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76 CCDRW...Cummins noises

Overview Gallery Discussion
jltait said:
Dave,
Here is a link to the pictures of my '87 2wd crewcab. It was planned to be a build thread, but It really only turned out to be a brief overview with pictures. The truck was a 454/th400 but is now a 1st gen VE cummins/NV4500. I used a gm nv4500 and swapped input etc. to make it work with the cummins.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=461815

also here is a link to a thread that outlines the parts I used for the hydro clutch setup. I used a GM Master and Dodge slave with fittings I pieced together

http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/showthread.php?19010-k30-12valve-swap-motor-mounts

I am in Eaton Rapids, MI. so if you are ever interested you can come and check it out, I have loose ends still but worked the truck fairly hard in this configuration over the summer and am very happy with it. The truck moves effortlessly without a load. It could use a turbocharger upgrade, but otherwise I am happy. Right now the engine is completely stock other than a 3200 gov spring.
Click to expand...

The questions I posted previously to Jess about a Dmax swap, just wondering what kind of hurdles there is to overcome there too.
I am so stuck on wanting an auto though. As many problems as I had with the Maiden trans you would think I would shy away, but I'm still heavily leaning towards an auto. Of course OD would be nice too as with the Allison.

Thanks JL, looks like you have made some good progress with yours.
Do you have air and cruise on it? Was wondering about a cruise setup with a Diesel swap too. Whats a diesel use for cruise control?
 
Oh I see........ Dmax. Ok.

Cruise uses the dodge pcm and a vacuum pot.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
 
76zimmer said:
Soooo, being as you have one, and similar engine bay, what do you know of that might be any interference???
A/C compressor, pulleys, hydroboost, fuel lines, brake lines, etc?
Click to expand...


Don't see to many issues other than, intercooler location. But you would have to do that if you swapped the cummins in too. Brakes are still hydro boost on a dmax. The thing is dave if you can buy a complete donor truck you would tackle all the little things you want, ac, cruise etc. You would have a little wiring to sort out to get turn signals ignition etc worked out but the drivability of a dmax with the allison you can't beat, and with a small tune you would be at the numbers you want.
 
I think Maxxspeed or something like that stuffed a dmax into his blazer. I'll do some searching
 
Dave,
Cruise, A/C, and speed-o-meter are the "Loose ends" I have not completed yet. I believe the cruise control should be able to operate from the cummins vaccum pump using the original GM equipment. A/C - I need the mid mount brackets for a ford f600 or freightliner, speedometer is a matter of updating to the '90-'91 electronic dash speedo, or annother plan is to convert to 4x4 and drive the current speedo cable with the np205 I would use for the conversion. The 4btswaps site I previously linked has the details for getting these accessories functional. I have needed to use mine all summer so no changes since I got it functionaly in late May. I have been using a GPS for speedometer for now.

If you decide to go cummins\auto, I have an A518 (4 speed od auto) that was originally behind the cummins in my truck. I wanted a manual for mine. The auto will be easier than a manual, it should fit without a body lift. The A518 is also a tough tranny with a good converter.

I have had 2 Duramax GMC's and lover 'em, but cannont imgagine the cost of having an issue with one while out on the road when out of warranty. The cummins is such a simple engine to maintain, lasts, and make really good power. But a Dmax certainly would by far trump the Cummins in the "COOL" factor in my opinion. I am guessing at least a 2" body lift would be required for the Allison, just as I needed it for my NV4500.
 
