Nah, it just made me late to the BBQ
CK5
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Trifecta discussion for BB12
- Thread starter kgblazerfive
- Start date
I would have been on time if I didn't insist on fixing it at camp before I came to the BBQ.
big pappa b
3/4 ton status
Shouldn't Trifecta discussion for BB13, not BB12?
That is all
That is all
What everybody needs for this run is, some of whatever this magic is that creates a new thread from an older one. It could keep all of the trucks going.
The Newby run on Friday was supposed to be the shakedown run for the new guys. No yard sale of broken crap there. I broke stuff this year too, though minor, still takes time. Plan on some breakage but really...?
3x I have run the Trifecta. 1st time, mine on 37s was the "little rig". We hit everything, broke a couple of hubs and shackles total 8 hrs
2nd was 3 rigs, which included a rather funny roll over off DW. Broken leaf on that roller. total 6 hrs
Best of which was 18 jeeps, half locked. Missed most of the obstacles, and like was mentioned above, less hammer more finesse. Not much experience. Total 9 hrs
Yes smaller groups will help, but we can't tell guys at tech their stuff is not ok to do a trail or to only run the Powder Puff run. Thats where Duane breaks anyway.
And his crap was all new
3x I have run the Trifecta. 1st time, mine on 37s was the "little rig". We hit everything, broke a couple of hubs and shackles total 8 hrs
2nd was 3 rigs, which included a rather funny roll over off DW. Broken leaf on that roller. total 6 hrs
Best of which was 18 jeeps, half locked. Missed most of the obstacles, and like was mentioned above, less hammer more finesse. Not much experience. Total 9 hrs
Yes smaller groups will help, but we can't tell guys at tech their stuff is not ok to do a trail or to only run the Powder Puff run. Thats where Duane breaks anyway.
And his crap was all new
Tried mandatory tech and fix in a 4x club I was in. Epic fail = don't try
However, maybe a "Drivers meeting" on friday before everyone hits trail. Within such meeting is the basic, if not obvious points:
Fill up (and carry extra gas if you have a gas sucking dog.)
Find extra drive shafts front and rear, plus ujoints to fix em. Required. Even a junkyard shaft spare is better than none.
Unless you are Stephen or Brandon types that race or have seriously wheeled the crap out of everything, hammer down is not your friend.
Winch means winch and 38s mean 38s. ( i bypassed Pritchett this year cuz of 37s, and I have ran it before)
No one is a Hero for flogging the same rock for 30 minutes. 3 tries or so and go around. Obvious exception apply where bypass sucks.
However, maybe a "Drivers meeting" on friday before everyone hits trail. Within such meeting is the basic, if not obvious points:
Fill up (and carry extra gas if you have a gas sucking dog.)
Find extra drive shafts front and rear, plus ujoints to fix em. Required. Even a junkyard shaft spare is better than none.
Unless you are Stephen or Brandon types that race or have seriously wheeled the crap out of everything, hammer down is not your friend.
Winch means winch and 38s mean 38s. ( i bypassed Pritchett this year cuz of 37s, and I have ran it before)
No one is a Hero for flogging the same rock for 30 minutes. 3 tries or so and go around. Obvious exception apply where bypass sucks.
The issues this year were somewhat avoidable. Trans line rubbed a hole in it. The driveshaft that kept separating, longer than stock springs in the front require a long slip shaft. Broken driveshaft tube, used the full throttle jump instead of a Moab bump. Running out of fuel...........well there was way too much idle time. Now the other ones, not so avoidable.
Now the funny part is the rigs that didn't meet the "trail requirements", specifically tire size (Jeep, Toyota, and stockish Blazer) weren't the reason for the really long day. They all took the lines that suited their rig, sometimes with a little coaxing, and had fun doing it.
The only requirements I think that should be implemented are (1) long travel springs = long slip shaft, (2) driving clinic or show that you understand the bump, (3) rear locker (front is a plus), (4) The second time you break a part you are pulled out. (if feasible) even if more spares are available.
