into a pinhead like mine.......
I don't even know how to respond to that without being an arse...
and if you read back, the wire nut line was in reference to his "general" wiring...
and if you read back, the wire nut line was in reference to his "general" wiring...
I know, I know, not busting your chops. Just had a sudden vision of what a 3/0 wirenut would look like.
Neither one of you even suggested it, but I juxtapositioned the idea of splicing 3/0 wire with your comment about wirenuts, and had this vision.....
I mean, if such a thing existed, it would be about 6 inches across.....
The arse thing puzzled me until I went back and reread what I typed.
It would take longer for me to try to explain what I was trying to say than the original posting, so let me say this:
I sincerely apologize. I'm the one that came off looking like an arse.
It was not my intention.
It was actually an attempt to apologize for stepping on your other post, but there was stuff going on here, and my leg decided to act up and I got distracted.
So, instead of trying to explain why I sometimes say dumb things, I managed to say an even dumber thing, and not only make it look like I was bragging about me, but belittling your job and abilities.
Again, sorry about that.
hah... that is all i can say... so no wire nuts on general wiring... inspection guy failed me for the ole coat hangers holding up the exhaust...... also failed me for my power steering puking all over his floor... (when i put a new pump in... didnt know that on refurbs.. they have the plastic caps in and if you dont need it you need to put a bolt in it.. i didnt know cuz they painted over the dagone thing and was difficult to find the leak... hahahahahaa
thoersch
Newbie
This has been informative and hilarious! I too would like to see a 3/0 wire nut! The way Fordum broke it down helped me understand it better than for someone to say "just do this". Anyway, thanks guys for the good info.
thanks, appreciate it...
tell me I'm ugly, kick my cat, but getting questioned about the depth of knowledge needed for my job/life is bad juju... I'm just not sure you know HOW complicated, and varied my job is.. just electrically alone...
I don't work on 21' DC only outboard boats all day... I've worked on tons of 70', 80'er's over the years.... and if you haven't been on something like this lately
gotta roadtrip to do a full winterize on a similar one next week as a matter of fact.... freakin tender is worth more than my K5 parts!
they have just about everything from desalinization systems, to ice shavers to IR camera's.. let alone every appliance a house has, windlass's, hydraulic stabilizers, radars and every electronic you can think of...... heck, the Hinckley's had 10 grand Rolls Royce computers in em for the joysticks....
oh, and a pair of giant dizzles with systems in the 12, 24, 36 and 48 DC varietys.... meeting all CG requirements, series/parallel systems, air conditioning, toilets, SSB's, wetbars, yada, yada.. not including every structural and cosmetic requirement for said vessel....
keep in mind.. my job is not only repair/diagnostics/maintenance, but also system installs/retro-fits and custom stuff..... tho this is the whole album and takes about 10 minutes to look thru with some repeats, etc, for anyone who's bored, it's a pretty cool project....
http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x210/ryoken-ovd/Whisper/
there aren't many people, that I've ever met that could do that job start to finish, everything... in all reality, none.... not many guys that can gel your 60'er, than rebuild the mill.... the end result was pretty mindblowing for those that watched the job progress... not only the quality and strength of the work, but the engineering and performance.. it went from a 17 knot boat to 28... and new impellers as I suggested, would get it over 30.. oh, I also came in at 590 hrs on a 725 hr estimate... John Wayne-ing it, as my service manager would say.........
enough horn tooting on my part, I'm sure if Rootbreaker has more questions, we're both more than qualified to help...
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wire nut for 3/0
http://electrical.hardwarestore.com...rs/copper-split-bolt-3-0-awg-max--667910.aspx
well as close as we get.
http://electrical.hardwarestore.com...rs/copper-split-bolt-3-0-awg-max--667910.aspx
well as close as we get.
the CG would shoot me...
Man, I am glad you posted that. Saves me the trouble of looking for a pic.
I was in the office this morning, and my friend and partner dropped by. He was telling me about a potential job we might have, and his ex-wife's latest debacle.
