Thanks for the print... Have you spun the rotating assembly yet with this installed to verify it clears?
CK5
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MaxPF's 6.2 build
- Thread starter MaxPF
- Start date
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
Yup. Everything clears with room to spare.
I'll have to pickup another core 6.2L so I can see if I can modify the design to clear a stock pan... Looking at your pics I think something can be made to work.
BKinzey
1/2 ton status
Wasn't it the height that caused a problem with the pan? So if it was slightly shorter it would clear?
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
Well, the pan will even hit the outer studs, It barely clears the stock bolts...
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
Update: 12-15-07
I got a little bit more done today. Well, actually over the last couple days...
First, the oil pan is a no-go. I tried TIG welding it, and oil kept weeping out from between the sandwiched layers of metal and contaminating the weld
. I don't know if the oil is engine oul that somehow managed to get between the layers, or if the layers were coated with oil prior to drawing the pan. Either way it caused a lot of pinholing in the welds. I could probably go back over it and make it work, but I decided to fabricate a pan from aluminum instead. I will figure out what material I need tomorrow and make a metal run sometime next week (hopefully).
Fortunately, my other problem worked out fine. I haven't been able to get the proper oil bypass valves for the block. The part I got doesn't fit (it is for a 4.3 and, I believe, the late LS motors), but when you look up the proper part it gives that part # and says it supercedes all other part #'s. I probably could have got one from AMG or a rebuilder, but I already had a pair of these GM valves in my hand, so I modified a couple expansion plugs to adapt the 4.3 valves to the passages in the 6.2 block. It was actually quite easy:
The valve on top is one of the original ones out of this engine. There are 2, one to bypass the oil cooler and one to bypass the oil filter. They open at around 7psi, and are there in case of a blockage in either the cooler or filter. The one shown is the filter bypass; the cooler bypass is a bit smaller in diameter. Anyway, I just drilled and bored a couple snug holes in the appropriate sized expansion plugs, pushed the small valve in it, and then expanded out the slots to lock it into place. I tested them to make sure they worked fine, then I pounded them into place.
The smaller one goes into the hole closest to the crankcase. There is a step that stops it, so you can't drive it in too far:
Another expansion plug goes above it. The one that came out had a small hole in it. I don't know what the purpose of the hole is... to help purge air maybe? Anyway, I duplicated the hole in the new plug, since it won't do any harm (it will simply bypass a small amount of oil around the oil cooler and into the inlet of the oil filter), and it may actually do some good. I installed it, the oil filter bypass valve, and the threaded boss for the filter to screw onto:
Next, I flipped the block over so I could install the lifters. I got 16 new Sealed Power lifters:
Here's a sealed power lifter (left) next to one that came out of my engine:
Before I started installing the lifters I needed to dig out the retaining hardware and clean it up:
I could have used Brakleen and cleaned 'em up, but I decided to be lazy:
I slathered each lifter with Comp Cams assembly lube and popped 'em in their bores. I should note that some 6.2's (and possibly 6.5's) had .010" oversize lifters in some of their bores. Mine was not one of these, but it is something to check before you buy lifters:
While I let the mounting hardware soak I installed the alignment sleeves for the heads:
BTW, the alignment sleeves for the 6.2 and 6.5 are the same part # as the BBC.
I rinsed off the mounting hardware and dried it off. Much cleaner now:
When you put them on and tighten the retainers you need to spin the engine over and check to make sure the lifters aren't dragging and hanging up on the plates. If they are you can use a screwdriver to tweak 'em around a bit until the lifters move freely:
Here's a few more pics of the engine:
I should have a new set of heads showing up on Monday, and I also need to order valves. I also need to order head gaskets from Cometic - more on that later
I got a little bit more done today. Well, actually over the last couple days...
