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Engine builders, please check in - update block is NFG

seriously, if youre buying heads. go to the junkyard, get a set of R code vortecs, or buy them brand new. probably around 800-900 for the pair. flow like stink at low lift, and produce over 400hp without breaking a sweat.

id be curious to see the numbers from above with vortec heads. probably not as much peak power, but id wager a flatter torque curve.
 
Ok so I made a few phone calls today to a couple local machine shops. It seems like to get the crank machined and cylinders bored/honed I'm looking at spending $680 or more. :eek1: I didn't realize machining would be so much.

I'm thinking a crate engine is looking more and more like the better option...
 
Chevy305 said:
Is that why they cost more than anything else, because they are cnc machined?

4x4High: what did you think of the AFR Eliminators?
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If you mean cost more than any other available head in the market it's probably because they are THE BEST flowing head you can buy anywhere. I bought the 918 head which is the 180cc Eliminator head with a 65cc combustion chamber and angle plugs and i love them. They are FULLY 100% CNC ported and use an undercut stainless 5/16" stem valve.

I just finished up building a 383 stroker engine for a customer using the 195cc Eliminator heads with a full roller valve train and i can't wait to see what this does for his 55 Chevy.
 
K5dreamer said:
seriously, if youre buying heads. go to the junkyard, get a set of R code vortecs, or buy them brand new. probably around 800-900 for the pair. flow like stink at low lift, and produce over 400hp without breaking a sweat.

id be curious to see the numbers from above with vortec heads. probably not as much peak power, but id wager a flatter torque curve.
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You can get new assembled vortecs with a thicker deck then stock (apparently the stockers like to crack) for around 400-450 on ebay.

The AFR's will walk all over vortecs. I don't want to wait for my laptop to start up to get the screen shot's from DD but I tinkered around with a bunch of different heads for my theoretical boat motor build and vortecs make good power but the AFR's have them beat... from low lift to peak.

I think trick flow would be next in line...
 
Slapperbar said:
Did trick flow fix their valve guide problem? i.e.(e.g.?) they wore out really fast.
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Someone was saying that they are an el-cheapo brand and dont flow as well as they should for the price. I kinda wanted to steer away from them.


But is $680 a good machining price for a bore and hone with the crank journal ground?
 
Chevy305 said:
But is $680 a good machining price for a bore and hone with the crank journal ground?
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No! That is a terrible price. Unfortunately I don't know anyone up in your neck of the woods. I would think $500-$525 would be a decent just walk in the door price for anything around here. But it just may be more up there. I dunno.
Fabrimicator, you say boat and you are talking my language. What boat?
 
Chevy305 said:
Someone was saying that they are an el-cheapo brand and dont flow as well as they should for the price. I kinda wanted to steer away from them.


But is $680 a good machining price for a bore and hone with the crank journal ground?
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I have no idea on the valve guides but I saw a engine build-off on hot rod tv(or one of those shows) where they took four wyotech students and had them build motors.... one team used AFR's and the other used trick flows. The guys that used trick flows won the competition on the dyno. I think one of the guys that used AFR's fubared his cleanup/port job on the afr's though.... to be honest I thought they didn't need any cleanup.... they are cnc ported.

As far as maching goes, call franklin auto parts and get a quote. They gave me a real cheap price for having some heads ported and decked.

I'm sort of wondering why your numbers are higher then the ones I got off desktop dyno. Are you sure you weren't getting numbers from a roller motor?

That being said a roller block would be a good investment. Could probably get one cheap (200 bucks or so) and it'll net you quite a bit more power. With AFR's and a roller cam/lifters you should see 430hp+ easy. The cam and lifters will be a little more but it's well worth it IMHO.
 
Slapperbar said:
Weren't the trickflows on a ford?
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Trick Flow heads are made for both Chevy and Ford although the original design was a "twisted valve" design which is still made for the Ford but not the Chevy. The Chevy version would eat guides within 1K miles or so, now they are a conventional valve arrangement on the Chevy version.
 
Fabrimacator21 said:
As far as maching goes, call franklin auto parts and get a quote. They gave me a real cheap price for having some heads ported and decked.

I'm sort of wondering why your numbers are higher then the ones I got off desktop dyno. Are you sure you weren't getting numbers from a roller motor?

That being said a roller block would be a good investment. Could probably get one cheap (200 bucks or so) and it'll net you quite a bit more power. With AFR's and a roller cam/lifters you should see 430hp+ easy. The cam and lifters will be a little more but it's well worth it IMHO.
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No the numbers I'm getting is off a flat tappet cam, I have been using the 262 cam not the 252 that you ran you tests with in the pictures you posted.

I thought I saw franklin auto parts in the yellow pages, how do u know about them? Are they some sort of a chain?
 
The cam that I ran WAS the 262.... I just forgot to change the name on the engine specs page.... but all the specs were off the 262. Basically you go in and set your specs (lobe center angle, lift, duration, etc) and it automatically spits out the numbers. It's not like camquest where you pick one of their part#'s and it enters all the data. That's why I'm wondering why our numbers are so different.

I've used camquest before and it came out 3-5hp different then DD everytime. Timing does play a role.... I had it set at 0* on those.... with a 660cfm induction.

Yeah franklin is a chain just like advance auto parts, kragen, etc. Not as common but they always seem to have the parts that kragen and autozone don't have and they have a full machine shop (usually).
 
Fabrimacator21 said:
I've used camquest before and it came out 3-5hp different then DD everytime. Timing does play a role.... I had it set at 0* on those.... with a 660cfm induction.
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I used a 750 cfm 4barrel induction. With a high rise dual plane intake.
 
I just recieved an email from Jegs with Patriot Performance Vortec 185cc heads for $629.99. I ran them again on the camquest to take a closer look at the numbers and they are pretty much right inline with others. I think this is how I am going to go because those AFR are sweet, but too expensive.

http://www.jegs.com/i/Patriot-Performance/723/2151/10002/-1


Also pictures of the engine, cylinder walls, and the front main bearing:

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NewTruckParts011.jpg
 
I just borrowed a bore gauge. Does anyone know the max allowable tollerences for elongation, taper, and diameter?

If this block is over the limits then I am going with a crate engine. Machining is too expensive in my area.
 
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