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Who has welded their axle tubes?

Welded tubes?

  • Yes

    Votes: 33 37.9%

  • No

    Votes: 25 28.7%

  • I weld naked and it burns

    Votes: 29 33.3%
  • Total voters
    87
I will probably weld mine before I put an anti-wrap bar on. My rosette welds are rusty so I am sure atleast mine did not get nickel rod:D.

I do think it is funny how new guys will argue welding processes and principles with Rene:D

Dik
 
I put 4 one inch beads in four equal areas on each tube and did each weld opposite of each other, more than enough to prevent it from spinning and didnt overheat it, which is when you have warping issues. I also have an upper axle truss tied into the diff cover
 
sandawgk5 said:
I will probably weld mine before I put an anti-wrap bar on. My rosette welds are rusty so I am sure atleast mine did not get nickel rod:D.

I do think it is funny how new guys will argue welding processes and principles with Rene:D

Dik
Click to expand...

I see this happening more and more around here. Keep in mind fellas that just because a guy is a new member it doesn't mean he has no idea what he is talking about. Many of us (not me) have tremendous fabbing and mechanical abilities before we joined CK5. You are not always an expert because you have more than 5000 posts and 2/3 of which were bullsh1tting in the lounge. Just a mindful thought fellas and feel free to flame away.
 
Wel I think Rene is a professional like does it for a living and really good and thats what the comment is from.
 
Big Blzn said:
I see this happening more and more around here. Keep in mind fellas that just because a guy is a new member it doesn't mean he has no idea what he is talking about. Many of us (not me) have tremendous fabbing and mechanical abilities before we joined CK5. You are not always an expert because you have more than 5000 posts and 2/3 of which were bullsh1tting in the lounge. Just a mindful thought fellas and feel free to flame away.
Click to expand...

I never assume someone new doesn't know their stuff. I respond when it's clear they don't, specifically in this subject.

If you were to search back through the 8 1/2 years I've been here you'd see that more than 2/3 of my ~25,000 posts have been helping guys out in the Garage, the 73-91 forum (before there was a Garage) and the diesel forum. That doesn't make my opinion mean any more, and it doesn't make me an expert...but it does make me someone that is willing to take time out of my day to help someone else out. It does not make me a posting whore, and you'd be very hard pressed to find any reply of mine with the word "pad" in it.

Regarding the welding/fabbing etc. I offer my advice and knowledge because this is what I do for a living. I have 22 years behind me, 40+ hours a week in a very broad variety of work. I've fabbed and welded a ton of stuff for Boeing (777, 787), Lockheed-Martin (Joint Strike fighter), Fairchild-Dornier (when they were still around) Gulfstream, Raytheon (Spy3) to name a few...and I've spent my time doing meat and potatoes stuff as well. I've certainly run into my share of oddball welding, dis-similar alloys, Cast iron, Cast steel, 4140 ,4340, Aluminum, stainless, even A2 tool steel, every grade of mild you could imagine, plate welding up to 6" thick plate, down to 22 gauge. I've done my share of structural, HSS, X-ray tested welding on alloy, worked to AWS code as well as CWB code for the majority of my career. Name a wire, or stick rod out there and I can almost guarantee I've used a few thousand pounds of it.

When i see someone recomending quenching a cast anything part after welding I feel the need to reply. When I see Ni-Rod being offered up I feel the need to reply. When I see someone flinging a bit of mud my way I feel the need to reply.

So, would you like the rest of my resume before it's OK with you for me to offer up welding advice...or are we OK now?

Rene
 
tRustyK5 said:
I never assume someone new doesn't know their stuff. I respond when it's clear they don't, specifically in this subject.

If you were to search back through the 8 1/2 years I've been here you'd see that more than 2/3 of my ~25,000 posts have been helping guys out in the Garage, the 73-91 forum (before there was a Garage) and the diesel forum. That doesn't make my opinion mean any more, and it doesn't make me an expert...but it does make me someone that is willing to take time out of my day to help someone else out. It does not make me a posting whore, and you'd be very hard pressed to find any reply of mine with the word "pad" in it.

Regarding the welding/fabbing etc. I offer my advice and knowledge because this is what I do for a living. I have 22 years behind me, 40+ hours a week in a very broad variety of work. I've fabbed and welded a ton of stuff for Boeing (777, 787), Lockheed-Martin (Joint Strike fighter), Fairchild-Dornier (when they were still around) Gulfstream, Raytheon (Spy3) to name a few...and I've spent my time doing meat and potatoes stuff as well. I've certainly run into my share of oddball welding, dis-similar alloys, Cast iron, Cast steel, 4140 ,4340, Aluminum, stainless, even A2 tool steel, every grade of mild you could imagine, plate welding up to 6" thick plate, down to 22 gauge. I've done my share of structural, HSS, X-ray tested welding on alloy, worked to AWS code as well as CWB code for the majority of my career. Name a wire, or stick rod out there and I can almost guarantee I've used a few thousand pounds of it.

