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2021.01.18 - !! UPDATE !! - CHRISTMAS FINALLY CAME....!!!!


It took more than a month, but the Christmas present for the MAW build finally arrived today from Mittler Brothers.

The English Wheel was a great addition to the shop and the capabilities for working sheetmetal, but the piece that I'd really been looking forward to finally arrived today.

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It's a bit larger than expected, but with the table folded down, it should tuck-away into a corner reasonably well. But for now, let's just keep it out in the middle of the floor and have a little playtime!!

As usual, instead of using a thin-gauge steel to get familiar with it... we went straight for it's maximum (16 GA, .060") since that what was handy. It's also the hardest to work with but ultimately the machine still handled it fine.

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First impressions of beadrolling..... It's harder than it looks, you need REALLY good lighting near the dies to see exactly where the touchpoint is so that you can make your turns accurately, and swinging the metal around a sharp radius turn is going to take a lot more practice (and a slower pedal speed in those corners). Totally fun machine though and I can't wait to experiment with each of the die sets to get more familiar with all of them.



The other big initiative was to use the new 49" tall jackstands to finally get the truck ALL the way up in the air and cycle the front suspension in ways that were not possible in the NH garage due to the low ceiling rafters. The main objective was to confirm that there were no interferences at full bump / full droop with the wheels & tires installed AND also check the full- lock steering at the same time. After a lot of effort and adjustments of the jackstands, the photo that had never been possible before was finally captured late Sunday night.... You can see that there is just a small amount of daylight under the drooping driver's side tire and that ORI strut is 100% maxed-out for travel.

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That was a pretty exciting victory and set everything up nicely for this morning. With better lighting, it was compulsory to get a least a few more beauty shots before starting the "full-lock steering" tests... The nitrogen had to be released from the passenger side strut to allow this articulation....otherwise it just kept wanting to lift up off the jackstands. (NOTE: The 2x4 in this photo is only supporting the weight of the axle housing and the wheel/tire.)

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Of course, it wouldn't be a proper build day in the MAW shop without some kind of weird setback.... and today would be no different. When it came time to start checking steering clearances there was some kind of interference almost immediately with only a few degrees of rotation of the steering wheel. It was something really SOLID and immovable and it didn't take long to look around and find it.

The brand-new rocksliders!!

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This was actually not THAT much of a surprise. They were built a little long deliberately so that they would provide maximum protection along the side. At normal ride height, they look like there's miles of clearance but from previous tests with the wide-swinging portal boxes the expectation was that some trimming would be needed to "fine tune" the length. As it turned out, removing 1" of DOM was all that was needed and then the knuckles were able to rotate all the way around to their steering stops. This basically puts the top of the tire completely inside the passenger footwell which doesn't show all that well in photos, but is crazy-looking when you see it in person.

You can kind of get a sense of it here...


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....and here.

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So, the rest of the day was spent trying to fabricate a new inner fenderwell that would not interfere with this crazy tire location but would also have a nice curve to it and provide much needed practice on the English Wheel. The hardest part of this sub-project is that (as you can see in that final photo) there is really almost nothing left of the firewall or floor to serve as an "index" to pull measurements from and most of what IS there is so sloppy and patchworked, that it's going to be cut out and replaced with new metal in the coming weeks too.

As with most MAW projects, the first side will probably take several hours and revisions and then once it's looking good it should only take a small fraction of that time to create the mirror-image version of that wheelwell for the driver's side. Then, it will be time to start laying down some new floors (with beadrolled details for strength!) and then probably a long fresh firewall panel and transmission tunnel.

It's a whole new set of disciplines to learn, so there is sure to be a good amount of "tuition pile" material stacked up in the corner, but really looking forward to the challenges and experiences of training myself on these new tools and processes.


-G
 
Only thing I see, but I'm sure you've planned for somehow is this clearance here... It may have a small gap, but rubber moves when your wheeling.. :dunno:

Screenshot_20210119-054043.png
 
Only thing I see, but I'm sure you've planned for somehow is this clearance here... It may have a small gap, but rubber moves when your wheeling.. :dunno:

View attachment 365804

Yeah.... I know. The cleanup of those steering knuckles is one of a long list of IOUs that have been written along the way in this build.