I told him about my thought of a 3/0 wirenut, and he laughed. Then he asked how did you splice 3/0 cable?
I said a splitbolt, of course. And he just gave me a blank look. He is a very smart guy, really knowledgeable about electronics, but he has the strangest gaps in his knowledge.
He has never done any wiring beyond fixing a light switch or socket.
I was going to find a pic and show him, but the phone rang, and he went ahead to check on the job.
I'll E-mail it to him in a minute.
When we ran the underground utilites from the power pole to the generator barn, they cut the 3/0 and spliced them with splitbolts, varnished cambric and mastic in a big J-box.
Then, when I got the genset, I undid the splices, and put the auto switchpanel in series.
Then later, when I added the second service to the new building, I undid some of the splices and added some 2/0.
Had to upsize the splitbolts.
I guess I would have needed a bigger wirenut.........
Very nice. I think I could do the wiring.......maybe.
Actually I might be able to get the motors in and out, I'm really good with putting big heavy objects in really tight places......
Not what it sounds like.
I would probably need someone like you to refigure the mounts if they needed it, but you show me the motor and where you wanted it to go, and a I'm your boy.
I got myself put in charge of moving a 5 ton carbocooler into a plant through a hole that two guys said it could not go through.
They still think I did it by just eyeballing it.
I actually came in the night before and measured that thing within an inch of its life. Sketched it all out and figured out how to start it in, and then use the winch of my truck to rotate it on the lift cable while in the hole so it would clear a beam.
As for the rest of it, Fiberglas and gelcoat is one area I suck at in the few times I've done it.
Mainly because I have always been surrounded by guys who were geniuses at it.
So, I just call on one of them when I need something like that done.
One of them you would like.
I would not put what you did past him. His family used to own one of the best shipyards in town.
When we were in 8th grade, I would go by and watch him repowering 60 foot shrimp boats.
His father sent him to all kinds of schools to learn fiberglasing, marine wiring, all kinds of systems.
He has worked for some really big names in boat companies.
He was one of the people who wrote to....Cobia??, don't remember the name off hand, when they lengthened one of their models without adding extra stringers, and the ass ends started falling off in rough seas.
Today he is partially retired, doing work out of his yard.
I went by during the summer, and there was a 45 footer pulled up there, and the owner, a local doctor I know and he were standing behind it.
My friend was poking the outside of the transom with his pocketknife watching the water and slime drip out.
Some idiot had mounted something below the waterline and had not 5200ed the holes.
Water got in and rotted the core.
They were discussing prices and options.
Next time I came by, the whole ass end of the boat was gone to a distance of about 5 feet forward.
He reconstructed the whole stern, adding a large fish box, a live well and a marlin door that it had not had.
I was lucky enough to be there when it rolled out. You could not see a mark in the gelcoat where the splice was.
I suspect he regelled the whole thing, but he might have matched it somehow.. He is that good.
Everything looked factory.
I started to say you were lucky, but realized that it was not luck, but intelligence that caused you to document this kind of stuff with pictures.
I never did.
There are so many wonderful projects I have done or been involved with, and I have no pictures.
Part of the reason is that I was always having too much fun and was too eager to get it finished and watch it work and get to the next project.
The other part is partially luck on your part.
You are doing all your best work in an age of digital cameras.
Everything I did, was either 35MM, or usually 127 point and shoot.
Not only did you not know if your pictures were right, but then you had to buy film and pay to have it processed.
Most of the pictures I have posted here would have never gotten taken in the old days.
I would never have wasted film on my nuts, for instance........
I do have a few pics in albums around here, I may dig some out and scan them one of these days.