I don't think big tires should be a requirement. We had two rigs on 33's and one on 32's and they all did fine, they just didn't follow the hardest line.
I don't think I should include my truck in the broken category. I didn't find it was broke until the next day.......
Now the funny part is the rigs that didn't meet the "trail requirements", specifically tire size (Jeep, Toyota, and stockish Blazer) weren't the reason for the really long day. They all took the lines that suited their rig, sometimes with a little coaxing, and had fun doing it.
The only requirements I think that should be implemented are (1) long travel springs = long slip shaft, (2) driving clinic or show that you understand the bump, (3) rear locker (front is a plus), (4) The second time you break a part you are pulled out. (if feasible) even if more spares are available.
I don't think big tires should be a requirement. We had two rigs on 33's and one on 32's and they all did fine, they just didn't follow the hardest line.
I don't think I should include my truck in the broken category. I didn't find it was broke until the next day.......
Newby
In regards to the trifecta run, I was the guy running the white Blazer on 33's. I truly enjoyed this run, even with the 17.5 hours! I enjoyed how everyone jumped in to help, when something went wrong. I have run Poison Spider 3 times, Hells Revenge 2x, Moab Rim with 33's, and no lift, Seven Mile Rim, Kane Creek, and Fins and Things. I don't consider myself a newby, but I certainly am not the most experienced out there. I signed up to do the trifecta in 2009, but I am glad it didn't work out. I would have been a totally unprepared dips***. As it was this year, I was only plagued by a weak front spring, that was trail repaired by bolting up the drivers side ot the sway bar. That being said, it was the most challenging trail that I have ever run. I tried to have what I would need, but I didn't have a front spring with me. I did have bullet proof rocker sliders, bumpers, and skid plate, which have very little paint left on them. The difficulty of Golden Spike, and Gold Bar Rim, were far greater than what I expected, or was told by the group. I went into it fat, dumb, and happy. Oh Crap! It worked out ok, and I don't think we held up the group too bad. I was able to drive all of the obstacles with only spotting help, including the "wall", at the end. I want to thank all those involved for allowing me to enjoy that trail for the first time. It was a blast! I think more education for those running the trail for the first time, letting them know what they are getting into, would be a great help. Comparing the trail, to what they have run in the past would be great. Sorry for writing a book, Thanks again, Patrick aka 500$k5
In regards to the trifecta run, I was the guy running the white Blazer on 33's. I truly enjoyed this run, even with the 17.5 hours! I enjoyed how everyone jumped in to help, when something went wrong. I have run Poison Spider 3 times, Hells Revenge 2x, Moab Rim with 33's, and no lift, Seven Mile Rim, Kane Creek, and Fins and Things. I don't consider myself a newby, but I certainly am not the most experienced out there. I signed up to do the trifecta in 2009, but I am glad it didn't work out. I would have been a totally unprepared dips***. As it was this year, I was only plagued by a weak front spring, that was trail repaired by bolting up the drivers side ot the sway bar. That being said, it was the most challenging trail that I have ever run. I tried to have what I would need, but I didn't have a front spring with me. I did have bullet proof rocker sliders, bumpers, and skid plate, which have very little paint left on them. The difficulty of Golden Spike, and Gold Bar Rim, were far greater than what I expected, or was told by the group. I went into it fat, dumb, and happy. Oh Crap! It worked out ok, and I don't think we held up the group too bad. I was able to drive all of the obstacles with only spotting help, including the "wall", at the end. I want to thank all those involved for allowing me to enjoy that trail for the first time. It was a blast! I think more education for those running the trail for the first time, letting them know what they are getting into, would be a great help. Comparing the trail, to what they have run in the past would be great. Sorry for writing a book, Thanks again, Patrick aka 500$k5
DickeysK5
1/2 ton status
One option would be to require (and check for compliance) participants on Trifecta to carry basic camping grear: food (lunch, dinner, breakfast), drinking water, rain gear, tarp, sleeping bag/blanket. If the group is not past the Crack by sundown, the group stays on the trail until sunrise. If there is a need for a "rescue" run, it can be conducted before dark or the next morning; lessening the burden on the "rescuers".
