MichaelJay
Banned
Great stuff!!
CK5
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Ball Joint Removal?? Success with re-assembled photos now!
- Thread starter jeff in co
- Start date
smalltruckbigcid
1/2 ton status
Great stuff, thank you!
Because it was still a little twitchy I thought that the sleeves were the main problem but after your explanation, that really helps (and logical too). I'll head back and have the toe adjusted better.
Because the tire "looks" to be tilted outward ever so slightly at the top (passenger worse than driver), will I ultimately have some poor tire wear in the future? Even though the cross numbers are close to one another, would it still make sense to put in a tapered sleeve to correct those a little? Would my "camber" number go closer to the 1.5* if I position the upper ball joint "inward" on both sides? Can I use two different degree sleeves for each side?
Really appreciate your input. They did tell me the "new" guy did the alignment this time.....I am assuming also he is "young" too and has not worked on solid axles too much.
To my eye the tires look slightly turned to the right so the left will look like it is straight up and down and the right will look tipped out at the top. Thats what caster/camber does.
Tire wear...loaded question. This is going to depend on how many miles you drive a year. Will you have some tire wear from this, yes but. The but is if you drive 5k miles per year you may not notice any wear problems from camber per say more like rotational problems. Meaning you need to rotate the tires front to rear. Also the softer the tire the faster it will wear no matter what.
Can you use different size sleeves in those holes? Yes. Just remember to line the taper on the washer up to correspond with the tip of the stud coming through so that the nut goes down flat when you tighten it up. Can you do this at home? Yes but how close you get is a crapshoot. really its better to do it on the alignment machine because you can get it perfect there. Me, I'd get the toe set and see how I like it then.
Well, I went to the Dealer on Friday and talked with them about the toe numbers and if they could get it better. The service advisor pretty much said it was as good as it could be and was within spec. He then went and got the mechanic who did the work and he also confirmed.....there was not much else they could do unless I wanted to try putting in some caster/camber shims in the upper ball joints. The mechanic said that the machine was jumping between 0.05 and 0.10 on the left side without really touching it. Pretty much "just on the edge".
They both agreed that moving the toe "just a hair" was not going to be noticable at all. They said that my problem was the lift and the 35" tires.
I told them it just didn't make sense that before all this work, with slop in the ball joints and tie rod ends and stock steering arm, I didn't have this twitchy problem.
Their conclusion....because of the slop, it was not noticable but now that I have a tighter suspension, I'm noticing it much more. Very frustrating.
I then went down to Midas and asked for their opinion. They also confirmed that the numbers really weren't that bad and suggested that a new steering stabilizer might help a bit. They did give me a supplier for the sleeves and said if I put them in, they would re-align the truck (including caster/camber) for $50 if I wanted. I may just do this but I don't have any, real, definite answers.
They both agreed that moving the toe "just a hair" was not going to be noticable at all. They said that my problem was the lift and the 35" tires.
I told them it just didn't make sense that before all this work, with slop in the ball joints and tie rod ends and stock steering arm, I didn't have this twitchy problem.
Their conclusion....because of the slop, it was not noticable but now that I have a tighter suspension, I'm noticing it much more. Very frustrating.
I then went down to Midas and asked for their opinion. They also confirmed that the numbers really weren't that bad and suggested that a new steering stabilizer might help a bit. They did give me a supplier for the sleeves and said if I put them in, they would re-align the truck (including caster/camber) for $50 if I wanted. I may just do this but I don't have any, real, definite answers.
both lazy dont care or know how to work on lifted truck stuff reply's
skip them both and get a buddy and adjust the toe your self with a tape measure and basic tools.
skip them both and get a buddy and adjust the toe your self with a tape measure and basic tools.
exactly
F those guys
do the toe with someone, see if it helps
if it doesn't, then worry about the other stuff
Sounds like a good idea and I'll give it a shot in the next few days. I'll do a little digging with the "search" to find out the best way to do it. I think all I want is about 1/8" toe-in compared with the back side of the tire....correct?
Thanks!
Thanks!
yeah
it's funny, you always have room for more toe in, you're threading in, not out LOL
it's funny, you always have room for more toe in, you're threading in, not out LOL
Found this as a good reference...... (thanks 38377K5!)
From one of my previous replies;
Put a piece of tape in the middle of the tread on both front tires (lined up with the hub). Draw a vertical line in marker on each piece of tape. Measure the distance between the two marks. Now roll the truck forward or back until the pieces of tape are on the back side of the tires. Measure the distance between the two marks. The front measurement should be 1/16-1/8" smaller than the measurement on the back (i.e. tires toed in).
__________________
-Chris
Resident Offroad Design rep
[email protected]
offroaddesign.com
970-945-7777
From one of my previous replies;
Put a piece of tape in the middle of the tread on both front tires (lined up with the hub). Draw a vertical line in marker on each piece of tape. Measure the distance between the two marks. Now roll the truck forward or back until the pieces of tape are on the back side of the tires. Measure the distance between the two marks. The front measurement should be 1/16-1/8" smaller than the measurement on the back (i.e. tires toed in).
__________________
-Chris
Resident Offroad Design rep
[email protected]
offroaddesign.com
970-945-7777
Last edited:
My measurements....
Front 70-15/16"
back up 1/2 revolution -
Back 71-1/8"
Pretty dang close......
Front 70-15/16"
back up 1/2 revolution -
Back 71-1/8"
Pretty dang close......
scooter122983
1/2 ton status
open it up and you should be good
yeah, that's probably spot on @ 3/16 toe in
you may have something else wrong then, but at least you tried tackle it on your own.
