What's new
CK5
Register an account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members.

76 CCDRW...Cummins noises

Overview Gallery Discussion
If faced with exactly the same decision this is how I would sum it up:

Somebody elses time and money and no time constraints - DMax/Ally

Using my own time and money : Cummins/47RH

Though if your decide Diesel is not your fuel of choice, and money/time flow aplenty I would consider a 2001 and up Vortec 8100.
There is Guy over at 67-72 chev site has a Vortec 8100/NV4500 in a sqare body, I bet one of those coupled with either an Allison or a 4L85E woud make a great tow beast too.
JLT
 
folkenheath said:
So you're saying you want him to put the Dmax in? :waytogo:
Click to expand...
:haha:

:waytogo:

Yep, I'd love to see a Dmax in a Square body Crew cab. There is one on Youtube pulling at a truck pull event, but I don't remember seeing any underhood pictures. I'll try to post the link if I can find it
JLT
 
PPE makes a Harness for swapping Dmax's in to older vehicles takes away alot of the wiring headaches
 
If you do go Cummins go Common Rail /48RE . the drivability and fuel mileage is much better then a modded 12-valve, not to mention the ability to change power levels on the fly.

Electronic Diesel are better for the same reasons as Fuel Injection is better then a Carb.

Edit: Painless makes a wiring harness for swapping Common rails.
 
If your into gas engines the GM 8.1 is a great engine. I owned an 01 with a 8.1 and an Allison and put 60k on it before I sold it. I loved that truck and the best towing gas engine out there.

Great thing is they will bolt right up to the existing mounts.
But.....they are very thirsty.

Just my info.
When my BB CC bites the dust that's what ill be doing. I have another tow rig so one gasser will be fine with me.
 
the 8.1 is a good engine with exception to fuel mileage, and Dart has come out with Aftermarket heads and blocks for them now too.


one thing about the 8.1 in a square body is that there are some frame clearance issues that need to be addressed
 
Keep it simple stupid


The ppe harness is $1200 by itself. Nevermind the cost of a duramax or commonrail cummins.

Let's have a little reality check here. Doing that kind of swap is going to cost in the neighborhood of 4-5 times what the truck is worth.


Do the mechanical cummins for a fraction if the cost. And have it swapped and running inside of a couple weekends.


It doesnt really matter if the 12v cummins swap has been done to death, its the right engine for that truck.

The choice is yours.




Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
 
DEMON44 said:
Keep it simple stupid


The ppe harness is $1200 by itself. Nevermind the cost of a duramax or commonrail cummins.

Let's have a little reality check here. Doing that kind of swap is going to cost in the neighborhood of 4-5 times what the truck is worth.


Do the mechanical cummins for a fraction if the cost. And have it swapped and running inside of a couple weekends.

The choice is yours.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
Click to expand...





Price and simplicity are the only thing that a 12-valve has going for it, the Electronic motors are far superior in a Driver/Towrig type enviroment.

For racing,sled pulling,ect the 12 valve may be a better choice but for a real world truck the Common Rail engines win out in my book

I'm not sure about where you are but up here the price differeance between a 12 valve and a common rail is shrinking at a rapid rate . We are seeing 12-valves go for about 4500-9500 with 300,000+ miles and Common rails in with under 200,000 for about 8500-10,000.

Junk yard prices are about the same up here expect to pay around 3000.00 for a take out cummins regardless if its a Mech. or Elec.

LB7 Dmax's can be had for about 7500 for the complete truck with and I've seen them go cheaper then that even depending on how rough the truck is.

And as I'm sure you know Luke the BEST way to do one of thses swap is to have the entire donor rig to rob parts from rather then trying to piece togehter all the components needed one at a time.

My next swap will be a 04.5-06 Common rail with an Allison behind it .
 
That sums it up about right Luke, the KISS principal is my friend, and if going Diesel, as I mentioned before, the overall complexity/cost of the swap will certainly be a factor. I don't want to throw 10K at a drivetrain only to drive it a couple thousand miles a year.
 
Gus cost are obviously different where I'm at, 12v donor trucks $2k or less. And common rail trucks don't ever dip under $10k.


Now I'm not talking about what's absolute best, or most efficient or wizzyest. It's about what's best for this '77 2wd pickup. That's gonna get driven 6 times a year. Zimm has also said a couple of times, that electronics are not his strong point. The right choice is a mechanical cummins. Buy the motormount cross member from one of a couple of places, hammer it in, and drive the son of a bitch.


Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
 
LOL once you go Diesel Zim your gonna drive WAY more then you think the power and mileage is addictive
 
12 valve is the simplest cheapest way to go for that I have no argument, But for best end result I'd have to still say go with a Dmax or Common rail the wiring isn't something that can't be overcome.

I think you selling yourself short on not being able to wire it up, from what I've seen of your work and attention to detail, I'm betting you could do it just fine.

All that being said it is your truck, I'm just trying to stir the ideas around .
 
Gus, I really appreciate the input, but yeah electronics intimidate me! Just something I haven't wrapped my head around. As it will be a tow rig 90% of the time, and not driven in the winter at all, I really don't want to wrap a bunch of money into it. Cool factor for a Dmax would be off the chart, along with a Detroit in there, just too cool to measure. I really want to stay down on the drivetrain cost, as I'm putting a decent amount of money elsewhere too. I'm sure the BBC will do what I need it to do, the Cummins and a overdrive would do it better, the CRD or Dmax even more so. I also need to keep this in a 9mo. timeframe starting next fall, and with a bunch of unknown's (to me at least) I don't want to fail on that timeframe. It will need to be ready to go to BB 2013, and hopefully be fully tested by that time.

