These vertical welds were done top to bottom using that technique I recommended.
CK5
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'81 K5, "BlaZeus"- How to NOT build the ultimate budget K5; 3 & 4 link build
These vertical welds were done top to bottom using that technique I recommended.
Interesting. I don't have much experience, but in welding school we were taught to always go bottom --> top. We were told that if we went top --> bottom that the weld would look nice but not have much penetration.
I heard this statement at least in MIG class if not also in TIG class.
Would love to hear some reasoning for why this statement is wrong (or right?).
I believe this is more important with stick than mig/tig, especially with actual structural building steel. If you are welding stick, it is always recommended to go uphill so you don't get slag entrapments in the weld. I also believe that 1/4" is about the cutoff thickness for welding downhill with mig. Thicker than that and you want to go uphill if it is something that is going to see a lot of stress.
There is a LOT of debate about welding technique and you will find seasoned vets on both sides of almost any argument. I like to roll with what I have had the best personal success with.
There is a LOT of debate about welding technique and you will find seasoned vets on both sides of almost any argument. I like to roll with what I have had the best personal success with.
I was taught vertical down mig, vertical up tig and stick.
I push pull down, or do a pattern. Depends on the situation
Both welds push to pull. Vertical down, one the vertical down is a bit tricky to see but all I have on my phone
free picture hosting
I push pull down, or do a pattern. Depends on the situation
Both welds push to pull. Vertical down, one the vertical down is a bit tricky to see but all I have on my phone
free picture hosting
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I've never been able to get downhill to work for me, maybe I just run too hot... Have trouble keeping the pool from running. I typically use the same method as Greg, uphill triangles. I've always gotten better penetration with that method, shown by destructive testing of samples... Then again I'm very far from a professional welder... Took gas welding in college 12 or 13 years ago and taught myself the rest...
BlaZeus
The Real Mateo
Thank you all for your grace and encouragement you have shown me. It makes my heart feel good.
Interesting topic on vertical welding as it is something i have been trying to feel out new techniques and improve on as well. Thank you all for the useful tips and tricks. Any tips on welding upside down? I can never seem to figure this one out and always end up with some molten slag falling on me and burning through my pants or jacket.
Interesting topic on vertical welding as it is something i have been trying to feel out new techniques and improve on as well. Thank you all for the useful tips and tricks. Any tips on welding upside down? I can never seem to figure this one out and always end up with some molten slag falling on me and burning through my pants or jacket.
BlaZeus
The Real Mateo
Also, on the topic of welding, before I start cutting my precious tubing, I would like to get some tips and ideas on where i should add more triangulation/tie ins on my cage from the front seats back to the rear. This is requiring a lot of patience for me so please hurryyyyy.....lol jk....kinda
. But i was looking at Blazito, now under ownership of BJ Baldwin, and got some ideas for the triangulation of the rearward behind the back seats. Also, is there anyway that I can do this and be able to have a third row seat? I really want to try and do that. I think it would be so cool and set it apart from a lot of other blazers if I could pull it off. I also would love to take more than 3 people wheeling at one time. Took out the seats to get a fresh slate to work with so have at it folks. This way, if my truck breaks.......I CAN BLAME IT ON Y'ALL!!! bahahaha jk 
.....i am 
. But i was looking at Blazito, now under ownership of BJ Baldwin, and got some ideas for the triangulation of the rearward behind the back seats. Also, is there anyway that I can do this and be able to have a third row seat? I really want to try and do that. I think it would be so cool and set it apart from a lot of other blazers if I could pull it off. I also would love to take more than 3 people wheeling at one time. Took out the seats to get a fresh slate to work with so have at it folks. This way, if my truck breaks.......I CAN BLAME IT ON Y'ALL!!! bahahaha jk .....i am 
Do this
Also, on the topic of welding, before I start cutting my precious tubing, I would like to get some tips and ideas on where i should add more triangulation/tie ins on my cage from the front seats back to the rear. This is requiring a lot of patience for me so please hurryyyyy.....lol jk....kinda
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3rd row seat? In addition to the stock 2nd row seat? A 3rd seat is a pretty tight squeeze in a K5 (I've mocked it up, but never though it worthwhile for the tiny amount of legroom it would have). FWIW, putting a 60/40 bench seat in the front and running stock rear gives you 6 seats using common stock parts (looks like you would only need the passenger side if you wanted to go that route).
