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Possible new boat Edit: bought one Wellcraft 230 open bow

bigjimmy82 said:
Gotcha, I’ll check the electrical. It’s loud before startup!

Do you know if the ECU is same between 502/454? Maybe just larger injectors? Turns out this is a few season old rebuild swapped in place of a 454 that lost a piston due to failed injector. Sounds like best way to prevent that is to just proactively replace the injectors?

Recommendation on a good relay center? Looking to clean up the exhaust wiring, so really just need 2 relays, but 4 spot would work.
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eesh, sorry i never saw this... i definitely don't get "notifications" in here all the time...

the ecu's run mephi 4, 555's, etc.. there are carry overs in 454 to 502's.. most of that stuff was mephi 4... those injectors are prolly close, but they may have a few # difference.. honestly, I just order whatever is on the serial #...

and.. you touched on a huge mpfi subject... yes, injector services are highly recommended on anything in the 10 yr and older category.. we prolly do 15 to 20 sets a yr.. send them out to a reputable cleaning service.. new injectors are stooopid $$$$4...

if you start losing a few rpms here and there, it's often the sign of an injector shittin the bed.. plug readings are your friend.. i diagnose 75% of running issues with plug readings... always remember that merc ASSUMES that your fuel system is operating 100% correctly..
 
parts? we run all merc.. the 25-40 still has good zinc and is killa oil.. i run it in my gas rigs at home... and we like merc filters.. you aren't saving much with a sierra.. obviously wix and napa gold are reasonable too...
 
I run baldwins or fleet guard on other stuff, but if I can find Merc online that works. Previous owner got back to me, he’s been running the 25w-40 also, so I’ll continue that.

Can you share recommendations for injector rebuilder? Thinking I’ll do that and verify fuel pressure reading before start of season, along with cap/rotor/plugs.

And your comment that Merc assumes 100% fuel system is that due to the ecu having no air/fuel reference? (At least I haven’t seen an o2 sensor anywhere yet)
 
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Wes Harden said:
How about them Volvo Penta tbi injectors? @ryoken
My boat is 22ish years old motor maybe 8 yr
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TBI is a whole other story from the mpfi's... they actually tend to be a bit more forgiving than the smaller, later mpfi ones.. we rarely had issues with em, and most of the time, they where reasonably priced new.. never sent a pair for service..

and 2, vs 8 at $175 to $300 a piece... :eek1: i just had a customer spend $4800 on 16 crusader injectors for new engines he had built. well, he did, I told em to send the old ones out for service...

best trick i know for checking TBI's are to watch the cone with a timing light strobe.. amazing the difference visually...
 
bigjimmy82 said:
I run baldwins or fleet guard on other stuff, but if I can find Merc online that works. Previous owner got back to me, he’s been running the 25w-40 also, so I’ll continue that.

Can you share recommendations for injector rebuilder? Thinking I’ll do that and verify fuel pressure reading before start of season, along with cap/rotor/plugs.
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we've been looking hard at getting our own machine.. i have a guy local, but he is super slow sometimes.. we've been using this good guy out of NY... pretty fast turn around, reasonable, etc.. guy sends ya a novel of a report... :haha:

forget his name, I'll ask Rog today and get back to ya...
 
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I edited my post above while you responded ‍

“And your comment that Merc assumes 100% fuel system is that due to the ecu having no air/fuel reference? (At least I haven’t seen an o2 sensor anywhere yet)”
 
bigjimmy82 said:
I edited my post above while you responded ‍

“And your comment that Merc assumes 100% fuel system is that due to the ecu having no air/fuel reference? (At least I haven’t seen an o2 sensor anywhere yet)”
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not unless it has cats.. luckily we haven't seen a ton of those yet... yeah, they'll give ya ton of other data in smartcraft, laptop software, etc, but fuel is assumed to be fine...
 
No cats, that’s interesting and definitely makes the checking out the fuel system critical!
 
I run the mercruiser quicksilver stuff. That, or wix, exclusively.

Does your 502 have the mechanical fuel pump on the back of the raw water pump? If so, change the gear oil in it yearly. I just pull mine off and dump it out, much easier than trying to extract such a small amount of fluid through a tiny fill hole.
 
I “think” it only has the cool fuel setup on the port side. I’ll have to look behind the raw water pump.
 
bigjimmy82 said:
I “think” it only has the cool fuel setup on the port side. I’ll have to look behind the raw water pump.
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you shouldn't with a cool fuel system iirc..

what he's referring to is quite the interesting little bit of Merc engineering in the cross over yrs.. ;) they where only around 2, maybe 3 yrs....

they actually don't work bad as the low pressure pump... downfalls being it has a stoopid skinny belt.. and if the diaphragm on the pump goes, it fills that oil cavity with fuel... and the oil change tends to be neglected... and of course factor in all your typical maintenance and wear to a raw water pump.. ;)

but overall, they actually worked pretty good when fresh...


iu
 
Ha! So it’s a fuel pump and raw water pump all in one? That is pretty ingenious.

