F.A.S.T. - Fuel Air Spark Technology EFI/TBI systems??

[smalltruckbigcid]

HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA!!!!

Yer my boy Blue! You made me laugh.

$4800 includes neither the vehicle, nor the engine....those are thousands of dollars each on their own.

I really need to switch to heroin so that I can start spending less on my hobbies...

I went to a job interview and they asked about a drug test. I laughed and said between scuba gear and my blazer I don't have enough money for that. The lady looked at me kind of strangely after that.
George

 

[Blue85]

It comes with a basic 3rd gen Camaro map. You put it into learn mode and run the engine. Keep it alive on the throttle for a minute or two. Now load that 'learnt' table into your emulator. It'll now run good enough to idle, then you can start covering other areas of the fuel map. Obviously, if your motor is so wild it won't even run long enough to get a learn you'll have to just open the fuel table and raise the numbers a little and try again, all very easy to do. It comes with a basic and conservative spark table and adder tables. Once you start getting a handle on the fuel table and it's running good with good BLMs across the board you can start messing with the spark tables. I barely touched my spark tables though. You can also use the EBL for nitros triggering, idle bump for OBA or welder, shift light, even an AE warning light to try for some fuel economy!

Just out of curiousity, what system is harder than this to tune? This sounds pretty standard to me, but the bulk of my experience is with Megasquirt.

 

[K85 Octane]

Bumping this cause it has a good title

I'm interested in the TBI, EZ-EFI kit.
http://atlanticspeed.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=6176&idcategory=172
It has the external fuel pump included with everything needed for $1,888. These are the only systems I've seen reviewed on TV. For me, since I have to smog the truck, would be the easiest system to remove. I have to go back to my carb for smog purposes.

This is the other kit, which simply comes with an "in tank" fuel pump.
http://atlanticspeed.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=7818&idcategory=172
I like this idea, but it costs more and I'll need to upgrade my fuel lines for the additional pressure. So not sure about this one. $2,090.

These are the FAST EZ-EFI kits now available. Not sure how they stack up to the other units. I'm not real interested in all the programming needed with other set ups, so this would be nice if it works better than my carb. Running only a mild 406sb, I don't see why it can't work.

Discussions please

http://www.fuelairspark.com/

 

[Z71paramedic]

I just received my F.A.S.T. EZ-EFI mulitport retrofit kit in the mail the other day I'm going to be using it with a TPI off a 91 T/A and it will be on top of a new roller 383. I don't have the motor yet and am waaay deep into the restoration of my truck but I figured I should order everything that will need mounting so I can drill holes now and not ruin new paint.

Anyways, I can't attest to how well it works yet but I can tell you it looks like some quality chit! I also got mine from Atlantic speed, they had the best prices I could find. And everything I have read about the systems make it sound like exactly what I want. Nothing too crazy that I have to do once everything is hooked up. I don't know much about tuning and figured this would be the best way to get me going. I'll be sure and let you know how it works once it's hooked up and running.

 

[buefchris]

For the price your looking to spend on these EFI set ups why not look for a low mileage LS engine swap thats C.A.R.B. compliant.
Thats the delema I was in. Couldn't see spending $2500 on a aftermarket EFI, another $1400 on a crate motor and another $1200 on a overdrive trans.
When you see low mileage 5.3's w/ 4l60e ,ECM and harness for $1300.
Now I didn't have to worry about smog but, a EGR and a cat on each manifold and 4 o2's is not too much to worry about.
Different Strokes

 

[cybrfire]

I have the FAST XFI in the blazer.

Massive ability to adjust. Maybe to a fault.

I'm only using a small portion of the capabilities it has. Once I get a couple issues worked out, I'll start turning more of the chores to the computer. Currently I have the fuel pump controlled seperately as well as the fans. There are alot of other things a guy could do with the computer to control things for you. There is enough adjustability in there for pretty much anything you want to do.

I would have to say the tech support I have recieved has been exemplory, the problem I have is not knowing enough to begin with and playing catch up on some of the terminology and understanding of how fuel injection works to begin with.

 

[BoondocK5]

http://www.mass-floefi.com/

 

[K85 Octane]

I think I read someplace that even the EZ-EFI system is tunable with a laptop if the standard computer isn't getting it done.