If you did go that route, I'd grab a rear seat from a 90s extended cab. Short seat takes up less room than trying to fit a full-size seat back there. If the cage tubing will allow (of course).
And then add this.
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If your pics are up to date you need triangles in the roof section. Also in the b pillar. If they can't wiggle around the bracing they don't deserve the ride.
Ok here is a few race trucks I found while looking for ideas. It's hard to see but it's kinda hard to find a backhalfed gm anything.. But basically I would try to box in the structure around the shocks first, one thing people forget is to add both lateral horizontal and vertical tie ins, the forces are not always in one or two directions.
Think big rectangle then ad V or /\ depending on if you have the axle landing or a tube landing at the point.
It's really hard to explain.. I'll dig more for pics.
This is a good example of the V idea, see where the bump stop is on the frame, that's a point of force, you want those points to be where the tubes converge, if you do not cope he tube properly for a tight joint you might as well not do it at all because you will compromise the strength of the cage. False security is the worst kind.
Think big rectangle then ad V or /\ depending on if you have the axle landing or a tube landing at the point.
It's really hard to explain.. I'll dig more for pics.
This is a good example of the V idea, see where the bump stop is on the frame, that's a point of force, you want those points to be where the tubes converge, if you do not cope he tube properly for a tight joint you might as well not do it at all because you will compromise the strength of the cage. False security is the worst kind.
BlaZeus
The Real Mateo
exactly what I was thinking
I don't have any stock seats. just 4 prp suspension seats. 2 up front. 2 in back. I have a 3rd row seat from a navigator that i made mounts for the third row out back,(pics earlier in thread), but it was huge and a pain to put in and try and get to fit. I was thinking about getting a bench seat out of a jeep, those are not wide and have a low profile, or just get 2 more suspension seats.3rd row seat? In addition to the stock 2nd row seat? A 3rd seat is a pretty tight squeeze in a K5 (I've mocked it up, but never though it worthwhile for the tiny amount of legroom it would have). FWIW, putting a 60/40 bench seat in the front and running stock rear gives you 6 seats using common stock parts (looks like you would only need the passenger side if you wanted to go that route).
If you did go that route, I'd grab a rear seat from a 90s extended cab. Short seat takes up less room than trying to fit a full-size seat back there. If the cage tubing will allow (of course).
For triangles in the roof section, do you mean like an X in the roof connecting all the corners or an X that makes triangles out of the corners and a square in the middle of the roof?
Also, are you talking about triangles in the opening of the doors? or triangles in the "windows" of the rear 2 hoops of the cage?
All of those lol.
The b pillar and c pillar on yours need bracing. This is what resists the cage folding in a hard side impact. Hard side impacts in prerunning are very common.
The b pillar is the hoop that goes from side to side behind the front seats. I base my cages off this bar. If that hoop holds up you can survive some brutal rollovers.
The c pillar is the last side to side hoop in the car. If you are carrying passengers this is just as important as the b pillar.
An x brace on these is ideal. But a half x or a \/ or any number of diagonal bracing is fine.
In the roof it's the same thing x braces diagonal bracing of any kind.
Squares are rectangles are weak sauce. Triangles are awesome sauce
But since yours is already welded together you might have to get creative with some additional tube gussets.
Dead nodes, which are tubes that end into another tube with no tube backing up the opposite side are bad.
It's all about spreading the load out.
Even with your cage supporting the body thing. The load was concentrated and not being spread out much.