First, the oil pan is a no-go. I tried TIG welding it, and oil kept weeping out from between the sandwiched layers of metal and contaminating the weld
. I don't know if the oil is engine oul that somehow managed to get between the layers, or if the layers were coated with oil prior to drawing the pan. Either way it caused a lot of pinholing in the welds. I could probably go back over it and make it work, but I decided to fabricate a pan from aluminum instead. I will figure out what material I need tomorrow and make a metal run sometime next week (hopefully).Fortunately, my other problem worked out fine. I haven't been able to get the proper oil bypass valves for the block. The part I got doesn't fit (it is for a 4.3 and, I believe, the late LS motors), but when you look up the proper part it gives that part # and says it supercedes all other part #'s. I probably could have got one from AMG or a rebuilder, but I already had a pair of these GM valves in my hand, so I modified a couple expansion plugs to adapt the 4.3 valves to the passages in the 6.2 block. It was actually quite easy:
The valve on top is one of the original ones out of this engine. There are 2, one to bypass the oil cooler and one to bypass the oil filter. They open at around 7psi, and are there in case of a blockage in either the cooler or filter. The one shown is the filter bypass; the cooler bypass is a bit smaller in diameter. Anyway, I just drilled and bored a couple snug holes in the appropriate sized expansion plugs, pushed the small valve in it, and then expanded out the slots to lock it into place. I tested them to make sure they worked fine, then I pounded them into place.
The smaller one goes into the hole closest to the crankcase. There is a step that stops it, so you can't drive it in too far:
Another expansion plug goes above it. The one that came out had a small hole in it. I don't know what the purpose of the hole is... to help purge air maybe? Anyway, I duplicated the hole in the new plug, since it won't do any harm (it will simply bypass a small amount of oil around the oil cooler and into the inlet of the oil filter), and it may actually do some good. I installed it, the oil filter bypass valve, and the threaded boss for the filter to screw onto:
Next, I flipped the block over so I could install the lifters. I got 16 new Sealed Power lifters:
Here's a sealed power lifter (left) next to one that came out of my engine:
Before I started installing the lifters I needed to dig out the retaining hardware and clean it up:
I could have used Brakleen and cleaned 'em up, but I decided to be lazy:
I slathered each lifter with Comp Cams assembly lube and popped 'em in their bores. I should note that some 6.2's (and possibly 6.5's) had .010" oversize lifters in some of their bores. Mine was not one of these, but it is something to check before you buy lifters:
While I let the mounting hardware soak I installed the alignment sleeves for the heads:
BTW, the alignment sleeves for the 6.2 and 6.5 are the same part # as the BBC.
I rinsed off the mounting hardware and dried it off. Much cleaner now:
When you put them on and tighten the retainers you need to spin the engine over and check to make sure the lifters aren't dragging and hanging up on the plates. If they are you can use a screwdriver to tweak 'em around a bit until the lifters move freely:
Here's a few more pics of the engine:
I should have a new set of heads showing up on Monday, and I also need to order valves. I also need to order head gaskets from Cometic - more on that later
I have a 6.2 I got for FREE and this thread is making me want to build it!
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
Looks like a bit of a setback for the 6.2 project:
http://coloradok5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=223187
http://coloradok5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=223187
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
The latest...
After deciding the best (read: least expensive) course of action is to keep the aftermarket heads and fix their flaws I have started doing just that. They are actually not too bad - the main thing that needs to be addressed are the precups, but there are some other small issues that I will fix as well.
One issue is that several of the injector bores are so tight that it is nearly impossible to install the injector I fixed them with a die grinder and a sandpaper flapper:
The only other thing I need to fix is to remove some of the casting flash at the parting line in the pushrod pass-through areas. Here's some pics of the heads with the original precups still installed:
Here's a closeup of my old, slightly cracked three-dot J-code GM cups installed (I bead blasted the old cups to clean them up):
The valve job on these heads are actually quite good. I will need to have .005" taken off the heads with the surface cutter in order to seat the three-dot cups flush with the deck.
BTW, here is a little side-by-side (well, top-over-bottom actually) comparison of the 6.5 diamond cups and the 91 J-code 6.2 three-dot cups:
You can see the J-code cups have much smaller ports than the diamond cups. They will give a higher swirl velocity in the prechamber, which should give higher efficiency and better fuel economy. They are also made from much better material than the aftermarket diamond cups.