Those were the 3rd set built and at the time I was still using H2 wheels and thick spacers to get them mounted.... but knew that the custom white wheels were eventually going to replace them....and the final backspacing was TBD.

If you really zoom in on this build you will find TONs of fabrication that is still just “hot tacked” in place. In the early development phases when nothing was 100% certain it got really tiresome cutting out fully welded tubes just to move them 1/4” over.

Once the sheet metal and plumbing is done, it will be time to pull out the axles completely, put them on the workbench and do all the welding, and clean up those knuckles too.

-G
 
Yeah.... I know. The cleanup of those steering knuckles is one of a long list of IOUs that have been written along the way in this build.

Those were the 3rd set built and at the time I was still using H2 wheels and thick spacers to get them mounted.... but knew that the custom white wheels were eventually going to replace them....and the final backspacing was TBD.

If you really zoom in on this build you will find TONs of fabrication that is still just “hot tacked” in place. In the early development phases when nothing was 100% certain it got really tiresome cutting out fully welded tubes just to move them 1/4” over.

Once the sheet metal and plumbing is done, it will be time to pull out the axles completely, put them on the workbench and do all the welding, and clean up those knuckles too.

-G
:waytogo:
I figured there was more to do there. It didn't look streamlined or finished enough lol. Even the stuff that's temporary has been engineered to precision. The way everything forms together in that pic is awesome.
 
:waytogo:
I figured there was more to do there. It didn't look streamlined or finished enough lol. Even the stuff that's temporary has been engineered to precision. The way everything forms together in that pic is awesome.


Thanks! :waytogo:

There were a few small new "gotchas" that were discovered with this full-cycling test.

The driver's side header actually touches the ORI strut body at full droop. Never got 100% droop in the NH garage and a LOT of weird stuff happens in that last 1" of droop (as anyone who has cycled a link suspension can attest!).... so there's a small tweak required there. The pocket clearancing for the panhard bar through the driver's side frame is about 1/8" too small and the bar actually touches the frame in these photos.

Also, if you zoom in on the front-view photo you can see that the PHB is also starting to crunch the oilpan. This clearance was always REALLLY tight (like maybe 1/8" of daylight) but the motormounts appear to be settling and the engine is just low enough now that all the design margin has been lost. The motor mounts are something that I'm not particularly satisfied with anymore... both the design AND the materials used, so in the future I expect that they will be swapped out to a more traditional aftermarket (ORD-style) bushing and hanger setup... and when that gets done it will be important to remember to set the engine maybe 1/4" higher than it is now before burning the mounts into place.


-G
 
Something to keep in mind, as you are talking about close tolerances in suspension, when there is a load on any part of the truck due to "not level terrain", things move a lot more than when sitting static. 1/8" clearance will be gone instantly. And it might start self clearancing (is that a word?).
 
Something to keep in mind, as you are talking about close tolerances in suspension, when there is a load on any part of the truck due to "not level terrain", things move a lot more than when sitting static. 1/8" clearance will be gone instantly. And it might start self clearancing (is that a word?).

TRUE.

In a similar theme, I was encouraged to see that during the process of getting the truck up on those really tall jackstands there was virtually no "twist" torsionally in the frame....

In the old days (and something every 1st Gen guy already knows) if you jacked up the front corner of the truck, you'd only lift one framerail... the body & frame would twist like a pretzel and the doors would bind up and refuse to open (or shut) at all. This time around, both sides would lift up off the jackstands when I lifted a front corner... and the engine cage hasn't even been tied into the main roll cage yet. There's a LOT more overall stiffness everywhere in this frame / outrigger / full-cage setup and it was cool to see it proven out over the weekend... :waytogo:

There is no such thing as a perfect chassis, and there is no doubt that there will still be SOME twisting on a "real world" offroad trail... so it is good advice to put extra clearance everywhere you can.