Edit: or I guess that shaft just has a cam on it to drive the standard block mounted pump.

And that makes sense because GM did away with the fuel pump boss on the newer blocks, so Mercury was stuck to figure something out.
 
yup, a stop gap till they could figure out a reasonable low/hi electric setup.... which they have certainly battled with over the yrs.. along with exhaust dilemmas...


you'll find Merc engineering good about 83% of the time, but boy, they do screw the pooch occasionally... ;)


after your setup, they initiated the cool fuel modules...


iu






what a complete trainwreck the first iteration was.... their cooling fittings would corrode and cut cooling off...

over time, we had to replace EVERY SINGLE ONE....

they are a grand a piece.... they've since redesigned them and the newer unit provides outstanding service for the most part... but there isn't a boat out there with the first style left...


well, maybe you freshwater guys.. ;)
 
ryoken said:
yup, a stop gap till they could figure out a reasonable low/hi electric setup.... which they have certainly battled with over the yrs.. along with exhaust dilemmas...


you'll find Merc engineering good about 83% of the time, but boy, they do screw the pooch occasionally... ;)


after your setup, they initiated the cool fuel modules...


iu






what a complete trainwreck the first iteration was.... their cooling fittings would corrode and cut cooling off...

over time, we had to replace EVERY SINGLE ONE....

they are a grand a piece.... they've since redesigned them and the newer unit provides outstanding service for the most part... but there isn't a boat out there with the first style left...


well, maybe you freshwater guys.. ;)
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I’ve talked to you about this when we were having trouble but I think your thoughts may be helpful to myself and others.
My brother has the 8.2 Mag. with B3 in a 2015 boat.
I have the same setup in a 2011.
My brothers boat kept shutting down and he found the module to be empty. He took it apart and went to the NAPA store where they matched part numbers and we put new pumps in the module. Reason being the module was on indefinite back order. It wasn’t a big deal to do it and he saved about $8 or $9 hundred.
We took the boat out and thought it was fixed. Turns out it wasn’t.
I talked to a guy at Teague Custom Marine.
He said someone has put ethanol gas in it and the pickup tube is a plastic which is not compatible with ethanol and it has cracked. He said he puts a copper pickup tube back in because it is impossible to get a new OEM in without cutting fiberglass.
Then I talked to @ktmoutfront and he told me it’s the pickup tube.

What I’d like to know is if I have the crappy module and if there is anything I can do to fix it before it breaks.
 
TuckerK5 said:
I’ve talked to you about this when we were having trouble but I think your thoughts may be helpful to myself and others.
My brother has the 8.2 Mag. with B3 in a 2015 boat.
I have the same setup in a 2011.
My brothers boat kept shutting down and he found the module to be empty. He took it apart and went to the NAPA store where they matched part numbers and we put new pumps in the module. Reason being the module was on indefinite back order. It wasn’t a big deal to do it and he saved about $8 or $9 hundred.
We took the boat out and thought it was fixed. Turns out it wasn’t.
I talked to a guy at Teague Custom Marine.
He said someone has put ethanol gas in it and the pickup tube is a plastic which is not compatible with ethanol and it has cracked. He said he puts a copper pickup tube back in because it is impossible to get a new OEM in without cutting fiberglass.
Then I talked to @ktmoutfront and he told me it’s the pickup tube.

What I’d like to know is if I have the crappy module and if there is anything I can do to fix it before it breaks.
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welcome to the club.. took me 6 months to get a timing cover last yr... and the modules have had many backorder periods since their inception... than throw plandemic stuff in...

sure, you can just change out the electric pump.. be wary of what you are putting in tho.. not sure backorder status on just the pumps.. keep in mind, most modules where updated.. if your coolant hose fitting thread in the body, your good...

there really isn't anything else to go wrong.. reg, filter and pump... tho they did have a bout of paint peeling and clogging regs at one time..


a reading up at the rail tells ya the story.... we take runs all the time with the gauge hooked up...
 
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oh he!! no.. not a boat that fresh.. first of all, you'd service them.. as I mentioned OEM injectors are stooopid $$$$.. that's throwing 2 g's at the boat... and $80 Amazonians are HIGHLY discouraged..

all that said, I don't know what I'm diagnosing here, what are the performance issues?


if you have proper pressure up at the rail, are getting uneven/funky plug readings and down on rpm's, yes I'm looking at an injector issue usually... if you've had trash get thru the system, you may very well have clogged injectors... when those regs would get paint in em, merc would recommend you actually replace the fuel rail and service the injectors.. i just clean the rails with gumout, my local injector guy will run em thru an ultrasonic cleaner too..

ya send the injectors out, get em back in a week or 2, like $350 or so... maybe $300.. i don't write the checks.. ;)
 
I should have said “do I need to send my injectors off for service?”.
The boat runs great.
Only issue I’ve had was it randomly and suddenly slowing to an idle when running on plane.
The code showed low drive lube but the reservoir was full. I think it was a stuck float switch.
 
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