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go fast trail / desert springs

I have been running the same road/trail up north in my K5 for like 12 years. I went from about 25mph to 35 mph when I ditched the EZ-rides for ORD/Alcans and "lift" shocks to 5150s. On a leaf spring rig, a lift kit is OK for mud, but is not right for high speed stuff. A shackle flip, custom front leafs, decent shocks and some air bumps or at least good bump stops are the cheapest way to work OK.

If you really want to move, you'll have to spend real coin.
 
I have been running the same road/trail up north in my K5 for like 12 years. I went from about 25mph to 35 mph when I ditched the EZ-rides for ORD/Alcans and "lift" shocks to 5150s. On a leaf spring rig, a lift kit is OK for mud, but is not right for high speed stuff. A shackle flip, custom front leafs, decent shocks and some air bumps or at least good bump stops are the cheapest way to work OK.

If you really want to move, you'll have to spend real coin.

Thats such a let down from bombing around in my awd wagon at like 50-60 mph all over the desert and mud and like 30+ in the snow.

I am still REALLY iffy on the whole shackle flip deal. I dont like how it locates the axle forward and it seems like you could gain more travel by running a longer rear shackle in the stock hanger.
 
Call ORD. I think you are trying to reinvent the wheel here. They have the full size stuff nailed. Sustained high speeds cost money. What you want to do needs more than 5150s and bumps tops. No matter what spring you run. Shocks get hot fast when worked hard, on a 5000lb truck going through most of their stroke.
 
i have deavers on mine now front and rear and am very happy with the ride over the lift that was on there.

yes they are expensive new but if you wait around for the right deals like i did you can do it cheaper.

i couldnt wait to find the rears however and ended up going with their f70 (meant for the rear of a 88-98 chevy) i added two leafs to compensate for the extra weight of the blazer and they feel great.

they will never be like links but once i get some decent shocks installed im sure the combo will be plenty for what i will do with it

edit- ive also read about some guys getting a 64" main leaf and re-arching with thinner s-10 leaves for a softer progressive ride for cheap... maybe something to ponder
 
Thats such a let down from bombing around in my awd wagon at like 50-60 mph all over the desert and mud and like 30+ in the snow.

I am still REALLY iffy on the whole shackle flip deal. I dont like how it locates the axle forward and it seems like you could gain more travel by running a longer rear shackle in the stock hanger.

I was just trying to give you an idea of the improvement I saw in a certain terrain by upgrading the leaf suspension, not talking about the limits of leafs.

Shackle flip doesn't move the axle forward much. Most people don't notice. You can put a longer shackle in the stock hanger, but the truck gets lower and the pinion angle gets bad. You just end up with a lot arch in the rear lifting with the tension shackle. You could always build custom spring hangers.
 
Would the Daystar stingers be a cheap substitute (I'm sure not as good though) for air bumps? I'm talking about these: http://www.daystarweb.com/productdetail.php?productID=1089

No. Ive heard they fall apart very fast and are not worth it. Your paying more than half of a decent 2" fox air bump, so dont waist your time imo. Ive heard timbrens may as well be had instead of those daystars, and at a fraction of the price. And timbrens will outlast most any bump stops you will find. Very quality product from reviews ive read.
 
You're not going to get Trophy truck speed out of a blazer or handling for that matter.

A good set of leaves that are custom designed for your vehicle will go along ways, the minimum shock you will need is the Bilstein 5150, If you want to go faster you are going to have to move into larger shocks 2.5" bypass seems like over kill but IMO that's going to be the end game for a set of leaf springs. Air bumps are going to help as well.

This is not critizm but I have to wonder what roads and terrain you are taking your AWD wagon over at 50 to 60 mph speeds that you think you won't be able to get a Blazer to go over at equal to or greater than speeds with the same or better ride?

Bottom line is that you need to be talking with ORD, I think you are only going to end up talking though cause what your saying you want is going to be larger than your average college kid budget.
 
I think it would be fun to see a graph of desert truck build costs....

X-axis: Desired maximum speed across the desert
Y-axis: Cost of components to build


I'll betcha it's a non-linear function that looks exponential after maybe 20MPH... :yikes:



-G
 
I think it would be fun to see a graph of desert truck build costs....

X-axis: Desired maximum speed across the desert
Y-axis: Cost of components to build


I'll betcha it's a non-linear function that looks exponential after maybe 20MPH... :yikes:



-G

And it's not always the cost to build it the first time, it's the cost to fix it. We are now going through a D60 gear set in less than 500 miles. **** gets expensive in a hurry when you start thinking about going through two sets of gears just to do King of the Hammers.

It's also funny to me that people think something is fast in the desert and then you show them what running in the desert is really like, it's not all whoops and top speed in a line, it's little tiny drag races between brake checks.
 
I run ORDs shackle flip and 6in shackle and maybe it moved the axle an inch forward at ride height, but remember when it compresses the axle moves rearward a little bit too. And I have no ill effects of switching over, the only problem I can foresee with them is if crawling they could possibly get hung up as they sit lower in the rear, but thats just a guesstimate. But the difference in flex is night and day, I have lift springs in the rear, and used the shackle flip to remove my 4in blocks I also had, and it rides much smoother, and flexs all over from what it used to.
 
It's also funny to me that people think something is fast in the desert and then you show them what running in the desert is really like, it's not all whoops and top speed in a line, it's little tiny drag races between brake checks.

Quoted for truth!!!!!!!
 
I think it would be fun to see a graph of desert truck build costs....