DEMON44 said:
There are no pulleys, they're all serpentine. Ac compressor in stock dodge lowmount location, would very likey require notching the frame. If you put on a freightliner highmount bracket. It flips the AC comp above the alt and lowers the alt slightly. No frame interference. Hydroboost just needs conversion lines to the pump. Fuel lines just need rubber connections to suction and return. Put power to the starter, the fuel solenoid, and if its winter to the grid heaters. it will start and run just like that.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

The Dodge location of the A/C comp does require notching the frame. Mine was done that way. If I had done the swap, I would have not notched it. Eventually I'm going to fix that and relocate the compressor. Need to look into that Freightliner mount.

jltait said:
I have had 2 Duramax GMC's and lover 'em, but cannont imgagine the cost of having an issue with one while out on the road when out of warranty. The cummins is such a simple engine to maintain, lasts, and make really good power. But a Dmax certainly would by far trump the Cummins in the "COOL" factor in my opinion. I am guessing at least a 2" body lift would be required for the Allison, just as I needed it for my NV4500.
Click to expand...

What exactly required you to do the body lift to clear the NV4500? My jackshaft angles are off because I can't raise the tranny enough and I'm pretty sure that's what is causing my low RPM vibes. I was going to redo the crossmember to sit the motor lower, but a body lift would probably work too. Wondering if that's why you did the body lift?

<highjack off>
 
blazinzuk said:
He wants to be cool, besides your truck can barely beat Horton:whistle::whistle::haha::haha::haha:
Click to expand...

I don't feel very bad about barely beating Horton with my truck. You say Horton is a stock motor but I know you got some extra gerbils in there.

I wonder what part of that drag race the cops would have found funny?:whistle:
 
miniwally said:
I don't feel very bad about barely beating Horton with my truck. You say Horton is a stock motor but I know you got some extra gerbils in there.

I wonder what part of that drag race the cops would have found funny?:whistle:
Click to expand...

Whatever you need to tell yourself to feel better buddy:haha::haha:


I don't think anyone that was watching us would have actually recognized it as a drag race :D:D


Now back on topic. Dave the d max swap would be awesome, it has been done, but its a involved swap. I certainly think you could do it.

But I do think that you would have to modifiy the tunnel extensively to get the allison to fit, its a very very large trans.

Which would mean some sort of custom carpet and stuff too.

But the cool factor of that dually have a dmax and an allison would be off the chart
 
blazinzuk said:
Whatever you need to tell yourself to feel better buddy:haha::haha:


I don't think anyone that was watching us would have actually recognized it as a drag race :D:D


Now back on topic. Dave the d max swap would be awesome, it has been done, but its a involved swap. I certainly think you could do it.

But I do think that you would have to modifiy the tunnel extensively to get the allison to fit, its a very very large trans.

Which would mean some sort of custom carpet and stuff too.

But the cool factor of that dually have a dmax and an allison would be off the chart
Click to expand...

I think the only person that could tell was Keith and that's only cause I was giving him a 4" dia. cloud of diesel to breath:whistle:

D-Max/Allison combo in the old body style is way cooooooollllllll. Probably one of those swaps that would take time, money and then more of both to get done. The electronics might be intense but they're not hard most of the new stuff is so easy to work on it's unbelievable. In fact I would bet if you parked a wrecked but complete D-Max truck next to the duelly you could just about swap everything over, electronics and all. I mean interior, front rear everything. .
 
imiceman44 said:
No seriously that hill is brutal, I know from when I took the family in our 2003 honda civic, it even struggled.
Click to expand...

:haha:


...you say that like a civic is powerful...:wink1:


I vote Dmax for a tow rig, but cost might go out the window. If you could get a donor truck though, then you would have most everything you need I bet. My brother has one and my father has 2 Dmax trucks, they run well.
 
I can't tell you how intimidated I am by electronic systems, and the Dmax is full of em compared to a pre 98 Cummins right?...I really don't want this to get into a re-engineering feat to get a drivetrain into it. A Dmax/Alllison would be so cool, but right now I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around it. If it takes a bunch of wiring/dash/steering column/floor/engine compartment/fuel system stuff to be done, its boggling my mind thinking about it, and I don't want to get in over my head, or spend 3 years doing it. I want it to be an over the winter restomod. As I mentioned I'm pretty much a diesel retard....just don't have ANY experience with them, so the simpler this consideration the better. I envy you guys that would jump at the chance to consider putting a Dmax/Allison swap in. It would be a Royal Flush for sure, but right now I'd consider a four of a kind to be pretty awesome, and a stout BBC being a fullhouse!
 
