That's a 1st Gen history lesson that I will tell you tomorrow (busy in the shop now)
It's a cool story, but you should just remove it and keep it as a souvenir
-G
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'72 K5 - Where do I go from here?
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That's a 1st Gen history lesson that I will tell you tomorrow (busy in the shop now)
It's a cool story, but you should just remove it and keep it as a souvenir
-G
I DD an Imron framed rig.. nice when it's so durable, washable, etc..... it's not just for show trucks.....
If those are the worst areas, I think you have a pristine truck.
Looking at how it cleans up, I'm even more sure you have a pristine truck. $100 should make it shine very nicely.
I was back out there at 4 this morning looking at this thing. I might be missing something, but I actually think I will save time by just undoing all of the body mount bolts (have to do that anyway), removing the steering shaft (going to anyway to change bushings), removing gas tank/associated hoses/wires (going to anyway), and simply lifting up the body with my lift. Roll frame out on the rocks, power wash the &$*$%#@*! out of it, scrape, wire brush, rattle can - done. Roll back inside and start doing suspension work (ok, maybe wait to paint until after suspension work is done). Suspension, put in NP205, engine/tranny, hook up drive shafts, push back under and lower body. Honestly, I think it would be faster than doing all of that work with the two attached, and since I will not have to do anything 'extra' to do it, why would I not?
Somebody please tell me what I am missing. Also, looks like the best places to lift the body would be front of rocker boxes and just behind rear of them where that meaty body mount is. I'd have to use some pieces of 2x4 for lift arms to clear body edges, but that should not be a problem.
Somebody please tell me what I am missing. Also, looks like the best places to lift the body would be front of rocker boxes and just behind rear of them where that meaty body mount is. I'd have to use some pieces of 2x4 for lift arms to clear body edges, but that should not be a problem.
I think that's what Greg has been trying to tell you...
Might As Well, right?
I don't see any downsides, except for some comments Greg made early on about tweaking the body if you don't reinforce it correctly. I'll let him chime in, as I have no knowledge in this area.
Thanks Campfire, I appreciate it. I believe I read that if you leave the doors on and have solid rocker boxes, you are ok. Regardless, I'll wait to hear what Greg has to say, he obviously knows what he is talking about.......yeah, I guess that's what he was saying all along, guess I did not believe it until I stood under there looking at everything very closely. Had to be that, can't be that I am a little 'slow on the uptake!'
Here's the answer to your "mystery bracket" question... (from 2008)
https://ck5.com/forums/threads/front-suspension-question.234417/#post-2274951
I'll be curious to see if yours has copper nuts like mine did!!
-G
That is freakin awesome Greg! You should write a book about these things - I'd buy it.
If the torsion boxes seem solid AND the doors are left in place, I'd be willing to risk pulling the body up an off using your lift. Obviously, I'd be watching the door gaps carefully in those first moments as the body was lifted just to make SURE that it wasn't trying to fold in half...
Basically, you've already pulled the front clip so there are literally only 1o body mount bolts, a steering shaft, a fuel hose and a couple small wiring harnesses away from separating the two parts. Even if you choose NOT to fully-detail the frame (sandblast, etc) it will be SO much easier to do your cleanup work and the running of new fuel lines, brake lines, electrical once you have unrestricted access to a rolling chassis. Given your overall timeline for the project, there's really no reason to keep the body attached.... it's going to save you a phenomenal amount of time in the long run because of how much easier everything is to reach, clean and replace.
-G
I have to attend a board meeting tonight, so I might not have time to do this tonight, but I think I am going to cut up some pieces of 2x4/2x6/4x6 and see if there is a way I can lift, yet still provide support down the longitudinal lines of the body. I am thinking maybe 4x6 under the entire length of the torsion boxes.
I'd always been tempted to try to lift it from ABOVE. No matter where you put the lift arms or extra bracing (underneath) it always seems like it's going to be in the way later on.