Can you tell us what the pinion angle or knuckles are at?
It may just come down to those adjusters and your camber. But we can do a few simple things before shelling out that cash to change shims.
you may have something else wrong then, but at least you tried tackle it on your own.
Can you tell us what the pinion angle or knuckles are at?
It may just come down to those adjusters and your camber. But we can do a few simple things before shelling out that cash to change shims.
Got it fixed!
I was just looking around today after pressure washing all of the underside grease and decided to grab onto adjuster rod running from the steering box to the steering arm and noticed the adjuster knuckle looked loose. I grabbed it and realized the alignment guy never tightened it up after the alignment! It was loose enough that the knuckle had a little wiggle between the threads too!
Well, tightened it all up and it's about 95% better. I'm so glad it was an easy fix!
Needless to say I went to the Chevy dealer to let them know their mechanic didn't tighten everything but the service advisers that helped me were not in (Saturday). I will definitely go and let them know about this potentially dangerous error the mechanic missed during the alignment. Pretty surprise actually.
I did get some tapered sleeves I was going to put in. But for now, I'm not in as much of a hurry because the truck drives so much better......
I was just looking around today after pressure washing all of the underside grease and decided to grab onto adjuster rod running from the steering box to the steering arm and noticed the adjuster knuckle looked loose. I grabbed it and realized the alignment guy never tightened it up after the alignment! It was loose enough that the knuckle had a little wiggle between the threads too!
Well, tightened it all up and it's about 95% better. I'm so glad it was an easy fix!
Needless to say I went to the Chevy dealer to let them know their mechanic didn't tighten everything but the service advisers that helped me were not in (Saturday). I will definitely go and let them know about this potentially dangerous error the mechanic missed during the alignment. Pretty surprise actually.
I did get some tapered sleeves I was going to put in. But for now, I'm not in as much of a hurry because the truck drives so much better......
FREAKING AWESOME
easy fixes are nice, unfortunately it only happened cause someone was a moron, what a waste of time. Good to hear though
easy fixes are nice, unfortunately it only happened cause someone was a moron, what a waste of time. Good to hear though
It seems like this is being called out both ways. Yes, the offset adjuster sleeve adjusts the caster. Yes, it adjusts the camber. In both cases, only by a little bit and changing one will change the other. They also prevent you from getting perfect preload on the ball joint. If you need more than a little tweak or can't get it right with the adjuster, then go with the spindle shims (camber) or spring pack shims (caster).
evolve991
Resident Problem Child
I just want to say THANK YOU to Jeff in CO and all who gave advice on this thread. I'll be using it for reference later this year when I replace the Autozone lower ball joints my wifes cousin put in last year and the uppers that he said were "gudnuffernow". The info on the bearings and locknuts will help this week when I replace ,again,the bearings that were tightened to a mind blowing spec of "purtnear purfick" and gave me the death shimmy @70mph on I95 recently.
Jeff if you haven't got the toe in done yet that can be done with the help of any framing or concrete buddy worth a crap with a stringline and tape measure. Thats about as professional as it got "down the holler" and for once the backyard method did work fine....as for everything else in this thread I get the pleasure of fixing everything I just read that they did wrong LOL
Jeff if you haven't got the toe in done yet that can be done with the help of any framing or concrete buddy worth a crap with a stringline and tape measure. Thats about as professional as it got "down the holler" and for once the backyard method did work fine....as for everything else in this thread I get the pleasure of fixing everything I just read that they did wrong LOL
No problem at all. I tried to post as many pics as possible because they really do help understand things.
My further thoughts:
When you put the front axle shafts back in, assume you need to pull the diff cover and change the fluid. This way you can be sure you didn't pick up any foreign dirt on re-assembly.
When you "rent" a ball joint press, find someone that has the "big" set. A set that includes like, 12 or 15 pieces that include some that have a cut-out so the steering arm doesn't have to be removed. I found one at Oreilly's.
You need to loosen the ball joints before you can unscrew the sleeve in the upper ball joint.
Good luck!
My further thoughts:
When you put the front axle shafts back in, assume you need to pull the diff cover and change the fluid. This way you can be sure you didn't pick up any foreign dirt on re-assembly.
When you "rent" a ball joint press, find someone that has the "big" set. A set that includes like, 12 or 15 pieces that include some that have a cut-out so the steering arm doesn't have to be removed. I found one at Oreilly's.
You need to loosen the ball joints before you can unscrew the sleeve in the upper ball joint.
Good luck!
Anubis8472
Newbie
I know you figured this out already, but my father taught me this trick.
Get a sledge hammer and hit the HOUSING that the ball joint is sitting in, on the side, as hard as you can about 3-4 times. You don't want to hit the ball joint itself.
What happens is something like the shock from hitting it breaks the ball joint free. Because the housing is rock solid, you won't damage it like hitting the ball joint.
When I do this the ball joint literally falls out in about 3 seconds. My friends are always amazed when they see me do this for the first time.
That's the right idea.
Best way to do it is to strike it on opposite sides simultaneously.
It does exactly that 'shocks' the tapered fitting and the joint just drops out.
Anubis8472
Newbie
So I could use the two tapered washers to adjust the camber? These are place just under the kingpin nut on the upper balljoint, correct? I would place the washers so that both sides go out ever so slighly (thicker part of washer toward the inside of each wheel).
In actuality, do the final numbers look that bad? I'm just wondering why originally there was a tapered sleeve in there to begin with....
Aren't the tapered washers supposed to go under your steering arm nuts?
Should be steering arm-tapered washers-locknuts.
I wish this link still worked. Im fixing to do this job myself. Never done it before.