Your best bet would be an older Cummins. I would also say a manual would be your best bet, but for some reason you don't seem to want one.

Martin
 
The VE pump Cummins only needs 1 wire to run (or zero if you put a cable on the fuel shutoff).

They fit in an older Chevy relatively well and they scoot around pretty good :thumb:
 
At the end of the day I think you will have the same cost in a BB build to make it work well Vs. an early cummins.

Honestly my vote would be cummins. Everything is out there and like Chris said it really only takes one wire to make it work.
 
fabjunkie said:
The Dodge location of the A/C comp does require notching the frame. Mine was done that way. If I had done the swap, I would have not notched it. Eventually I'm going to fix that and relocate the compressor. Need to look into that Freightliner mount.



What exactly required you to do the body lift to clear the NV4500? My jackshaft angles are off because I can't raise the tranny enough and I'm pretty sure that's what is causing my low RPM vibes. I was going to redo the crossmember to sit the motor lower, but a body lift would probably work too. Wondering if that's why you did the body lift?

<highjack off>
Click to expand...

Using the f600 brackets gets around the notching of the frame required by the stock dodge location. It mounts the A/C pump up higher above the frame rail. Go to the 4btswaps site I linked previously, there are write-ups on there for these brackets and other options.

As for the body lift, these truck use 2 different style floor pan humps, a high hump, and a low floor pan hump. The 4x4's and manual transmission trucks had high floor pans. The NV4500 is a toploader, similar to a SM465 so it has a similar height. Since my crew cab was a 2wd auto cab it had the low hump. So rather than cut out the floor pan and replace it on a completely rust free cab, I added a body lift which gave me the clearance I needed. If the conversion is to use a Cummins/auto or the cab has a high hump no body lift is required, or so I have read.
JLT
 
fabjunkie said:
The Dodge location of the A/C comp does require notching the frame. Mine was done that way. If I had done the swap, I would have not notched it. Eventually I'm going to fix that and relocate the compressor. Need to look into that Freightliner mount.



What exactly required you to do the body lift to clear the NV4500? My jackshaft angles are off because I can't raise the tranny enough and I'm pretty sure that's what is causing my low RPM vibes. I was going to redo the crossmember to sit the motor lower, but a body lift would probably work too. Wondering if that's why you did the body lift?

<highjack off>
Click to expand...

fabjunkie
concerning the driveline vibe, I had a vibration before I started my truck. when I completed it it still existed. Which made sense I kept the driveline angle the same, and never change my shafts at all. I can tell you it was a little better though, I attributed this to the harmonic dampener on the back of the NV4500. If I pull the outer duals off it smooths out pretty well, I am pretty sure I have some bent wheels, typical for duals. I have concluded that even a small amount of runout combined with dual seems to create a harmonic, or vibe.

There is a very informative J~ .pdf manual floating around on the internet that is very informative about driveline angles and U joint phasing. I used it when verifying the setup on my truck. this may help you in finding your vibe. I will try to find it and link it for you and others.
JLT
 
38377k5 said:
The VE pump Cummins only needs 1 wire to run (or zero if you put a cable on the fuel shutoff).

They fit in an older Chevy relatively well and they scoot around pretty good :thumb:
Click to expand...

VE pump has an internal solenoid. How do you put a cable on it?

A p7100 had an external solenoid that you can remove for a cable actuator.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
 
So the way I look at is


Build that 454, build the trans $$ :saweet:


Swap in a Cummins and heavily built trans $$$$ :saweet::saweet::saweet:

Swamp allison dmax from a donor truck $$$$ :saweet::saweet::saweet::saweet:
 
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