I also needed some BBC valve rotators. I can't use the stock 6.2/6.5 rotocaps since I am using larger diameter aftermarket valve springs. BBC rotators sit between the springs and the block, and they are larger in diameter, I scored 16 used rotators for $20 - a steal considering new ones are $15 EACH! They had some rust spots here and there, so I had to clean them up a bit. Afterwards I let them soak in some 30wt Mobil 1:
The owner of the shop was clearing out his old inventory. I was checking out stuff when I came across this:
It is a brand-new Racor 220 series filter assembly with a 2 micron filter that had been sitting on his shelf for a couple years. They are around $100 normally, but he gave it to me for $30
.. It has in integral priming pump to get the air out after a filter change. It can also accept a fuel heater if I need it. I think I got a pretty good deal on it
The only other thing I did today was order a pair of head gaskets. I was going to order a set of custom thickness gaskets from Cometic to get a lower compression ratio, but I decided against it. Lower compression means harder cold starting (in some cases, like cold+ high altitude which I find myself in during the hunting season, it can be next to impossible without a block heater, and there is no place to plug in in the middle of the woods). It also means lower efficiency, and hence lower fuel economy. Finally, the Fel-Pro 6.5 gaskets I ordered only cost $45 for the pair, while a pair of Cometics were going to set me back $250 
. Reduced compression is only really helpful if you want to run more than 12-15psi boost. I am going to stay around 10psi and 220HP, so I will be fine with the stock CR.
After deciding the best (read: least expensive) course of action is to keep the aftermarket heads and fix their flaws I have started doing just that. They are actually not too bad - the main thing that needs to be addressed are the precups, but there are some other small issues that I will fix as well.
One issue is that several of the injector bores are so tight that it is nearly impossible to install the injector
I fixed them with a die grinder and a sandpaper flapper:
The only other thing I need to fix is to remove some of the casting flash at the parting line in the pushrod pass-through areas. Here's some pics of the heads with the original precups still installed:
Here's a closeup of my old, slightly cracked three-dot J-code GM cups installed (I bead blasted the old cups to clean them up):
The valve job on these heads are actually quite good. I will need to have .005" taken off the heads with the surface cutter in order to seat the three-dot cups flush with the deck.
BTW, here is a little side-by-side (well, top-over-bottom actually) comparison of the 6.5 diamond cups and the 91 J-code 6.2 three-dot cups:
You can see the J-code cups have much smaller ports than the diamond cups. They will give a higher swirl velocity in the prechamber, which should give higher efficiency and better fuel economy. They are also made from much better material than the aftermarket diamond cups.
I also needed some BBC valve rotators. I can't use the stock 6.2/6.5 rotocaps since I am using larger diameter aftermarket valve springs. BBC rotators sit between the springs and the block, and they are larger in diameter, I scored 16 used rotators for $20 - a steal considering new ones are $15 EACH! They had some rust spots here and there, so I had to clean them up a bit. Afterwards I let them soak in some 30wt Mobil 1:
The owner of the shop was clearing out his old inventory. I was checking out stuff when I came across this:
It is a brand-new Racor 220 series filter assembly with a 2 micron filter that had been sitting on his shelf for a couple years. They are around $100 normally, but he gave it to me for $30
.. It has in integral priming pump to get the air out after a filter change. It can also accept a fuel heater if I need it. I think I got a pretty good deal on it The only other thing I did today was order a pair of head gaskets. I was going to order a set of custom thickness gaskets from Cometic to get a lower compression ratio, but I decided against it. Lower compression means harder cold starting (in some cases, like cold+ high altitude which I find myself in during the hunting season, it can be next to impossible without a block heater, and there is no place to plug in in the middle of the woods
). It also means lower efficiency, and hence lower fuel economy. Finally, the Fel-Pro 6.5 gaskets I ordered only cost $45 for the pair, while a pair of Cometics were going to set me back $250 . Reduced compression is only really helpful if you want to run more than 12-15psi boost. I am going to stay around 10psi and 220HP, so I will be fine with the stock CR.4x4_76
1/2 ton status
Lower compression means harder cold starting (in some cases, like cold+ high altitude which I find myself in during the hunting season, it can be next to impossible without a block heater, and there is no place to plug in in the middle of the woods
How about using coolant heater, like Espar:
http://www.espar.com/html/products/hydronic5.html
From my experience, block heater is not the best option. In very cold climates you'd have to keep it plugged for hours to give any help. I don't know how cold it might be in there, but here temerature can be as low as -22F, or even lower. I had to keep the block heater plugged for whole night if I wanted easier start in a morning.
I don't have one yet, but my brother has one in his 'Yota. Works great, only drawback is that if you run it too long, it kills your batteries.