But few people are that interested. Certainly I am not that interesting.....
sure, i've been using a digital camera at work for about a decade now.. but that's a tool... in a customer data base.. most times it's a "cover your arse" documentation... not a nostalgia thing...
but believe me, I'm a dinosaur thats ALL too familiar with lack of oldschool documentation... there are thousands of jobs I never documented, but much much moreso in my personal life... being a vert skater, we RARELY did photos of the old days... it was all 35m, 110 and super 8 era... i remember shooting a pool session once in super 8... i'd kill to have those early days in quality photos or vids..
it may have been a Cabo, they do larger boats.. there is a Cobia, but they do smaller boats, like 17 to 24...
but believe me, I'm a dinosaur thats ALL too familiar with lack of oldschool documentation... there are thousands of jobs I never documented, but much much moreso in my personal life... being a vert skater, we RARELY did photos of the old days... it was all 35m, 110 and super 8 era... i remember shooting a pool session once in super 8... i'd kill to have those early days in quality photos or vids..
it may have been a Cabo, they do larger boats.. there is a Cobia, but they do smaller boats, like 17 to 24...
oh, and just to clarify.... I may get the worst of the hack mechanic correction stuff in the sense that, I do see outside "pro" work on occasion that is wrong, etc... BUT by far, and I mean BY FAR, a boat's worst enemy is it's owner... I've seen owners do the stupidest hack sh*t ever..
we've got our new marina clientele under control now after 3, 4 yrs, but when we came in, the boats where all kinds of f*cked up... now, they know better to just call us...
and tho I'm well adept at playing the political game and know all the proper things to say, I have been known to blast a customer here and there for their boat being a POS...
we've got our new marina clientele under control now after 3, 4 yrs, but when we came in, the boats where all kinds of f*cked up... now, they know better to just call us...
and tho I'm well adept at playing the political game and know all the proper things to say, I have been known to blast a customer here and there for their boat being a POS...
Found some info. It was a Mako 28 and 282.
Knew it was some kind of fish.
Don't know if they have any in your neck of the woods. The boats were designed and built as 26 footers, but one of their competitors came out with a 28.
So, they just jiggered the molds and put 2 extra feet on the hull.
First thing the owners would notice was cracks in the gelcoat, which they would be told was "just cosmetic" and the next thing you know, the whole stern would fall off.
My friend had one brought to him to fix the gelcoat cracks, and he told the owner not to put it back in the water.
I don't know how involved he got in the whole thing, I know there were recalls and lawsuits, but about all he did was write a letter explaining what was wrong.
I swear I think I could get you a full time job just taking care of my retired cardiologist's boat.
He called me one time when I was in the middle of my field on my tractor. He was about to leave on the annual weekend fishing trip with all our friends, and one of the air conditioners kept tripping out on high head pressure.
I told him, since he was still at the marina, to drop my idiot cousin over the side and have him pull the plastic bag out of the water intake.
He assured me it could not be that, so they left.
They had a fairly nice time. They all had to sleep in the foreward section to stay cool, but it was not too bad.
When they got back, he called a marine air con company. They came out, looked at it, dropped a man over the side, and pulled the plastic out of the intake.........
He still cannot believe I was able to tell him what was wrong from 30 miles away. Of course, it was a lucky guess about the plastic bag, but I knew if I turned out to be right, he would be amazed, and if not, he would not remember.
Since then, he has had various problems, about 3/4 of I have either diagnosed or actually fixed for him.
He started getting overheat alarms last year, and I told him his exhaust risers were bad without looking, and got lucky again.
The latest I found out about last week. I suspect its not fixed, but he thinks it is.......
He said that he was getting another overheat alarm.
Everything looked fine, so he anchored and got out the manuals.
Turns out that alarm was for the transmission(s).
He checked, and they were way low on fluid.
He filled them, and no more alarms. Not sure if it was both or just one.
He is happy. I'm not.
First, where did the oil go? I asked, and he was unconcerned, said that it had been 15 years or so, it was probably just a long term seep.
Also, did it do any damage?
Plus, when the local shipyard was changing out the risers and redoing all the stuff in the engine compartment, why did they not check the transmission oil? Or did they and it has leaked out since?