When i see someone recomending quenching a cast anything part after welding I feel the need to reply. When I see Ni-Rod being offered up I feel the need to reply. When I see someone flinging a bit of mud my way I feel the need to reply.

So, would you like the rest of my resume before it's OK with you for me to offer up welding advice...or are we OK now?

Rene
Click to expand...

:D

Dik
 
tRustyK5 said:
I never assume someone new doesn't know their stuff. I respond when it's clear they don't, specifically in this subject.

If you were to search back through the 8 1/2 years I've been here you'd see that more than 2/3 of my ~25,000 posts have been helping guys out in the Garage, the 73-91 forum (before there was a Garage) and the diesel forum. That doesn't make my opinion mean any more, and it doesn't make me an expert...but it does make me someone that is willing to take time out of my day to help someone else out. It does not make me a posting whore, and you'd be very hard pressed to find any reply of mine with the word "pad" in it.

Regarding the welding/fabbing etc. I offer my advice and knowledge because this is what I do for a living. I have 22 years behind me, 40+ hours a week in a very broad variety of work. I've fabbed and welded a ton of stuff for Boeing (777, 787), Lockheed-Martin (Joint Strike fighter), Fairchild-Dornier (when they were still around) Gulfstream, Raytheon (Spy3) to name a few...and I've spent my time doing meat and potatoes stuff as well. I've certainly run into my share of oddball welding, dis-similar alloys, Cast iron, Cast steel, 4140 ,4340, Aluminum, stainless, even A2 tool steel, every grade of mild you could imagine, plate welding up to 6" thick plate, down to 22 gauge. I've done my share of structural, HSS, X-ray tested welding on alloy, worked to AWS code as well as CWB code for the majority of my career. Name a wire, or stick rod out there and I can almost guarantee I've used a few thousand pounds of it.

When i see someone recomending quenching a cast anything part after welding I feel the need to reply. When I see Ni-Rod being offered up I feel the need to reply. When I see someone flinging a bit of mud my way I feel the need to reply.

So, would you like the rest of my resume before it's OK with you for me to offer up welding advice...or are we OK now?

Rene
Click to expand...

speaking of welding shouldn't you be at work and not being a post whore on here?:eek1::D

Dik
 
sandawgk5 said:
speaking of welding shouldn't you be at work and not being a post whore on here?:eek1::D

Dik
Click to expand...

I took a couple of vacation days, so I'm off until Monday the 29th now. :D

Of course with nearly a foot and a half of snow I'm working harder shovelling and trying to get around than I would be at work...:doah:

Rene
 
tRustyK5 said:
I never assume someone new doesn't know their stuff. I respond when it's clear they don't, specifically in this subject.

If you were to search back through the 8 1/2 years I've been here you'd see that more than 2/3 of my ~25,000 posts have been helping guys out in the Garage, the 73-91 forum (before there was a Garage) and the diesel forum. That doesn't make my opinion mean any more, and it doesn't make me an expert...but it does make me someone that is willing to take time out of my day to help someone else out. It does not make me a posting whore, and you'd be very hard pressed to find any reply of mine with the word "pad" in it.

Regarding the welding/fabbing etc. I offer my advice and knowledge because this is what I do for a living. I have 22 years behind me, 40+ hours a week in a very broad variety of work. I've fabbed and welded a ton of stuff for Boeing (777, 787), Lockheed-Martin (Joint Strike fighter), Fairchild-Dornier (when they were still around) Gulfstream, Raytheon (Spy3) to name a few...and I've spent my time doing meat and potatoes stuff as well. I've certainly run into my share of oddball welding, dis-similar alloys, Cast iron, Cast steel, 4140 ,4340, Aluminum, stainless, even A2 tool steel, every grade of mild you could imagine, plate welding up to 6" thick plate, down to 22 gauge. I've done my share of structural, HSS, X-ray tested welding on alloy, worked to AWS code as well as CWB code for the majority of my career. Name a wire, or stick rod out there and I can almost guarantee I've used a few thousand pounds of it.

When i see someone recomending quenching a cast anything part after welding I feel the need to reply. When I see Ni-Rod being offered up I feel the need to reply. When I see someone flinging a bit of mud my way I feel the need to reply.

So, would you like the rest of my resume before it's OK with you for me to offer up welding advice...or are we OK now?

Rene
Click to expand...