This is other option over block heater: http://www.defa.com/doc/700/721.pdf
I'll be mounting that heater to my Suburban, but also Hydronic heater for times when it's impossible to use Defa heater, like on long trail runs. I'll also mount auxliary battery charger, so I'll have fully charged batterys all the times.
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
I like that hydronic heater 
Where I go hunting it seldom gets down to 0F. During the late hunts 10-20F is probably typical. These areas are also at higher altitude. A healthy stock-compression engine with working glow plugs will start fine, but a reduced compression engine would definitely have problems. Also, as I mentioned the lower compression would hurt efficiency.
The nice thing is that if I ever decide I want lower compression all I have to do is a head gasket change.
Where I go hunting it seldom gets down to 0F. During the late hunts 10-20F is probably typical. These areas are also at higher altitude. A healthy stock-compression engine with working glow plugs will start fine, but a reduced compression engine would definitely have problems. Also, as I mentioned the lower compression would hurt efficiency.
The nice thing is that if I ever decide I want lower compression all I have to do is a head gasket change.
original balzer
1/2 ton status
So if I understand correctly, that hydronic heater would somewhat be simular to a forced air convection heater**? But the coolant passes through the heat sorce? Is it run off the vehicles feul and elect. system?
If so, you would run this heater a few minutes before startup, correct?
** http://www.masterheaters.com/
Sorry so many questions but It gets COLD here and theres not always a place to plug in.
If so, you would run this heater a few minutes before startup, correct?
** http://www.masterheaters.com/
Sorry so many questions but It gets COLD here and theres not always a place to plug in.
4x4_76
1/2 ton status
Correct to all Q's
And you can run it like 20-30 minutes, depends on your batterys. I guess with Optima or Exide Deep Cycle 30 minutes is piece of cake. My brother had two 60Ah batterys, and 20 minutes was absolute maximum he could run the heater. Now he has two 95Ah's, and after 30 minutes, there is plenty of juice to start the diesel six.
original balzer
1/2 ton status
Sweeeeet! this should be stickied in diesel forum.
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
Espars and ProHeats are great. They're diesel fired. have their own coolant pump and fuel pump. just need 12v from the vehicle. A friend has an Espar on his truck. he can run it for 4 hours pre startup and have lots of juice to crank. He does plant shutdowns in the middle of no where and there is no option to plug in. As is most places in the oilfield. Actually just about every truck trailer unit has an proheat or espar. bigger, but the same, and they splice in to heat the bunk as well.
you can set the defrost controls with the truck off, and the espar keeps the frost and ice off the windsheild and the block warm. the timer controls are invaluable too. you can set it to come on at a preset time or at a preset temperature.
you can set the defrost controls with the truck off, and the espar keeps the frost and ice off the windsheild and the block warm. the timer controls are invaluable too. you can set it to come on at a preset time or at a preset temperature.
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
Max do you have any primary filtration set up for this?
I've got a remote primary set up from a 2000 series detroit if you want, with new filters. I have a bunch of sets kicking around. 20 micron primaries. put on framerail, pre transfer pump. no cash. just shipping to you. if you're interested.
I've got a remote primary set up from a 2000 series detroit if you want, with new filters. I have a bunch of sets kicking around. 20 micron primaries. put on framerail, pre transfer pump. no cash. just shipping to you. if you're interested.
That's quite generous Luke!
Max, nice to see the updates...it looks like it's coming together nicely!
Rene
Max, nice to see the updates...it looks like it's coming together nicely!
Rene
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
Not yet. How big are the filters you're talking about? Are they small enough to mount on the framerail of a K5 near the fuel tank?
DEMON44
Low-Tech Redneck
they are big I won't lie to you but the 2 filters are in parrallel and would last 2 years or more with the size of them...........
MaxPF
1/2 ton status
That's quite generous Luke!
Max, nice to see the updates...it looks like it's coming together nicely!
Rene
I'm working on the oil pan right now. I got a little kink in my cash flow because I just bought a Miller Syncrowave 200 TIG machine. I have been needing a TIG ever since my old man closed his fab shop and I no longer had access to his. The need to TIG the oil pan was all the justification I needed to finally buy one
Stay tuned - I will be doing my own valve job on the heads, as well as machining the mounts for the roller rocker arms. It's going to be interesting...
