73 K20....crossmember time

[wetoolowdingbangow]

Well, look at it this way, doing the 241 underdrive you don't have to regear your axles. That just paid for you to buy the eco box kit. You already need the shaft regardless so . . .

In most cases I am all for doing as much fab as you can but this seems like a no brainer to me. Save yourself the extra work AND end up with a better product than you could make on your own. There is still a good bit of work (labor) involved in building the 241 doubler using the eco box kit, that is why you aren't paying the extra $800-$1,000 for a complete unit. I KNOW you won't be disappointed with the kit, but there is a chance you won't be happy with what you make on your own, especially if you are cutting and reusing the stock 241 case.

I can see where youre coming from. If i had dimensions i would bet i could hold just as tight of tolerances as what nwf,ORD or anyone else. Im not using an angle grinder and a drill press here. The machines id be using will be within .001" so thats more than enough for this type of stuff.

This is sort of a budget truck. Thats not to say i want to put a crappy truck together with junk parts. Im a machinist and a designer so i see right through any of these adapters and cases. I think there great but not that kind of money great.

I know theres a lot of people who dont agree with that but there are also a lot of people who dont have the machines i have at their disposal so theyre forced to buy stuff as opposed to making it.

 

[blazinzuk]

I would drop the coin on the nwf stuff. I know several guys who have machined their own peices. Well actually only 2 finished em up. It's not just the machining it's the engineering behind them. Alot of engineering and design goes into them. They guys at NWF went through a couple designs before it worked how they wanted.


Not saying your not capable I don't know your level of engineering and design knowledge. Just saying it's gonna take you 5 times as long and cost almost as much.

 

[wetoolowdingbangow]

I would drop the coin on the nwf stuff. I know several guys who have machined their own peices. Well actually only 2 finished em up. It's not just the machining it's the engineering behind them. Alot of engineering and design goes into them. They guys at NWF went through a couple designs before it worked how they wanted.


Not saying your not capable I don't know your level of engineering and design knowledge. Just saying it's gonna take you 5 times as long and cost almost as much.

Ok let me put this out there so we can move on.

Im not buying any magical eco boxes. Not gonna happen.

I fully understand the ease of clicking the mouse and swiping the card but its not worth it to me. If the 241 is going to create problems like this then ill **** can that and do a 203 205 for simplicity sake. I have material sitting here waiting to go and dxf drawings waiting for tool directions. Im willing to bet that I can make this happen for half cost of anything youll buy off the shelf. In fact ill document the whole thing and you guys can watch it happen.

I know theres a lot of guys doing what they can out of the garage, which I have more respect for than anything but im operating on a different scale. It would be a large disappointment for me not to do this myself given my experience, drive and the ability to run machinery.

Im not trying to pick a fight but I think its time to stand back and watch. Hell maybe ill do the 241 and come up with a design and patent it.

Ive got a lot of high precision experience so the machining aspect will be a walk in the park. Its very typical for me to make parts that have .001" across the span of 12 inches or more. These adapter plates could be off by a factor of 10 or more and still be considered very accurate.

I know folks who arent from the engineering will have a hard time understanding why I want to reinvent the wheel but its for me. I enjoy the challenge. People who have this attitude create the next best thing. I value your opinions, im just difficult lol.

 

[truck-oholic]

 

[blazinzuk]

Not trying to start a fight dude. Just telling you my expirence. That's all. And relaying problems that other folks I know with ( it sounds like) a similar skill set to you have had. I think it's awesome when people build their own stuff.

Simply trying to point out possible pitfalls.

 

[wetoolowdingbangow]

Not trying to start a fight dude. Just telling you my expirence. That's all. And relaying problems that other folks I know with ( it sounds like) a similar skill set to you have had. I think it's awesome when people build their own stuff.

Simply trying to point out possible pitfalls.

No worries at all. I appreciate both sides and realize it could go wrong. I also know my stuff though. I've gotten good knowledge from you before. I'll know better by the end of this week what I need to do or what route I'm going.

 

[blazinzuk]

I would spend hours and hours building stuff if I had access to your tools lol.

I rarely tell people to just build it cause 97% don't want to even though 50% say they want too.

BTW I have a 32 spline 465 but it's a long output mated to a 205

 

[truck-oholic]

BTW I have a 32 spline 465 but it's a long output mated to a 205

Aren't the only short output 465s the 10 spline? All the 32 spline should be long output with the long 6 bolt round adapter, no? I kept the long 6 bolt adapter and just drilled and tapped the face of the 203 to match.

 

[82355]

Yes, unless you are running an aftermarket output shaft, all 32 spline SM465's are long output shafts.