Buefchris: I'm already into a fresh 406sb. I REALLY don't want to deal with referees and smog here in CA. I can't see jumping the amount of hoops needed to do an LS swap. The upgrade wouldn't be worth the headaches. Maybe once I leave CA

 

[Chevy305]

The FAST EZ EFI system is on my list of things to buy this summer. I love my carb but its time I get with technology. Plus I know I can get far more performance out of my new 355 than with a carb thats relatively tuned by ear.

 

[folkenheath]

Bumping this cause it has a good title

I'm interested in the TBI, EZ-EFI kit.
http://atlanticspeed.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=6176&idcategory=172
It has the external fuel pump included with everything needed for $1,888. These are the only systems I've seen reviewed on TV. For me, since I have to smog the truck, would be the easiest system to remove. I have to go back to my carb for smog purposes.

This is the other kit, which simply comes with an "in tank" fuel pump.
http://atlanticspeed.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=7818&idcategory=172
I like this idea, but it costs more and I'll need to upgrade my fuel lines for the additional pressure. So not sure about this one. $2,090.

These are the FAST EZ-EFI kits now available. Not sure how they stack up to the other units. I'm not real interested in all the programming needed with other set ups, so this would be nice if it works better than my carb. Running only a mild 406sb, I don't see why it can't work.

Discussions please

http://www.fuelairspark.com/

I have that kit, works great for me. The self tuning has worked excellent so far. Download the instruction manual if you haven't already, and read that, you will learn a lot about the system.

So far I love it, it works great in all conditions, although I haven't used it in the winter yet. All the available live data in the hand held is neat too. And you can change the 3 A/F ratios (idle, cruise, WOT). I would do it again. Yes, the distributor is seperate, but once you have your dizy setup you don't need to change timing anyway. The injection is where 95% of the gain is because it works on inclines, bumps, etc. And it compensates for altitude and weather changes, and also self compensates for any engine modifications.

One thing I would say is, get don't get the kit with the fuel pump. Get kit without the fuel pump, and buy a walbro 255 lph fuel pump that goes in the stock TBI tank sending unit. If you want that walbro part # let me know. I bought the kit with the fuel pump and ended up returning the fuel pump and getting my own so it could go in the tank. It's more reliable that way because it cools the pump, and it's quieter too. Also, be sure to get a vacuum referenced EFI regulator for the injection. That's what the computer wants, although my vacuum line fell off once and the computer was able to correct for it so quick I barely even noticed it, until I found the loose vacuum line later and realized what had happened earlier. Vacuum leak, high fuel pressure, and no vacuum advance, and the computer still corrected it all and kept the engine running pretty well.

Also, if you want to switch back to a carb temporarily, mallory makes a nice bypass regulator for less than $100 that will drop the pressure of the injection fuel pump to carb pressures, you just need a return line as big as the supply (3/8" for each will work).

The EFI is great for performance and mileage, it' a like the performance of a double pumper with the mileage and easy running benefits of EFI.

 

[Smokinthehippies]

I think I read someplace that even the EZ-EFI system is tunable with a laptop if the standard computer isn't getting it done.

Buefchris: I'm already into a fresh 406sb. I REALLY don't want to deal with referees and smog here in CA. I can't see jumping the amount of hoops needed to do an LS swap. The upgrade wouldn't be worth the headaches. Maybe once I leave CA

just to throw this out.

if you upgrade to the same engine that is availalbe in a newer model year vehicle of your truck. (1500 series) its smog legal. because when that engine came out it adhered to stricter smog restrictions than the stock one from back in the day.

cant go backwards but you can go fowards. you dont wanna deal with smog but your willing to deal with removing your efi system every 2 years to go back to a carb?

 

[Blue85]

Your computer doesn't control spark timing?

 

[Chevy305]

I'll take that Walbro part number

 

[folkenheath]

Your computer doesn't control spark timing?

If you are talking to me, no, it doesn't. It's gets an RPM signal from the MSD box and that's it. ignition is completely seperate. Works perfectly though.

I'll take that Walbro part number

GCA758-2 Only $125, just get a stock TBI sending unit, and it will drop right in. If u look in my build thread you can see how I modified the sending unit for high pressure AN fittings, but not completely necessary if you use high pressure EFI hose.

 

[SUPER'BURB]

Don't know much about it personally but this guy was my neighbor for several years and he knows his stuff.

He really likes high-end mopar stuff but works on other stuff too. The guy is super cool and very knowledgeable.

Some of the rides he works on are insane, just check out the photos page on his site !

http://fastmanefi.com/

 

[Greg72]

Your computer doesn't control spark timing?

The new Holley EFI systems (Avenger, Dominator, etc) have integrated timing control built in..... Nice!