Thinking out loud and in stream-of-consioiusness here: How about some box tubing or angle iron that runs the length of the interior (longitudinally) and allows you to drill a hole and drop bolts back into the body mount holes (from above) to cinch-down the new bracing fixture? Do something that grabs maybe two sets of bod mounts (per side in the rear bed area) and then build down from that long section so that you can reach the front cab support (dropped front seat area) with a plate and long bolt too?
The idea is that you separate the body using a 2x4 for leverage, then drop the long bolts through your new fixture and put an nut and fat washer on the underside of the factory body mount locations. Then you can put the lift arms ABOVE the bedrails and drop chains down and connect to your new fixture. With a little experimentation, you can even find a good "balance point" so that the tub comes stays nice and level as your raise it up.
What I like about that method is that the post arms aren't blocking anything underneath and you don't have to lift from the torsion box (which isn't really "structural" in that way)...and potentially crush it. You might even be able to do a decent amount of underbody rust repair and pull off the torsion boxes (to deal with the inevitable rust in the floors and cab supports).
-G
I totally forgot you were putting in a lift last weekend
I know I am late to the party, but man that lift is awesome. That has to be soooo nice having that in now. Congrats sir.
I know I am late to the party, but man that lift is awesome. That has to be soooo nice having that in now. Congrats sir.
Greg, sounds like a great idea. I am just worried that, knowing me, I will end up NUKING it out and spending a month trying to get it where I am comfortable with it. I thought about it while yogging earlier, I have a few ideas I need to look into. BTW, how do you 'remove' the Torsion boxes? Mine are welded (and it looks like a factory weld) at the front top seam. The rear, sure, but I don't see how you remove the whole thing without cutting them. If I could, I think I might just run a 6x6 between the tires (longitudinally) and lift that. Sure, that 6"x4'ish area would be covered, but at least the weight would be distributed across a larger section of floorboard and that would take 20 minutes to set up. Hell, I can grab the lumber from a buddy down the street. This, of course, predicated on the assumption that I get the torsion boxes open and the floorboard is as clean and solid as that area I took the pic of last night........a HUGE assumption.
GWeakland, Thanks man! Honestly, it's better than I thought it would be. Hell, my '72 has been sitting up there a few days now, and I have zero concern. I think my friends are more excited than me......"Oh man, it will be so easy to fix xyz now...." Seriously, I recommend anyone who can get one - get one, and if you do - go 10K, that way you can lift anything you ever might want to lift.
GWeakland, Thanks man! Honestly, it's better than I thought it would be. Hell, my '72 has been sitting up there a few days now, and I have zero concern. I think my friends are more excited than me......"Oh man, it will be so easy to fix xyz now...." Seriously, I recommend anyone who can get one - get one, and if you do - go 10K, that way you can lift anything you ever might want to lift.
Torsion boxes require you to unbolt the rear access cover, then carefully cut the factory perimeter welds (inner and outer) as well as the ones that tie it into the front footwell... Careful prying will help to break each weld joint. Jam a screwdriver in there to keep pressure on the next weld joint and keep working your way down the line.
SPOILER ALERT!
When you get the torsion box off you will find rust in the front cab support.
. More on the passenger side, but both sides will need attention.
About 10 years ago we had a thread in the 1St Gen forum called "THE CANCER SUPPORT THREAD"... You can probably still find it, though I'm sure all the photo links are broken now. It was basically a support group for all the guys who bought "rust free" 1St Gens and then started digging into the rocker and footwell areas and realized that they had some pretty severe rust damage to repair.
It's a big, rusty onion.... Or an elephant that you need to eat one-bite-at-a-time (chose your favorite analogy)... The 1St Gen guys have all been there, so when it comes time to confront your "issues" there's a good group of people to help you though it.
-G
SPOILER ALERT!
When you get the torsion box off you will find rust in the front cab support.