Martin

 

[wetoolowdingbangow]

Yes, unless you are running an aftermarket output shaft, all 32 spline SM465's are long output shafts.

Martin

Right which is why the adapter is so long for the aluminum cases. So if you get an after market shaft you must have to run there adapter (ord)?

 

[82355]

Never ran one.

Martin

 

[82355]

An SM465 with a long adapter is the same length as either a TH700R4 or a TH400 with an NP208 adapter.

Martin

 

[wetoolowdingbangow]

An SM465 with a long adapter is the same length as either a TH700R4 or a TH400 with an NP208 adapter.

Martin

Good to know. I wonder what the 465 203 205 is in comparison to 700/208. I'm still using a slip yoke so my shaft has to be rebuilt for the fixed yoke anyway.

 

[truck-oholic]

Good to know. I wonder what the 465 203 205 is in comparison to 700/208. I'm still using a slip yoke so my shaft has to be rebuilt for the fixed yoke anyway.

Probably depends on the adapter kit used but I would say they are pretty close. A 203/205 isn't much longer, if at all, than a stock 203. Never had a 208 and 203 side by side but they can't be more than a couple inches different.

 

[wetoolowdingbangow]

Got some parts in...

 

[wetoolowdingbangow]

Got the 14 bolt out of the back of the truck last night. Now i have 3 lol. One under my truck (1990-2000 2nd gen), a semi float and now a full width 14 bolt from the 70's.

Trying to sell the semi right now.

Heres the new 14 bolt...



Turns out....its a 13 bolt! Its has a pretty well done shave. Nothing aftermarket added. Still has pleanty of meat...i think over .5". Wasnt leaking when i got it.



I emptied the fluid to see what it looked like inside. The guy was running 37s and said it rode nice on the freeway. His guess was it was 3.73 but i knew it couldnt be. It turns out there 4.10 gears. Everything looked great inside. I should be able to flip the ring and pinion for a little dough to put toward my 5.38s.





It appears its an open diff. I suppose it could be a gov lock but i dont think you can tell without opening it. Im debating on welding it. The spider gears are with nothing and if i dont like it ill take it out and do a locker. Lockers arent very cheap for the 14b for some reason. I got my d60 spartan for $200 less than the going rate for a 14 bolt locker.

Any opinions on welding the diff? I really only drive this on the street maybe 2 or 3 times a month.

 

[skunked]

how many cross pin holes are there in the carrier?

3 holes= Gov Lock

4 holes= open diff

you can still weld the Gov carriers

 

[blazinzuk]

I'm not a huge fan of welding. I have seen welded and spooled trucks push more in an obstacle than one with a locker. If that makes sense. They seem to push a little harder in a couple cases preventing a rig from getting that inch they needed to stay on line. But that is easily overcome.

I have welded probably 30 diffs in the time I have been working on stuff. I would say at least half of those guys bought lockers eventually.

Just recently I welded a couple guys that daily drive. Seems like tire wear is increased by half. So it wears through tires. But if ya weld it and like it then you can just leave it.

 

[82355]

I don't know that a 4.10 ring and pinion are worth much. They are pretty much the most common gear set in a 14bff.

Martin

 

[wetoolowdingbangow]

how many cross pin holes are there in the carrier?

3 holes= Gov Lock

4 holes= open diff

you can still weld the Gov carriers

Droppin knowledge! Thanks i seem to remember 4 holes.

I'm not a huge fan of welding. I have seen welded and spooled trucks push more in an obstacle than one with a locker. If that makes sense. They seem to push a little harder in a couple cases preventing a rig from getting that inch they needed to stay on line. But that is easily overcome.

I have welded probably 30 diffs in the time I have been working on stuff. I would say at least half of those guys bought lockers eventually.

Just recently I welded a couple guys that daily drive. Seems like tire wear is increased by half. So it wears through tires. But if ya weld it and like it then you can just leave it.

I thought the same thing. If i dont like it i can throw the welded part in the trash and put a locker in without too much trouble. Maybe i can score a detroit somewhere. I think they can be rebuilt. I definitely see the lockers push more on the trail. Im not sure they unlock much if your on the gas but yeah that is a definite negative to the welding. Im thinking ill give it a try. I only drive the truck maybe 2-3 times a month. The rest is trailering.

I don't know that a 4.10 ring and pinion are worth much. They are pretty much the most common gear set in a 14bff.

Martin

I was looking on ebay and saw a guy who is selling used ones for $100. Not sure how many hes sold but i figure ill throw mine on for $80. If not then itll become a picture frame.