Should Trifecta be included in BB? Probably yes, but the decisions on what drivers and rigs can participate should be made by those willing to lead it and those willing to provide "rescue" support. No leaders and no "rescue" support = no Trifecta for those not willing to be entirely self sufficient.
Should Trifecta be included in BB? Probably yes, but the decisions on what drivers and rigs can participate should be made by those willing to lead it and those willing to provide "rescue" support. No leaders and no "rescue" support = no Trifecta for those not willing to be entirely self sufficient.
Jason4x4
1/2 ton status
You could literally hold a raffle for it, offer it on 2 days, with 5 rigs plus leader, anyone that wants to run this year, put names in hat, and 5 drawn get to run each day, then next year, those 5 are out for the drawing. keeps group small, and between the 2 days, you could split up the rigs to similar capabilities so they can follow the leader better.
Some good ideas and input to think about for next year. I didn't put the attention to it this year that I should have and I plan to come up with a better plan for next year.
Nobody will want to hear that let alone believe it. It's counterintuitive to getting psyched up for Blazer Bash, will be perceived as condescending and spoiling the fun.
As a potential trail leader, I would definitely not sign up to lead a trail that required camping equipment and spare drive shafts.
I mentioned Pritchett Canyon earlier, I knew not everyone had a winch, so I made the call that if you couldn't make it up Chewy, you weren't going on the rest of the trail. I also took all of the optional crap between the entrance and Chewy and watched everyone on those. By the time we made it up Chewy, I was confident that we had a good group that knew how to wheel in Moab.
The issues that came up were weird issues (fuel problems, broken brake line and failed tranny) that even a thorough inspection probably would have missed. The person that had problems on pritchett (fuel) bailed out and took the exit road once we finished. The tranny/brake issues happened towards the end of Behind the Rocks.
I mentioned Pritchett Canyon earlier, I knew not everyone had a winch, so I made the call that if you couldn't make it up Chewy, you weren't going on the rest of the trail. I also took all of the optional crap between the entrance and Chewy and watched everyone on those. By the time we made it up Chewy, I was confident that we had a good group that knew how to wheel in Moab.
The issues that came up were weird issues (fuel problems, broken brake line and failed tranny) that even a thorough inspection probably would have missed. The person that had problems on pritchett (fuel) bailed out and took the exit road once we finished. The tranny/brake issues happened towards the end of Behind the Rocks.
Why you always gotta be right.
Honestly every year we have this discussion, every year it's the same damn thing. I really do wish some of these guys would listen. It's not like we're stupid
The worst year in 05'? I slept in, ate breakfast and I think hit the trail with two other buddies around 11:00. We caught the group going into the canyon on Golden Spike. We got out around 1:00 am I think maybe a bit later. We did adopt a few jeeps along the way that were clueless, but the whole trip just was a pain.
Then in 10'? Was the year that Keith had the oil filter incedent. I was out and in town before 5:00 I know to get a few filters and some oil. FYI we were making good time that year for the lead group until the oil filter got a hole poked in it. Then I was back right at sunset to Keith with my brother. From the point that Keith was broken it was honestly 1 hr. for me to town and less coming back. Granted what I drive isn't you're average wheeler so I'm not saying the trail is a three hour deal but still it shouldn't take that long. That night I guided the group out off the GPS only while Keith went a whopping 2.5MPH the whole time, he never stopped and was at the back of the group but he never quit moving. Keith finished the trail with the group, that's right a wounded rig going 2.5 MPH from before the crack not only caught the group but maintained them in site and was in town with them at the end of the trail.