I got my MSD Pro-billet dizzy reworked by the factory and "locked out" the advance so that the Holley system has full control over it. Supposedly, being able to pull some advance out of the ignition during long highway trips will add 2-3 MPG. Since I'm only expecting about 7MPG most of the time, picking up a couple extra MPGs is huge for me....

 

[folkenheath]

The new Holley EFI systems (Avenger, Dominator, etc) have integrated timing control built in..... Nice!

I got my MSD Pro-billet dizzy reworked by the factory and "locked out" the advance so that the Holley system has full control over it. Supposedly, being able to pull some advance out of the ignition during long highway trips will add 2-3 MPG. Since I'm only expecting about 7MPG most of the time, picking up a couple extra MPGs is huge for me....

Although I think it is nice to be able to change timing with the computer, I think it sounds like a dream to gain 3 MPG by removing some advance. The vacuum advance actually does a pretty good job of adding advance under low load conditions, and you want to add advance, up to around 52 - 54 total degrees at low load cruise, to increase your mileage, not take out advance. That seems counter productive. Taking out a little advance at super high RPM through the traps at the dragway can add a little power though, but that's different than cruising down the freeway at less than half that RPM.

MSD pro billets are nice dizzys, excellent choice, and locking it and letting the computer control it should work very well. I don't remember seeing that part of your build where you bought the EFI?

With my EZ EFI I can actually change the "cruise" A/F ratio without a laptop while I cruise down the road, so I can increase my mileage on easy going road trips, and put it back when I get there.

 

[Greg72]

My bad, I meant ADD...

In either case, it makes sense to me to allow the EFI computer to control timing if possible. It has the most information about everything else going on in the motor, so it can optimize timing based on all of the other factors.

My plan is to pick up the "Dominator" version of the Holley system. It has the ability to control my 4l80E tranny as well, so it saves me from buying a separate controller. Again, I like the idea that a single controller (and a single set of sensors) can be programmed to give a more seamless integration of the engine characteristics to the shift profiles of the transmission.

The Dominator is a pretty powerful device, and you can set up different shift profiles depending on the application (soft shifting for comfortable shifts, full line pressure for drag-type brutal shifts)... It can monitor all sorts of attributes and you can program conditional logic to do tricky things. I printed out the full manual (about 300 pages) and have been looking through it as I have time. I haven't pulled the trigger on the purchase yet, mostly because I'm so far away from a running vehicle anyway and I'd rather spend that money on more important near-term parts & tools.

 

[folkenheath]

My bad, I meant ADD...

In either case, it makes sense to me to allow the EFI computer to control timing if possible. It has the most information about everything else going on in the motor, so it can optimize timing based on all of the other factors.

My plan is to pick up the "Dominator" version of the Holley system. It has the ability to control my 4l80E tranny as well, so it saves me from buying a separate controller. Again, I like the idea that a single controller (and a single set of sensors) can be programmed to give a more seamless integration of the engine characteristics to the shift profiles of the transmission.

The Dominator is a pretty powerful device, and you can set up different shift profiles depending on the application (soft shifting for comfortable shifts, full line pressure for drag-type brutal shifts)... It can monitor all sorts of attributes and you can program conditional logic to do tricky things. I printed out the full manual (about 300 pages) and have been looking through it as I have time. I haven't pulled the trigger on the purchase yet, mostly because I'm so far away from a running vehicle anyway and I'd rather spend that money on more important near-term parts & tools.

You might want to look into BigStuff3 while you do your research, John Meaney, the "godfather" of digitil fuel injection is the owner/brains behind it. He is the guy who originally wrote the Accel DFI and the Fast XFI systems, and now has his own thing going since 2003. He was helping Holley with the commander system in between there. Real big in the street/drag scene. It can also control a 4L80E, and not to mention, is the only system right now that can also control a coil on/near plug (LS style) engine without a seperate coil pack driver box. One computer does engine, trans, and coil drivers. That doesn't really help us big block guys(unless we convert to DIS somehow with cam and crank sensors), but it's nice to know. And yes it has complete spark tables as well for full timing control (only limited by the rotor phasing with a dizzy) as well as datalogging available without the laptop hooked up, it can save it right in the ECM for downloading to a laptop later. The real benefit of computer timing control comes with the DIS engines where timing is unlimited because there is no rotor phasing to worry about.

Might want to check it out before you splurge. But as long as they do what you need, you can't go wrong with BS3, FAST, Accel, or Holley.