X-axis: Desired maximum speed across the desert
Y-axis: Cost of components to build


I'll betcha it's a non-linear function that looks exponential after maybe 20MPH... :yikes:



-G

I think that graph would have a few steps before it goes vertical, little plateaus where you can get a lot done with a reasonable amount of cash and where the hardware is very durable and re-usable in different systems.

I took a little trip down to the Baja to watch the race a couple weeks ago and ended up running a lot of race course with our '99 UAK2500, an 84 K4 on a TCI 3"/flip setup with 5150s and Fred Williams' 4WOR "cheap truck challenge" 'burb on a 4"/flip system with white body shocks. All of us got around OK, drove down there and back and had fun but I can tell you the custom leaf/King 2.5 shock combo on our K2500 was REALLY nice to have. We didn't ever make much speed over serious whoops but it's really nice to be able to handle washboard and small chop comfortably and over the long term. We put several hundred miles on the trucks on dirt over the better part of a week and the fade resistance on the bigger shocks was very apparent. I'm surprised the white bodies didn't puke while we were there and the 5150's were consistently hot enough you didn't want to touch them much less hold onto them. The kings hardly ever got too hot to touch. Keep in mind good quality shocks like King and Bilstein can run hot and not die since too hot to touch may not even be 200 degrees but the fluid gets pretty thin at that point and damping goes downhill if you don't tune for high heat, etc, etc.

You really need the good springs to get a good ride. You really can't damp a stiffer short travel spring enough to make it work right. Start with the springs and if all you can afford is a cheap shock you'll at least be able to enjoy the ride. From there it comes down to all the shock and bumpstop you can afford.

Our stock mounting point front springs actually end up at 48.5" long and typically run 10-11" of vertical travel. A set of 52's in the rear is going to do a little better, around 12-13" and a set of 64's in a tension shackle system will do 16-ish without too much hassle. I would recommend around 4" of lift to get the bump travel clearance and at this point the arch is not bad in a 64" rear if you keep the tension shackle. Handling is what it is but the only real way to improve it is to start linking things and in the front that doubles the cost. A crossover steering system is a good idea and it will have some bumpsteer.

Another "step" in the performance/cost graph is our coilover system (or similar) in front and the same custom leaf/2.5" shock rear system. This is one that I think works VERY well and is a point I'm really happy with several trucks. Handling, ride and overall travel are really good, durability is good and the next step in the go fast world is a bypass shock that's fairly easy to add. That said, the 2.5" coilover can handle way more than most guys will ever use and unless you're going to be spending a lot of time on race courses the bypass will be a waste of your money.

We also need to differentiate between "desert running" and "dune running". In the dunes you're driving more like a short course vehicle, bigger suspension events for shorter periods of time. Shock fade is probably not an issue for you in dunes. In the desert you could be looking at 50+ miles of rough dirt road and shock fade IS an issue. A smaller shock and good bumpstop could work for you in dunes, in the desert I'd take a bigger shock and no bumpstop if I had to.
whew, so much fun stuff to talk about here, I'll let this go for now.
 
You're not going to get Trophy truck speed out of a blazer or handling for that matter.


This is not critizm but I have to wonder what roads and terrain you are taking your AWD wagon over at 50 to 60 mph speeds that you think you won't be able to get a Blazer to go over at equal to or greater than speeds with the same or better ride?

Sorry. I didn't mean to come off as trying to be a bad a$$ trophy truck driver or anything. I just didn't want to dump a bunch of money into my truck and then be really let down with the ride / what I expected.:thumb:

As for the roads and trails I took with my wagon; obviously they weren't Baja 1000 type terrain or running over woops. However, I would regularly go up the main way to crown king (AZ) and do other dirt/sand/gravel trails like that and even do some mild off roading where I would scrape the bottom and sides of the car. I also would "hypothetically" run the roads at 45-60 as a comfortable cruise doing a long sustained speed. Over the really rough (for a car with lowish ground clearance) I would slow down a bit. Then it was pedal to the floor again. I also ran a couple of the prescott rally tracks in my car following my friends wrx. We did a max of 80 mph for several shorter bursts on the way to the spectating points.

Maybe I just am envisioning too smooth of terrain vs the speed you guys are talking about. I figured it would be mostly small rocks/gravel and some whoops. washboard roads with a few decent sized holes and stuff as being the high-speed roads.

Just for fun here are a few pics of me doing some mudding in my wagon. Unfortunately I lost just about all of my pictures. Most of the desert running ones we didn't stop or they were at night.

190256_1005551278877_4235120_n.jpg

196582_1005550558859_8029025_n.jpg

197922_1005551838891_8295315_n.jpg
 
It's also funny to me that people think something is fast in the desert and then you show them what running in the desert is really like, it's not all whoops and top speed in a line, it's little tiny drag races between brake checks.

Don't know how many times I have said that same thing to someone.
 
These kids... They learn everything from DVD clips.... And, YouTube.

They all think that prerunning, is hitting the whoop section at 75mph.
 
As far as dunes go, shock fade is a huge issue at our dunes. But we also don't stop for very long at at time.

My Ranchos are done after about 15 minutes of hard running. They need to cool down after that.
 
Our dunes arent all that wide open so its alot of short bursts.

I just want to be able to go alot faster over all the little bumpy spots..


Like in this video.If you listen, you can just hear my whole rig rattling like its gonna fall apart on all these tracks and ruts. I think the ORD springs, 7100s, and air bumps would take care of that no??? :dunno:

Its like this at the base of most hills, so bumpy I wanna let off the gas so I dont smash my $hit, then loose momentum sometimes on the bigger hills.


 
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I carry a temp gun with me to check them. Hotest they have been is 180. And the truck never shut off and probably never sat more than 1/2 an hour. 12 hour day. 2 tanks of gas.
 
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