^^^That shouldn't have happened FYI.
At the end of the day it's a long trail day and I think we are taking rigs and people that need more time on shorter trails to figure things out. Driveshafts pulling apart, Moab bump etc. are things that you don't need to have issues with on that trail. Having them on Hells revenge not that big of a deal your less than an hour from town even from the furthest point.
This goes back to the famous threads, What do you need to do for BB XX. Everyone is thrashing for two months before hand to get their mods done so they can go to BB. What they need to be doing is driving the damn thing and using it. You would be amazed at what you find wrong with things just driving your rig every day for a week.
Quit doing mods and start driving
So my view of this trail.
The reason its such a big deal, as has been mentioned is the fact that your out there for a while.
Now from my observations running this trail multiple times, ( never have done a full run at blazer bash).
This is not a scenic everyone has time to get out and look. I have watched people get out at that little bump right after you get up the switchbacks. The one thats next to the cliff. They get out snap pics. What Brandon said is true invariably someone will need a spot on it although its a very simple obstacle and with the proper bump a nearly stock open open rig can do it.
When that happens everyone who was waiting gets out of their rig to take more pics. Then that person makes it. It then takes at least 5 minutes for everyone to get back in their rig.
I think you should be able to get out and take pics if you want but only on hard stuff, even the waterfall on poison spider takes 10 minutes longer than it should because everyone takes pics, but your rig gets parked way ahead so everyone has room to get up and take the pics.
If you are going to take pics you need to get back to your rig ASAP. In this age of email and digital cameras maybe we should have a Trifecta "exchange" everyone on the trail is required to send all their pics to everyone else. That may keep things sped up a bit.
I have bugged out of that trail twice, the first year our little group of 3 caught both big groups after sitting for an hour.
The only reason a small group should move faster than a big group is is drivers equipment or they just flat out keep moving.
In our case we had Kert ( basically first time on rocks) me ( my rigs alright) and my buddy Brent ( well setup). But we stopped alot for Kert still caught one of the groups a couple times. We decided to lick our wounds and head back.
Next year I lost a driveshaft on the waterfall. No big deal I know the trail well enough I bugged out. Which I would have done no matter where I was on the trail.
When I do go on that trail I make the assumption that I will be out there till the wee hours of the morning, the kids have pjs, we have plenty of snacks lunch and supper. Tons of water. I usually have enough tools. I realize that when I broke my driveshaft, I DIDN'T have the right size but come on are the bolts really that small on a 1410, if you have straps yes they are.
If the trail is going to be a success i.e. everyone get back to town for dinner, then you need to put an experienced guy ahead of any newbie, the person ahead spots for the person behind. CBs on and the trail leader telling everyone good spot for pics or not. EVERYONE listening to the trail leader. And simply when you are on the long flat spots or just the spots with alot of slickrock ledges ( boring) speed it up a bit.
Stuff is going to break but these could at least help speed it up a bit.
I don't think the trail is out of reach of the average BB attendee as I have done the whole thing in a stock samurai ( long story not my own lol) and got back just after 9 pm, we also had a decently large group because we picked up some Jeeps and Toys along the trail with us.
I agree with Brandon, get out and drive. If you know your rig you will have tons more fun overall in Moab.
I am not one for limiting trails because I cut my teeth years ago in a sami in Moab. That was back when no one thought a sami could even wheel. I was told many times that I would probably have to turn back soon but I could tag along. Never had to turn back except due to breakage
The reason its such a big deal, as has been mentioned is the fact that your out there for a while.
Now from my observations running this trail multiple times, ( never have done a full run at blazer bash).
This is not a scenic everyone has time to get out and look. I have watched people get out at that little bump right after you get up the switchbacks. The one thats next to the cliff. They get out snap pics. What Brandon said is true invariably someone will need a spot on it although its a very simple obstacle and with the proper bump a nearly stock open open rig can do it.