Trust me when I say cutting off the frame will do zero for weight savings. You end up adding enough tube to make up for the frame.
Another thing to think about when your trying to lose weight. These trucks are nosr heavy. If you lose weight in back you actually might be making the truck worse. Pretty much impossible to get 50/50 weight distribution without major mods so putting as much weight in the back is good. To a point of course.
Adding weight for the sake of adding weight is not good
The b pillar and c pillar on yours need bracing. This is what resists the cage folding in a hard side impact. Hard side impacts in prerunning are very common.
The b pillar is the hoop that goes from side to side behind the front seats. I base my cages off this bar. If that hoop holds up you can survive some brutal rollovers.
The c pillar is the last side to side hoop in the car. If you are carrying passengers this is just as important as the b pillar.
An x brace on these is ideal. But a half x or a \/ or any number of diagonal bracing is fine.
In the roof it's the same thing x braces diagonal bracing of any kind.
Squares are rectangles are weak sauce. Triangles are awesome sauce
But since yours is already welded together you might have to get creative with some additional tube gussets.
Dead nodes, which are tubes that end into another tube with no tube backing up the opposite side are bad.
It's all about spreading the load out.
Even with your cage supporting the body thing. The load was concentrated and not being spread out much.
Trust me when I say cutting off the frame will do zero for weight savings. You end up adding enough tube to make up for the frame.
Another thing to think about when your trying to lose weight. These trucks are nosr heavy. If you lose weight in back you actually might be making the truck worse. Pretty much impossible to get 50/50 weight distribution without major mods so putting as much weight in the back is good. To a point of course.
Adding weight for the sake of adding weight is not good
BlaZeus
The Real Mateo
Super helpful! thanks!
Ah yeah this all makes a lot of sense for sure. i am a more visual learner but I think I am getting the gist of what you're saying.
If you were to make a rear frame that kicks up out of some 2x6 rectangular and slip that into place where you cut out, would add considerable strength and you then can dictate up travel..
One thing I am a bit perplexed about is how you felt there was not enough..
K5 blazers are unique because the frame kicks up in the rear unlike a truck where it is flat. Here is a pic with the stock bumps removed, and the axle stuffed in there, mind you the diff is touching the floor or very close so physically you are limited because your passenger buts have to go somewhere. This with a 35 inch tire is the absolute limit of what fits between the fenders with no trimming and no tubbing.. If you look close the gas tank is 3 inches lower than the bottom of the axle.. And the tire is more than halfway into the wheel well.. So if you needed more bump it would surprise me...
More to my point. Blazito didn't even loose the rear frame.. He just notched it 2 or three inches.. So basically what I am getting at is, it would be less work at this point and cheaper to stop and go find a junkyard frame.. Start fresh and do it right, trust me it's much less work ..
One thing I am a bit perplexed about is how you felt there was not enough..
K5 blazers are unique because the frame kicks up in the rear unlike a truck where it is flat. Here is a pic with the stock bumps removed, and the axle stuffed in there, mind you the diff is touching the floor or very close so physically you are limited because your passenger buts have to go somewhere. This with a 35 inch tire is the absolute limit of what fits between the fenders with no trimming and no tubbing.. If you look close the gas tank is 3 inches lower than the bottom of the axle.. And the tire is more than halfway into the wheel well.. So if you needed more bump it would surprise me...
More to my point. Blazito didn't even loose the rear frame.. He just notched it 2 or three inches.. So basically what I am getting at is, it would be less work at this point and cheaper to stop and go find a junkyard frame.. Start fresh and do it right, trust me it's much less work ..
Not perfect but this cage saved my life
No cage is perfect. But you gotta try to get as close as possible.
No cage is perfect. But you gotta try to get as close as possible.
Here is a good cage.
Not perfect but this cage saved my life
No cage is perfect. But you gotta try to get as close as possible.
Don't listen to this guy, his rigs a PoS.. Lol jk
I need to add some b pillar bars