So my wants for this truck are:
power in the 500-600 ft lbs gross output range.
Cruise control, auto trans, AirCond. and the standard stuff the truck already has on it. The cruise I have now is inoperative, the air isn't working, but the drivetrain in it seems to work great, with the exception of the oil consumption of the BBC.
The truck will get new bodywork and paint, along with a few mods, freshened up interior, and rebuild of the drivetrain as needed. And I'm sure it will snowball on me also. Seems like that's the way I do things.

The options I've realistically considered are:

454/T400/4.10's...what it has now, and the extent of work to them is unknown at this point. If the rear axle has a locking unit, it isn't working so that will need something done also.

454/T400/3.73's...same as above.


454/T400/4.10's/GV overdrive...same as above with the GV unit needing to be procured.

454/4L80e/stand alone controller/4.10's...with the 4L80 and controller needing to be procured.

Cummins w/auto OD trans/4.10's...engine and trans needing to be procured.

So with those options, I need to start with what work the engine needs to have done to achieve the power output goal I'm looking for, then weigh the option of a Cummins swap. If a Cummins swap is realistically the best bang for the buck needing to be spent, I would shoot for the 600 mark. If the 454 remains, the 500 would be minimum I would settle for. The engine right now stock is rated at 360 tq net, equaling about 420 gross. So not much to get to 500 would be needed.
 
I think you might just be better off building the 454, stroke it and put some better heads on it. 4L80E with a controller and good convertor would be nice, but around 2500-3000 .

Last time I checked Gear Vendors were right about 2000.00 plus driveshaft mod and TH400 rebuild so your close to what a 4L80E swap would be.

Have you considered a NV4500 ??? end price would be about the same as the other options but would be more efficent and stronger

An NV4500/GearVendors would be a wicked combo behind a nice BBC
 
yellowK20 said:
I think you might just be better off building the 454, stroke it and put some better heads on it. 4L80E with a controller and good convertor would be nice, but around 2500-3000 .

Gus I haven't checked the head #'s yet, but I'm thinking they are big ovals???
If I need to get into a re-piston/bore job, then finding a decent mileage Cummins might be the way to go. If I only need top end work to help the oil consumption issue (I'm thinking guides but it don't smoke???) then throw a cam, intake and exhaust at it, it might be good enough to deliver what I want out of it. Remember also I'm only at 800' and most of the terrain around me don't go above 1000' until I get over towards the Smokies range.

Last time I checked Gear Vendors were right about 2000.00 plus driveshaft mod and TH400 rebuild so your close to what a 4L80E swap would be.

Right, one thing I like about the 400, Its working real good, and I'm getting used to tearing them apart, and might even learn how to put them back together someday:doah:A few upgrades inside to take up to 600ft lbs isn't a big deal.
I would also be able to use the stock column shifter and linkage, so no makeup parts there. Throw a GV on the back, chop the driveshaft, make an additional crossmember and be done.
I don't generally trust a trans being used, so I would think a rebuild plus the controller would be like you said 2500-3K range to get it in there.

Have you considered a NV4500 ??? end price would be about the same as the other options but would be more efficent and stronger

An NV4500/GearVendors would be a wicked combo behind a nice BBC
Click to expand...

AJMBLAZER said:
He's anti stick.
Click to expand...
Not completely, just in this intance....:waytogo:
 
After reading the specs on GV, on a manual it only adds an overdrive, so not really worth the $2800-3300 depending on what tranny you have.
On an older 3 speed however the spread is so that you end up with a split in between gears, so you get a 6 speed out of a 3 speed.
Also with the auto, you can have the controler do the splitting so you get a full auto 6 speed.
With the manual it's not so nice, and in my opinion not worth the money.
I would go with an NV4500 or even 5600 if I can get my hands on one reasonably priced.
I am actually looking now, but in the meantime, I will be building the 4l80e I bought recently and will be using it fully manual, making my own switches to shift it.
I am still learning how but I recently heard that it's feasable.:dunno:
yellowK20 said:
I think you might just be better off building the 454, stroke it and put some better heads on it. 4L80E with a controller and good convertor would be nice, but around 2500-3000 .

Last time I checked Gear Vendors were right about 2000.00 plus driveshaft mod and TH400 rebuild so your close to what a 4L80E swap would be.

Have you considered a NV4500 ??? end price would be about the same as the other options but would be more efficent and stronger

An NV4500/GearVendors would be a wicked combo behind a nice BBC
Click to expand...
 
You can spilt every gear except low with a Gearvendors and a manual trans .I had one in my 98 cummins behind a NV4500 and it was great being able to split those long shifts between gears . and double over was nice because it had 4.10'sI've never seen one behind a TH400 but being able to have 6 gears automatically would be nice. but with out a Lockup convertor your leaving alot of mileage on the table .In my mind a BUILT 4L80E is the way to go ( if your wanting an auto)
 
yellowK20 said:
You can spilt every gear except low with a Gearvendors and a manual trans .I had one in my 98 cummins behind a NV4500 and it was great being able to split those long shifts between gears . and double over was nice because it had 4.10'sI've never seen one behind a TH400 but being able to have 6 gears automatically would be nice. but with out a Lockup convertor your leaving alot of mileage on the table .In my mind a BUILT 4L80E is the way to go ( if your wanting an auto)
Click to expand...

If you read on their website, they say that the gear ratios of most manuals makes it that if you put the overdrive, it's so close to the next gear and I think the only gear that can get an in between is the 3-4 shift.
You might feel it's enough to warrant paying $3k, I don't:D
I really want a manual tranny for my TD perkins, so I will try and get a 4500, 5600, or if I am lucky find me an old Medium duty frame and tranny 4+2 or 5+2
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest Posts

Top Bottom