I think I will just casually ask him if his Seatow account is paid up the next time I see him.........
BTW, here is a picture of his boat.
He took a bunch of folks over to Shell Island couple of years ago, and managed to go aground somehow........
Again.....
It was just before the last haulout and clean up. it looks better now...
Knew it was some kind of fish.
Don't know if they have any in your neck of the woods. The boats were designed and built as 26 footers, but one of their competitors came out with a 28.
So, they just jiggered the molds and put 2 extra feet on the hull.
First thing the owners would notice was cracks in the gelcoat, which they would be told was "just cosmetic" and the next thing you know, the whole stern would fall off.
My friend had one brought to him to fix the gelcoat cracks, and he told the owner not to put it back in the water.
I don't know how involved he got in the whole thing, I know there were recalls and lawsuits, but about all he did was write a letter explaining what was wrong.
I swear I think I could get you a full time job just taking care of my retired cardiologist's boat.
He called me one time when I was in the middle of my field on my tractor. He was about to leave on the annual weekend fishing trip with all our friends, and one of the air conditioners kept tripping out on high head pressure.
I told him, since he was still at the marina, to drop my idiot cousin over the side and have him pull the plastic bag out of the water intake.
He assured me it could not be that, so they left.
They had a fairly nice time. They all had to sleep in the foreward section to stay cool, but it was not too bad.
When they got back, he called a marine air con company. They came out, looked at it, dropped a man over the side, and pulled the plastic out of the intake.........
He still cannot believe I was able to tell him what was wrong from 30 miles away. Of course, it was a lucky guess about the plastic bag, but I knew if I turned out to be right, he would be amazed, and if not, he would not remember.
Since then, he has had various problems, about 3/4 of I have either diagnosed or actually fixed for him.
He started getting overheat alarms last year, and I told him his exhaust risers were bad without looking, and got lucky again.
The latest I found out about last week. I suspect its not fixed, but he thinks it is.......
He said that he was getting another overheat alarm.
Everything looked fine, so he anchored and got out the manuals.
Turns out that alarm was for the transmission(s).
He checked, and they were way low on fluid.
He filled them, and no more alarms. Not sure if it was both or just one.
He is happy. I'm not.
First, where did the oil go? I asked, and he was unconcerned, said that it had been 15 years or so, it was probably just a long term seep.
Also, did it do any damage?
Plus, when the local shipyard was changing out the risers and redoing all the stuff in the engine compartment, why did they not check the transmission oil? Or did they and it has leaked out since?
I think I will just casually ask him if his Seatow account is paid up the next time I see him.........
BTW, here is a picture of his boat.
He took a bunch of folks over to Shell Island couple of years ago, and managed to go aground somehow........
Again.....
It was just before the last haulout and clean up. it looks better now...
OMG, it's a Bluewater! 
I used to work for a company called Bluewater Yacht Services for about 11 yrs... in addition to our standard in marina service work, we used to do all the work for a local used boat broker, who had about a 1/2 dozen Bluewaters as trade-in's.... so we did all the work on the Bluewaters in the area...
generally, they're pretty much POS's... quality of the boat is average, at best... notorious for cheesy electrical work, stress cracks, etc... be grateful you never had to replace an engine, as they are usually under a sink, or in a closet... been there, done that a few times..
funny boats, they where real big out west in the big party lakes with all that deck they have up top... not something I'd want out in rough seas with that miniscule freeboard they have tho... very lake boatish....
i'll assume that boat has some gasser Merc or Crusader BB's, with a pair of velvet drives behind em.. the only places you can lose trans fluid are the rear output seal, which is Exceptionally rare...... much more likely to be a leaky hose to, or from the oil cooler.. if the cooler was leaking, he'd have strawberry quick in the system..
Boat US's sea tow insurance is just stupid not to have... great deal, first tow pays for it and then some... actually from my understanding, that card/deal is covering 1/2 the haul out fee's for all the storm boats that got hauled... thats pretty cool...
and yeah, I've seen plenty of Mako's over the years, MUCH fewer in the last decade or so tho...