. More on the passenger side, but both sides will need attention.About 10 years ago we had a thread in the 1St Gen forum called "THE CANCER SUPPORT THREAD"... You can probably still find it, though I'm sure all the photo links are broken now. It was basically a support group for all the guys who bought "rust free" 1St Gens and then started digging into the rocker and footwell areas and realized that they had some pretty severe rust damage to repair.
It's a big, rusty onion.... Or an elephant that you need to eat one-bite-at-a-time (chose your favorite analogy)... The 1St Gen guys have all been there, so when it comes time to confront your "issues" there's a good group of people to help you though it.
-G
Why did I just now think of this, I have no idea. Probably a good idea to put the top back on and get every bolt I can into it before taking the body off, huh? Of course, the additional weight may negate the benefit of having the top in place..........
It will be a lot harder to lift the body off from above with the top on... I suppose you could roll the door glass down, but I don't think you will be at the right balance point, and aren't likely to get the lift arms through the windows
-G
Bigblue7-2
1/2 ton status
Ok. I know I am a long long way off from removing my body completely from the frame so I wont propose this question on my thread especially since we are debating this here.
What if we BRACE the doors like when you do the resto of the rocker box and rockers? This way the door opening stays where you welded it and it can be lifted without any fear of movement? Once I get thru the firewall patching, if the funds allow, I will put in new bedsides and rear floor then BRACE the doors and lift the body off completely. That was my plan anyway.
What do ya think??
What if we BRACE the doors like when you do the resto of the rocker box and rockers? This way the door opening stays where you welded it and it can be lifted without any fear of movement? Once I get thru the firewall patching, if the funds allow, I will put in new bedsides and rear floor then BRACE the doors and lift the body off completely. That was my plan anyway.
What do ya think??
I have numerous recommendations to brace in that manner. If my floorboard/rocker panels looked anything like the ones in that pic, no question. However, all of my stuff seems rock solid. Based on a recommendation from a guy on 67-72chevytrucks, I did go out last night and measure/look at what I believe will actually be a very easy way to do this. The computer Nazis at work don't allow uploading/pasting of pictures so I cannot post them, but basically he cut some 4x4s and ran them under the floor cross braces, outside the frame rails in the rear - place lifting pads in center - and put the lifting pads under the floor braces in the front. I believe I will go one step further and run pieces of 4x4 about 1.5' back from the front of the floor braces (from where they bend up the firewall, back towards the center). Doing it like that I will only have a few feet without bracing. I'll just clean those areas up before I lift the body off, and then hit them with the rattle can at the back end of the job.
The first thing I am going to do is get all of the bolts out, steering, brake lines, etc, and then, with a person standing watch at each door seam, break it loose and very slowly apply some pressure from underneath. If I see/hear anything that scares me, I'll stop and come up with another plan. Hell, even this morning I was out there in work clothes with a tape measure while my daughter is waiting in the '88 for me to drop her off at school......I feel very confident about this method, and it will be a HUGE time saver to get that body off......as Greg tried to tell me all along........
The first thing I am going to do is get all of the bolts out, steering, brake lines, etc, and then, with a person standing watch at each door seam, break it loose and very slowly apply some pressure from underneath. If I see/hear anything that scares me, I'll stop and come up with another plan. Hell, even this morning I was out there in work clothes with a tape measure while my daughter is waiting in the '88 for me to drop her off at school......I feel very confident about this method, and it will be a HUGE time saver to get that body off......as Greg tried to tell me all along........
Bigblue7-2
1/2 ton status
Realistically you should be fine as long as u are still solid. After all if you are evenly lifting it it should maintain its shape. If you plan on keeping the doors on just keep an eye on the seams. Take a picture....I always imagine things moving even when they are not.
And yes, my floor boards into the rockers and cab supports and a pillar all were completely trash. Now they are all replaced and solid.
And yes, my floor boards into the rockers and cab supports and a pillar all were completely trash. Now they are all replaced and solid.
BTW, my chocolate lab likes to hang out in my Blazers as well. She'll jump in the back seat and just kinda hang out for hours. Funny as hell.