-G
 
In the old days (and something every 1st Gen guy already knows) if you jacked up the front corner of the truck, you'd only lift one framerail... the body & frame would twist like a pretzel and the doors would bind up and refuse to open (or shut) at all.
Ain't that the truth!
 
Something to keep in mind, as you are talking about close tolerances in suspension, when there is a load on any part of the truck due to "not level terrain", things move a lot more than when sitting static. 1/8" clearance will be gone instantly. And it might start self clearancing (is that a word?).
That’s what @Bent77 and I were calling “humpage” haha
 
2021.01.25 - !! UPDATE !! - WIREFRAME MODELLING...

First off, I need to wish Charlie a happy 10th birthday today..... hard-core rock climber, football enthusiast, LEGO whiz and all around great kid.

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It's hard to believe that this thread was already going for more than two years before he was even born.... (and the truck STILL doesn't run! :) )
Maybe by the time he's 16....? :thinking:


The sheetmetal work efforts continue in the garage... still working to close up the gaping holes in the firewall and floors. Lately, I've been streaming a LOT of videos related to metal shaping and one of my favorites is this guy in Massachusetts.

www.youtube.com/c/proshaper

He handbuilds old Jauguar (XK120s and other 60's models) out of aluminum instead of steel. Using English Wheel and other "old world" techniques but with some really smart approaches to insure that the processes are repeatable and exactly identical to the original cars. Check it out sometime, and give him a subscribe and "Like"... :waytogo:


Had his ProShaper channel on for almost the entire day yesterday in the garage and used it to figure out how to best approach the footwell areas in the MightAsWell project. The clearance needed is a compound curve so that the tire can clear in all positions (up and down) as well as in full-lock steering. The only index available was the edge of the A-pillar where the tire clearance had already been trimmed-out.... so that shape was used to start making a wireform model that would eventually become the dome-shaped footwell.

First order of business was creating a simple bending tool for the 1/4" solid rod. This left over length of steering shaft from Flaming River was chopped up and welded together and worked perfectly...and the price was right!

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The concept is simple enough: You carefully bend wires to follow the precise shape that you need, spacing them apart by a few inches. Then you add the cross pieces that have the second curve of the part...stacking those up until you create a 3D wireframe model of the part. It took a couple of hours to get these wires bent.... it was a bit of a learning curve (#DADPUNS)

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Actually getting them into a 3D arrangement isn't all that simple..... started out using my trusty 3M Green Tape methods but with limited success... the whole thing was just too unstable.

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The creation of a wooden backbone allowed the parts to be anchored more rigidly... and this helped to get cleaner intervals between the rods and held them in place until they could be MIG'ed together.

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After several hours... the shape was ready for test fitting.

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It doesn't really show that well here, but the effect is very cool... the black gaffer tape holds the new pattern against the only "reference" index that the truck had... and the curve moves around the tire circumference perfectly, and curves the opposite way toward the framerail, ORI strut and headers. Of course, some of the wires had to be trimmed for clearance but tried to keep as much of the curve as possible to help with the future English Wheel shaping.

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The final shot (inside the passenger side footwell) starts to give a sense of how this part will be grafted-in to the firewall. The black construction paper is taped to the firewall sheetmetal and extends the plane of that panel down to the curve of the new footwell. As it approaches the exhaust collector, it will need to be cut away, and a new curved shape will need to be formed to protect that area while allowing the exhaust to travel into the torsion box area and into the rest of the exhaust system that is already built and installed.


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Pretty cool... It's not really "tuition" in the usual sense (where I build parts and then throw them away) but it was definitely a day where I felt like a student learning a new craft and went through all the awkward fumbling along the way. Ultimately, it felt like a really nice result for a hard days work... and it should be fun to extend the wireframe to define the remainder of the footwell area and then start rolling big sheets of flat metal into fun compound curves to fit these wires!!! :saweet:


-G
 
That's how my dad tought me to do it.

Then he would use a high density foam block based on that and fine form it to fit. Then shave it to 1 inch thick. Make the inner fender to fit tight and a floor side layer. Insulated and quiet. No one ever saw the work that went into his builds.
 

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