Wow, fellas. I think you are right about Rene's experience, however, I made no mention of Rene or any other members in my post. If anything I was getting on Sandawg for his comment but my statement was (in my opinion) a fairly accurate generalization of what I see here. Obviously, Rene has great experience at the subject at hand but Rene's experience was never in question. (In doing so I got his complete resume). You other members made it the subject line. The member Sandawg was refering to may have many years of welding experience as well and his recommendation to weld may have worked many times over for his projects. I suppose my "blanket statement" was too specific and will be sure to be more clear next time. Fock, now I need to post up about members "generalizing" their comments too much. :wink1:
 
tRustyK5 said:
The housing is cast steel, no need for Ni-Rod. You think the factory rosette's are Ni-Rod? :rolleyes:

Pre-heat to ~200 localized at the tube housing area, weld, wrap...have a beer. 350 not only isn't necessary, it'll cook the bearings.

Rene
Click to expand...

The housings are cast iron, I have the material specs for the 14 bolt housings from AAM. The factory welds are not meant to adhere to the housing only the DOM Steel Tubes. The Slug welds are only there for back up anyways as long as you have the proper press fit you will not have an issue. I saw this in the snap clutch test. Over spec housings you would break the slug welds on in spec housing you would break a axle shaft
 
As far as I have found out the 14 centersections are either Gray cast iron (late model 14Bolts) and ductile cast iron (early 14Bolts). I don't know for sure but Ductile is still cast Iron, not cast steel. Again, I don't know for sure though. This is second hand info. Although Ductile is ofcourse weldable, Gray is not weldable as far as I know. Or I should say it can be welded but the weld will just fracture out of the cast.
 
1979jimmy350 said:
The housings are cast iron, I have the material specs for the 14 bolt housings from AAM. The factory welds are not meant to adhere to the housing only the DOM Steel Tubes. The Slug welds are only there for back up anyways as long as you have the proper press fit you will not have an issue. I saw this in the snap clutch test. Over spec housings you would break the slug welds on in spec housing you would break a axle shaft
Click to expand...

That would have been good info to post up the first time you replied. When I see a rosette poured in there with wire I 'assume' it's a weldable cast.

Rene
 
1979jimmy350 said:
The housings are cast iron, I have the material specs for the 14 bolt housings from AAM. The factory welds are not meant to adhere to the housing only the DOM Steel Tubes. The Slug welds are only there for back up anyways as long as you have the proper press fit you will not have an issue. I saw this in the snap clutch test. Over spec housings you would break the slug welds on in spec housing you would break a axle shaft
Click to expand...

That is, however, on a NEW axle housing.

Press fits wear out over time, most of us are using 20+ year old axles. People spin 14 bolt tubes all the time, welding the tubes up seems to eliminate this problem.

I mig'd mine, no preheat or post heat. Weld looked good, the metal didn't crack and I've no issues to date.
 
Just to add a bit of further info.

I have found that an OLD housing has had enough years to soak up dirt, grime and gear oil to the point that it becomes almost unweldable until all of those contaminents are removed.

I have the lower link arms of my buggy welded to the front Ford 60 housing. We followed the standard pre heat Ni rod and post heat with blankets with very bad luck twice. The link brackets literally broke off of the cast with a slight tap with a hammer the next day on the first try. The second try we had better luck but you could hear the cast fracturing under the blankets as it cooled off.
Both times as the weld was being layed you could see the oil and crap coming out of the cast housing.

The third time we ground, heated and ground some more on the housing to try to get all of the crap out of the metal. Finally with a combination of an overly aggressive pre heat, several different rods and peening the welds we have what I have beat the snot out of for 5 years now.
During all of this we really only changed the amount of preheat and added the peening in.

I became a firm beliver in the need to clean and heat the Cast to get it to release the oils etc. I really think that in the process of doing the first two sets of welds we just drew out all of the junk in the housing and also added a little welding rod into the cast metal mix which then allowed the the last go around to get in and work correctly.

Just my .02

edit:

I spun a tube on my 14 bolt a few years back. Not bad but I found it when I was washing it up after a trip. Several of the plug welds were just missing and the rest fell out with very little prying. I drilled a 3/4 hole or two in the cast housing on each side with a hole saw as well as cleaned out all of the other plug weld holes and had the Old Man do his overly hot mig plug weld routine.

The plug welds are only meant to make a shear pin of sorts attached to the metal tube and most likely will not ever stick to the cast housing.

This fix is and has held up to beating on it for a few years now.
 
all this chit chat about 14bolt welding.. i would like to do this to mine now, seems simple enough but my axle is fully built and under my truck, If i pull it out from under the truck and leave all bearings/seals in it. Welding it up with my mig welder wont bother anything inside?
 
stockk5 said:
all this chit chat about 14bolt welding.. i would like to do this to mine now, seems simple enough but my axle is fully built and under my truck, If i pull it out from under the truck and leave all bearings/seals in it. Welding it up with my mig welder wont bother anything inside?
Click to expand...

It will be fine, taking the weight off of the rear end is the biggest concern.

As for gear oil contamination, I really doubt the fluid will change or be damaged by the heat. Its up to you if you want to change the fluid at that point.
 
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