I used to work for a company called Bluewater Yacht Services for about 11 yrs... in addition to our standard in marina service work, we used to do all the work for a local used boat broker, who had about a 1/2 dozen Bluewaters as trade-in's.... so we did all the work on the Bluewaters in the area...
generally, they're pretty much POS's... quality of the boat is average, at best... notorious for cheesy electrical work, stress cracks, etc... be grateful you never had to replace an engine, as they are usually under a sink, or in a closet...
been there, done that a few times..funny boats, they where real big out west in the big party lakes with all that deck they have up top... not something I'd want out in rough seas with that miniscule freeboard they have tho... very lake boatish....
i'll assume that boat has some gasser Merc or Crusader BB's, with a pair of velvet drives behind em.. the only places you can lose trans fluid are the rear output seal, which is Exceptionally rare...... much more likely to be a leaky hose to, or from the oil cooler.. if the cooler was leaking, he'd have strawberry quick in the system..
Boat US's sea tow insurance is just stupid not to have... great deal, first tow pays for it and then some... actually from my understanding, that card/deal is covering 1/2 the haul out fee's for all the storm boats that got hauled... thats pretty cool...
and yeah, I've seen plenty of Mako's over the years, MUCH fewer in the last decade or so tho...
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ok lets pull this back on topic... hahahahahaha...
ok so question for you guys out there..
so now that i understand what ryoken was saying about the switches and fuse and all that...
im thinking of taking the relay pack off of the winch.. the winch is still 90% below the bed line...
would you think i should move the relay pack to the box in the bed?
if so the wires on it now are not that big.. there are 3... guessing 1 for power and 1 to turn motor 1 way and 3rd to turn motor the other way???
do you think it is stupid to move the relay pack?
just looking for input..... i have everything to do it but for a few connectors and they are cheap....
ok so question for you guys out there..
so now that i understand what ryoken was saying about the switches and fuse and all that...
im thinking of taking the relay pack off of the winch.. the winch is still 90% below the bed line...
would you think i should move the relay pack to the box in the bed?
if so the wires on it now are not that big.. there are 3... guessing 1 for power and 1 to turn motor 1 way and 3rd to turn motor the other way???
do you think it is stupid to move the relay pack?
just looking for input..... i have everything to do it but for a few connectors and they are cheap....
if the relay is going to be subject to bad conditions down at the winch and corrosion is your concern, sure, moving the pack to a protected area is a good idea...
pretty common, I'm doing the same with mine... you'll want to up the wire size to account for the added length in the circuit...
pretty common, I'm doing the same with mine... you'll want to up the wire size to account for the added length in the circuit...
winch box removed and getting ready for paint...
going to my favorite store today.. fazzios...
when you can go to home depot and get 4 bolts, nuts, washers that are grade 8 for about $12... you can walk out of this place with a 5lb bag for $7.50ish!!!!!!!!!!!
they charge by the lb...
so if anyone ever needs anything.. also a great road trip if you need anything..
they sell ANYTHING... doors, brooms, tools, used stuff too like welders, lathes, etc.... but you got to go and expect to spend some time there... open till 5pm weekdays and till noon on saturday...
http://www.josephfazzioinc.com/
OMG their new online store is sweet.... but you have to see this place in person...
going to my favorite store today.. fazzios...
when you can go to home depot and get 4 bolts, nuts, washers that are grade 8 for about $12... you can walk out of this place with a 5lb bag for $7.50ish!!!!!!!!!!!
they charge by the lb...
so if anyone ever needs anything.. also a great road trip if you need anything..
they sell ANYTHING... doors, brooms, tools, used stuff too like welders, lathes, etc.... but you got to go and expect to spend some time there... open till 5pm weekdays and till noon on saturday...
http://www.josephfazzioinc.com/
OMG their new online store is sweet.... but you have to see this place in person...
