CK5
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Project Eat Soot

Well after getting the steering box sorted out I went ahead and mounted up some steering parts. 1.25" DOM tube , still need to get it cleaned and painted. She is finally starting to look like something. Still lots to go but I'm having a great time with it.

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Not alot going on lately I have been cleaning the frame and engine just waiting to get the SSOR engine crossmember so I can put it between the rails. I'm having a tough time with boxing of the frame, some say box the hell out of it then others say just leave it and let the frame and suspension flex :dunno:. I'm kinda torn on which way to go. I don't believe Mosesburb has any boxing but his is a 3/4 ton his has held up so far. Any suggestions? Anyway here's a few shots of the prep. Still need to finish engine cleanup.

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My own opinion is that its not needed. However, keep in mind that the new chevys are boxed in the front part of the frame going back to right around under the doors.
 
I think additional beefy crossmembers are just as good as boxing, if not better. My .02
 
ES,

Here's my opinion on boxing...

For most applications where the objective is to reduce torsional loads (twisting) of the frame, boxing will not gain as much as either (a) tying the rollcage/enging cradle into the frame or (b) replacing the stock riveted crossmembers with a bolt-together crossmember at each of the factory locations. There is almost nothing that will be effective in preventing torsional flex of a traditional ladderframe unless you can somehow triangulate it beyond the X,Y axis with a Z-axis (height) brace. That's why the cage mounts or firewall/engine cradles work so well. Replacing the riveted crossmembers only helps because most of the factory rivets have become loosened up over time, and no longer provide strong torsional strength.

However, in your case you are also dealing with a different issue... and that is a very heavy engine swap which also requires you to think about vertical loading of the frame, not just torsional. A boxed frame will offer significant benefits in supporting the vertical loads, and if it were my project I'd seriously consider doing at least the engine area.....

At the point where the transition occurs from fully-boxed to unboxed, I'd use that "fish tail" shape (can't remember the technical term for it) to allow for a more gradual distribution of torsional forces into the unboxed section. With a simple blunt transition, you are likely to see stress cracks where the boxed and unboxed areas meet. I can find a source photo for you if that description doesn't make sense.

Boxing the frame now will be a lot easier than when the engine is in there....so it's probably a good time to say "Might As Well" if you are the kind of person who hates second-guessing themselves later on. :D


-G
 
Great info guys thank you all, I think I will go ahead and box back to the firewall area. I don't know about you guys but these things called an Dodge NV4500 heavy duty don't grow on trees around here. Hard to find used on Craiglist and the junk yards. I may have to shell out some extra cash for reman at a shop.
 
Great info guys thank you all, I think I will go ahead and box back to the firewall area.

I wouldn't stop under the firewall. That is where these frames typically bend upward from normal use. Run the boxing back to where the frame straightens out. I'd go just past the trans crossmember and make a pretty big fishmouth so as not to create a stress riser right there.

I don't know about you guys but these things called an Dodge NV4500 heavy duty don't grow on trees around here. Hard to find used on Craiglist and the junk yards. I may have to shell out some extra cash for reman at a shop.

Yeah, you may want to keep the hinge on your wallet well lubed until you are done with this project. You *can* take a GM 4500 and convert the front of it to a Dodge HD. Depending on the year, the input shaft and input bearing retainer will need to be changed, the retainer pilot will need to be machined to fit the bore of the GM case, the bolt circle on the retainer will need to be modified and the bolt pattern of the transmission will need to be changed. Also, try to get a shifter assembly with the trans. There are several designs of them and they vary in price from a couple to a few hundred, yep, just for the shifter.

Don't forget, in order to run a NV4500 behind a 1st Gen motor, you have to run one of those HIIIIIGH dollar, POS Advance Adapters conversion bellhousing. I say POS because AA does not finish them for ****. Plan on spending a couple hours with a grinder finishing the part. You would think for the money they charge it would be gold plated and polished, but no, it isn't. Buy a good clutch too. I have a South Bend in mine and absolutely love it.

Then you need clutch hydraulics. They are only a few hundred from the dealer though--see things are getting cheaper!! The whole thing comes in a bag and is a drop in install--no bleeding, nothing. Bolt it in and go. This is of course after you make mounting provisions for it.

What transfer case are you going to run?? 241 with a SYE would be a good choice, bolts in, no fuss, no muss. A 205 will work, but you want the round pattern. I have seen some for sale recently and a few for decent prices. I couldn't beg, borrow or steal one when I was doing mine.

On your motor, that cast piece of **** that says Dodge and Cummins on it, throw it away amd make one out of mandrel bent pipe. That piece is a huge restriction and a piece of exhaust pipe will flow better and keep EGTs down a little.
 
-G Thanks for the thoughts on the fish plate, after looking at it on Saturday you are right it on the plate it would be tough to get the plate tight against the frame...so scratch that idea! I will just box it and be done with it. Still waiting on SSOR engine crossmember to show up on the Brown trk. Hopefully I will be able to test fit the engine this weekend.

Moses- Thanks for all your input. Man looks like alot of "good times" ahead and I'm sure many F-bombs to be had with getting this thing together. I am planning on running the 205 t-case but I think I will wait and see what the availablity is at that time. I am surprised on the AA bellhousing, you would think it would be a nice part for the money, I looked at them last week they had them on sale for like $389 I may just find a 94-98 12v engine plate etc. I will be getting rid of that cast intake to add a IC so it will be gone. I also need to find a different t-stat housing that facing towards the left side or straight up.
 
Well finally have made some progress! After waiting for a month and a half for my cross member to come in (which was in stock when I ordered) long story there. Anyway got the cross member bolted up to the engine and did a few tests to see where it would fit. (thanks Moses-Nick). Over the weekend did the final fit location on the brackets and will get them welded up tonight. Last week I scored on some more parts, a complete NV4500 HD swap kit that one of the local wrecking yards puts together. It just so happened that when I picked up the parts they had just gotten a first gen Dodge with 29 spline NP205 that will bolt directly to the NV4500 they are pretty hard to find so grabbed everything down to the pedals and driveshafts. I should have it in soon, also did some work in the firewall painting and cleaning not sure if I like it yet. Here are some pics some are a little fuzzy.

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Dude!!! Nice score on the 4500/205! I'm a little jealous of how this rig is coming together:bow:

I like the black on the bottom of the firewall, should help keep it looking clean for sure. Most of it won't be noticeable with your front clip/inner fenders on there anyways. Good updates man:waytogo:
 
Made some progress this weekend! We had a great time installing the engine on friday night...3 hours later I realized that mock up is a far cry from final install anyway we got it. As it sits now I decided not to run an intercooler I mainly want to get it fired up and make sure it runs good before I move forward and add the cooler later. Still need to modify front cross member or build a new one. I'm getting flywheel turned this week and can hopefully stab transmission this weekend. I'm open for any suggestions if you see and problems besides the Dodge Ram on the intake!Maybe I took too many pics! Pics to follow
 
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