When that happens everyone who was waiting gets out of their rig to take more pics. Then that person makes it. It then takes at least 5 minutes for everyone to get back in their rig.
I think you should be able to get out and take pics if you want but only on hard stuff, even the waterfall on poison spider takes 10 minutes longer than it should because everyone takes pics, but your rig gets parked way ahead so everyone has room to get up and take the pics.
If you are going to take pics you need to get back to your rig ASAP. In this age of email and digital cameras maybe we should have a Trifecta "exchange" everyone on the trail is required to send all their pics to everyone else. That may keep things sped up a bit.
I have bugged out of that trail twice, the first year our little group of 3 caught both big groups after sitting for an hour.
The only reason a small group should move faster than a big group is is drivers equipment or they just flat out keep moving.
In our case we had Kert ( basically first time on rocks) me ( my rigs alright) and my buddy Brent ( well setup). But we stopped alot for Kert still caught one of the groups a couple times. We decided to lick our wounds and head back.
Next year I lost a driveshaft on the waterfall. No big deal I know the trail well enough I bugged out. Which I would have done no matter where I was on the trail.
When I do go on that trail I make the assumption that I will be out there till the wee hours of the morning, the kids have pjs, we have plenty of snacks lunch and supper. Tons of water. I usually have enough tools. I realize that when I broke my driveshaft, I DIDN'T have the right size but come on are the bolts really that small on a 1410, if you have straps yes they are.
If the trail is going to be a success i.e. everyone get back to town for dinner, then you need to put an experienced guy ahead of any newbie, the person ahead spots for the person behind. CBs on and the trail leader telling everyone good spot for pics or not. EVERYONE listening to the trail leader. And simply when you are on the long flat spots or just the spots with alot of slickrock ledges ( boring) speed it up a bit.
Stuff is going to break but these could at least help speed it up a bit.
I don't think the trail is out of reach of the average BB attendee as I have done the whole thing in a stock samurai ( long story not my own lol) and got back just after 9 pm, we also had a decently large group because we picked up some Jeeps and Toys along the trail with us.
I agree with Brandon, get out and drive. If you know your rig you will have tons more fun overall in Moab.
I am not one for limiting trails because I cut my teeth years ago in a sami in Moab. That was back when no one thought a sami could even wheel. I was told many times that I would probably have to turn back soon but I could tag along. Never had to turn back except due to breakage
Well as the event organizer; if we're going to keep running the Trifecta, what I'd love to see happen is to get someone that is willing to take this run on as their baby. Someone that I can count on being there every year. A person that is willing to lay down some ground rules, enforce them, and/or live with the consequences one way or the other. Tell me how you want to set it up, ie: inspections, rig requirements, limit number of trucks on the run, start time, meeting place, etc. I will back whatever play the trail leader wants to make.
Part of the problem this year is that we didn't really have a trail leader set up. Keith volunteered to do it sorta last minute. I appreciate Keith doing that, but I'm hoping if we're going to keep the trail we can make it a little better organized.
I still would like to make it to EJS and see how they get 25+ rigs through Golden Spike.
Part of the problem this year is that we didn't really have a trail leader set up. Keith volunteered to do it sorta last minute. I appreciate Keith doing that, but I'm hoping if we're going to keep the trail we can make it a little better organized.
I still would like to make it to EJS and see how they get 25+ rigs through Golden Spike.
big pappa b
3/4 ton status
they don't stop. I mean ever, unless there is a major break and then a small group usually stays behind.
I have friends that have done that and they whined about it too cause you just don't have time to get out and take pics.
Their trail leaders have probably done the trail 30 times or more. They have actually rules LOL
The trail leader just sets the cruise control and points the truck down the trail. HAHA
I wondered if they leave broken trucks to fend for themselves. Also with a full club for support you can have a couple of guys run through the trail at like 6PM and check on any stragglers I suppose.
